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Old 07-26-2012, 03:47 PM
 
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From what i'm hearing its already open borders with 50 million illegals already here and thousands more coming in everyday for free money and entitlements, Immigration policy? seems like the illegals have made their own policy..

 
Old 07-26-2012, 04:00 PM
 
1,922 posts, read 1,439,766 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
I don't know about a lot of hostility. I think most Americans want our immigration laws enforced. The hostility only comes from a minority of people who have a vested interest in protecting illegal immigrants.
You may be right. The media is like an amplifier for an already loud bunch, so sometimes it seems like more than it is.
 
Old 07-26-2012, 06:28 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,290,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
From what i'm hearing its already open borders with 50 million illegals already here and thousands more coming in everyday for free money and entitlements, Immigration policy? seems like the illegals have made their own policy..
50 million? Can you post up a link proving that? I've read more like 10 or 11 M illegal aliens in the US. Word has it they're LEAVING the US so it may now be under 10 M in 2012.
 
Old 07-26-2012, 08:18 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,012,769 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
It wasn't a strawman argument though nor an implicaton it was put in a question form.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
If you look at your own post #2 I think you will see the real strawman argument. The OP said nothing about moats, alligators, etc.
Someone doesn't understand the structure of a "Straw Man" argument...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg_IA View Post
NormalCarpetRide wrote - Pretty much open borders. It doesn't surprise me that someone posted that, but what do they mean by that?
But your comparison of their stance to whether they would defend foreign nationals renting an apartment every four years to vote in "presidential elections" is very much in the form of a Straw Man argument...

Let me show you, even when putting it as a question:

I prompt you on what sort of weather is ideal. You reply "I like clear, sunny days". My response is "So because it doesn't rain on clear, sunny days, you are fine with the famine and drought that brings?".
 
Old 07-26-2012, 10:55 PM
 
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
1,017 posts, read 554,032 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
A topic left open like this will inevitably work up to moats, alligators, electric fences (lethal and non-lethal), landmines, snipers, and sharks with laser beams on their heads...
Oh, I hope so!!!'
 
Old 07-26-2012, 11:05 PM
 
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
1,017 posts, read 554,032 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
50 million? Can you post up a link proving that? I've read more like 10 or 11 M illegal aliens in the US. Word has it they're LEAVING the US so it may now be under 10 M in 2012.
Look, we have heard 12 million illegals for the past 20 years. What with procreation, etc., I am sure the number is closing in on 20 million. You know as well as the rest of us that the US doesn't closely track illegal immigration numbers, or so it claims.

I would say that California alone has 10 million. And these illegal aliens are even more vocal about their "rights" than the generation that came before them who barged into our state illegally.

Frankly, the pro-illegal immigration community is as much to blame as the illegals themselves.

Illegals are supposedly LEAVING the US once they have depleted our resources?! Now that makes sense. But for everyone that goes home, there are 3 coming in to replace 'em.
 
Old 07-26-2012, 11:28 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,012,769 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie1004 View Post
Look, we have heard 12 million illegals for the past 20 years. What with procreation, etc., I am sure the number is closing in on 20 million. You know as well as the rest of us that the US doesn't closely track illegal immigration numbers, or so it claims...
No, we've heard of more, and less, than 12 million varying over the years. You do realize that even illegal alien + illegal alien doesn't "procreate" an illegal alien in the United States? The U.S. does keep closer track on illegal aliens than you think, and drafts an annual report (the most current: http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/s...ll_pe_2011.pdf).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie1004 View Post
...I would say that California alone has 10 million. And these illegal aliens are even more vocal about their "rights" than the generation that came before them who barged into our state illegally.

Frankly, the pro-illegal immigration community is as much to blame as the illegals themselves...
What source do you use to determine the illegal alien population in California, including in areas that you do not go yourself?...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie1004 View Post
...Illegals are supposedly LEAVING the US once they have depleted our resources?! Now that makes sense. But for everyone that goes home, there are 3 coming in to replace 'em.
Again, how are you sourcing that data, or is it just a guess?...
 
Old 07-26-2012, 11:49 PM
 
18,856 posts, read 30,463,066 times
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A comprehensive immigration policy...would have to include identification cards with computer chips for all legal citizens..and anytime a person went to apply for a job, purchase anything over $500, got pulled over, registered for college or rented a place to live...the card would be scanned for identification verification...if you don't have a card..those things are not available to you. And if you were pulled over for any reason ...and had no verification...immediate detention of mandatory 72 hours until your identity was established. If not a citizen..you are sent back to your own country...and incarcerated until that time. All minor children must also leave with you...regardless of their citizenship status...

No eligibility for any Medicaid, food stamps or public housing or social security benefits unless a legal adult over the age of 18 is applying...children are only eligible for benefits with a qualifying parent...who is a citizen. Regardless of their citizenship status.
 
Old 07-27-2012, 12:03 AM
 
1,825 posts, read 1,350,140 times
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Default I trust Gary Johnson on immigration

Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg_IA View Post
I would really like to know.

Unless you are likely able to support yourself, you don't get in.

Do you fill a need that we can't fill within? If not why should we let you in?

Have a criminal record.... you're not getting in.

Want to come in and start a business.... probably, depends on the business.

This is just a general idea of what I think we should do. There could be exceptions to the rules, but not many.


You raise some good questions. I trust presidential candidate Gary Johnson as 8 year governor of NM as he was seeing what was happening up close. There is a sensible middle ground.
 
Old 07-27-2012, 12:13 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,012,769 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper12 View Post
A comprehensive immigration policy...would have to include identification cards with computer chips for all legal citizens..and anytime a person went to apply for a job, purchase anything over $500, got pulled over, registered for college or rented a place to live...the card would be scanned for identification verification...if you don't have a card..those things are not available to you. And if you were pulled over for any reason ...and had no verification...immediate detention of mandatory 72 hours until your identity was established. If not a citizen..you are sent back to your own country...and incarcerated until that time. All minor children must also leave with you...regardless of their citizenship status...
Your national ID card idea treats U.S. citizens to a tighter standard than Legal Permanent Residents 18 years or older (failure to carry a Resident Card is a misdemeanor, and is not a removable offense). Especially with biometric data (which is part of the reason, and also to be harder to fabricate, that a Resident Card is over $400 to replace), your plan is going to go over like a lead balloon with many U.S. citizens. You didn't cover that cost in your comment (Resident Cards are renewed at a maximum of ten years, but the residency status itself does not expire).
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