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Old 04-14-2008, 05:21 PM
 
Location: California
1,268 posts, read 817,589 times
Reputation: 76

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocexpo View Post
I think someones inability to follow laws, and willingness to become criminals says a lot about their character.

I'm sorry, but saying "well, the thiefs I have met all have been nice" sounds ridiculous, especially when someone is a thief rights advocate. This is the same situation.

One thing is "breaking laws for the hell of it" and another thing is "doing it for a reason". I'm not saying their illegal crossing is justified, I'm saying they have different circumstances.

 
Old 04-14-2008, 05:26 PM
 
Location: OC, CA
3,309 posts, read 5,031,707 times
Reputation: 645
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exedous View Post
One thing is "breaking laws for the hell of it" and another thing is "doing it for a reason". I'm not saying their illegal crossing is justified, I'm saying they have different circumstances.
A robber broke into a house to take gold, money, and valuables paralyzing the family and causing them severe financial problems. However, the robber has a family of his own that is poor and in financial turmoil. Does that make his actions justifiable? According to you it does.
 
Old 04-14-2008, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,200,288 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exedous View Post
Are you making the generalization that all illegal immigrants are child molesters?
You already know that I was not insinuating that any Illegals were Child Molesters.

I said........some Illegals are nice and some Child Molesters are nice......but being nice doesn't excuse anyone from the laws they've broken.
 
Old 04-14-2008, 05:30 PM
 
Location: California
1,268 posts, read 817,589 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocexpo View Post
A robber broke into a house to take gold, money, and valuables paralyzing the family and causing them severe financial problems. However, the robber has a family of his own that is poor and in financial turmoil. Does that make his actions justifiable? According to you it does.
Re-read my post. Their crossing illegally is not justifiable. Breaking into someones house is definitely not justifiable and a terrible analogy.
 
Old 04-14-2008, 05:33 PM
 
Location: OC, CA
3,309 posts, read 5,031,707 times
Reputation: 645
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exedous View Post
Re-read my post. Their crossing illegally is not justifiable. Breaking into someones house is definitely not justifiable and a terrible analogy.
Hmm, I think its relevant. A robber steals from a family as does an illegal immigrant steals from the American people. Both a robber and an illegal cross borders that they arent welcome to cross. Both are thieves. Both are leeches. Both take from hard working law abiding citizens. What is the difference?
 
Old 04-14-2008, 05:35 PM
 
Location: California
1,268 posts, read 817,589 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocexpo View Post
Hmm, I think its relevant. A robber steals from a family as does an illegal immigrant steals from the American people. Both a robber and an illegal cross borders that they arent welcome to cross. Both are thieves. Both are leeches. Both take from hard working law abiding citizens. What is the difference?

Has it occured to you that not all illegal immigrants go to the hospital? that not all illegal immigrants get welfare? that not all illegal immigrants are violent criminals?! Or has the media done a damn good job in molding your mind like MTV does to Teenagers?
 
Old 04-14-2008, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,200,288 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exedous View Post
Has it occured to you that not all illegal immigrants go to the hospital? that not all illegal immigrants get welfare? that not all illegal immigrants are violent criminals?! Or has the media done a damn good job in molding your mind like MTV does to Teenagers?
Entering this country Illegally is a crime, what ever they do once they're Illegally here does not change the fact, nor does it make anyone any better than the rest that has entered the country illegally.
Your exceptions are unjustified.
 
Old 04-16-2008, 05:02 PM
 
2 posts, read 3,410 times
Reputation: 11
What many of you do not realize is that we as Americans are the ones that are setting ourselves to be judge and portrayed in the manner that this video portrays us. If there is anyone to blame for the Mexican immigrants having hostility towards Americans it is us, the citizens of America and our government. Ever since the first wave of Mexican immigrants came in during the early 1900s we have been using derogatory terms, calling them wet backs, fence jumpers, and in Spanish, mojados and many Americans have been assuming that they were and are taking jobs that should be for Americans. We are treating Mexicans today the same way the Irish were treated in the 19th century. We called them “white ******s” or “white slaves” and employers were known to threaten the jobs of Americans by replacing them with Irish laborers. Not only have we set ourselves up for hostility from the Mexican immigrants but also we have created a cycle where it is close to impossible for any Mexican immigrant to get ahead. During the 1900s people saw the Mexican immigrant population as a social problem and worked to eliminate what they saw as the negative aspects of Mexican American life. They did this by putting Mexican girls into sewing, cooking, and cleaning classes, and by putting the men to work in the fields. From that point forward, the new Mexican immigrants who came followed the people they felt comfortable with, often taking jobs they knew others were taking, being part of the cycle WE set up. By setting stereotypes for Mexican immigrants and by forcing them into a cycle, we isolated them from our society making them feel unwelcome and in many cases unwanted. We also set them up for a present day cycle of poverty, where 28.7 % of them are near poverty, and 65.6 of them are in poverty. (http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/mexico/mexico.pdf) This can be the only explanation for the hostility the original video on this blog shows. Americans are the ones who set themselves up for videos like that. By putting such harsh conditions and laws on immigration, it makes it hard for many immigrants, especially Mexican immigrants, to break the cycle. The Mexican immigrants are continuously being oppressed but find themselves stuck between a rock and a hard place (the rock being going back to their country making less money and the hard place being oppressed in America but making more money). This is similar to when the Italians first immigrated her around 1880-1920. They left because of bad economic conditions, but when they came here they were not only discriminated against, but also were given the lowest wage jobs. Because of oppression like this, the Mexican immigrants have no other way but to express themselves in videos and anti-American regime actions. Much like Irish immigrants in the 19th century. The Irish were oppressed not only by Americans but also by the British. They were forced into the lower paying jobs and many saw the Irish as individuals who might steal their jobs. The Irish however, took action against their oppression and worked to transform politics in America by putting the power into the hands of the working class. (Immigration...Irish: Identity, Influence and Opportunity ) The Irish took over Tammany Hall, a hall that helped immigrants gain power. The Irish eventually won their battle and gained political and social power and started to be accepted by society. If the oppression of Mexican immigrants continue there might be another situation close to that of the Irish with Tammany Hall. Eventually the Irish fit into our society and since then have never been thought of as a threat to our jobs, country etc...and the Mexicans will follow this pattern if the hostility towards them continues. So why are we targeting these immigrant who we have forced into a never ending cycle of oppression? Why not end the cycle by giving them more opportunities so there never has to be instances where we feel hostility from them?
 
Old 04-16-2008, 06:06 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
One huge difference: the Irish typically came here legally speaking English whereas most of Mexico's immigrants are illegal.

Those fools flying the Mexican flag 2 years ago in the illegal immigrants 'rights' rallies made a fatal blunder-------all it did was to enrage the USA.
 
Old 04-16-2008, 06:30 PM
 
1,818 posts, read 2,734,256 times
Reputation: 223
Why not end the cycle by giving them more opportunities so there never has to be instances where we feel hostility from them?

That would be an ideal situation. I think when you stop seeing people as human beings and deserving to being treated as such, we lose something that we all should have, and that is compassion toward your fellow man.
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