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Old 08-25-2012, 10:38 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,722,338 times
Reputation: 22159

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
We are NOT a free market and it has not been sudden.

Government tells us what wages to pay, what prices we can charge, what profit margin we can make, what products we can produce, where we can sell those products and what hours we can operate our business.

That's not even close to a free market.
AND it robs the taxpayers to support all those who either don't want to take one of those $4 an hour paying jobs or can't live on that wage and it robs the taxpayers to provide all the free healthcare, free schools with free meals of all those coming here to take those $4 an hour jobs.

You can't begin to talk about free markets when you have a giant and generous welfare handout system that even incluces free housing with free utilities and free cell phones.

If Memphis wants a free market, then he needs to first stop all the government handouts and let Ameicans really compete with the flood of cheap workers coming over the border, and see wages drop to $5 or $6 a day.

 
Old 08-25-2012, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 69,904,378 times
Reputation: 27519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
I agree, we should eliminate or lower the minimum wage.

But we can't be big government on one thing, and not the other. Has to start somewhere.

If you flood the market with new labor sources, wages will have to come down. Thats the problem with the Republican party, they aren't small government, they like government when it suits them.
The global market was flooded with new labor ..in other countries.

Now their labor costs and salaries are going up while ours goes down/stagnates.
It will meet somewhere in the middle eventually. How long that takes is anyone's guess.
But for us it will be painful as our standard of living declines.

It has already started. But it's a slow process that evolves. It is happening if you look around hard enough, just maybe not as fast as you would like.
 
Old 08-25-2012, 10:40 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,889 posts, read 20,314,353 times
Reputation: 8606
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
The global market was flooded with new labor ..in other countries.

Now their labor costs and salaries are going up while ours goes down/stagnates.
It will meet somewhere in the middle eventually. How long that takes is anyone's guess.
But for us it will be painful as our standard of living declines.

It has already started. But it's a slow process that evolves. It is happening if you look around hard enough, just maybe not as fast as you would like.

I don't give a **** about the "global" economy. I care about the American economy. You bring in cheap labor from south of the border, make them pay taxes, don't give them the social safety nets for a given number of years, and watch production go up and labor costs decrease.

Small government means small government. It doesn't mean "well we have big government here, so we have to have big government there"
 
Old 08-25-2012, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 69,904,378 times
Reputation: 27519
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Not true at all. A pair of shoes made in the USA would cost $800. And that 65" HDTV would cost $10,000.
New Balance..$50...Made in the USA
 
Old 08-25-2012, 10:47 AM
 
Location: San Diego, CA
10,584 posts, read 7,968,772 times
Reputation: 4146
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
I don't care what the ILLEGALS want. If they want to come to my country and debase the wage structure, they will just have to deal with it, the same way I have to deal with them destroying my country. And every illegal I ever met knew exactly what they were doing, and those food cards cost somebody something. You don't get something for nothing. They are not THAT stupid.
They don't say what they believe.

They say what they hope stupid voters will believe.

This is true for both illegal aliens and Democrats.

Surprising how many similarities there are between the two.
 
Old 08-25-2012, 10:53 AM
 
Location: On Top
12,388 posts, read 11,306,557 times
Reputation: 4027
Quote:
Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
They don't say what they believe.

They say what they hope stupid voters will believe.

This is true for both illegal aliens and Democrats.

Surprising how many similarities there are between the two.
How about listing, WITH YOUR BROAD BRUSH, some of those similarities?
 
Old 08-25-2012, 11:01 AM
 
6,209 posts, read 6,584,591 times
Reputation: 3091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
If a child has been here for 17 of their 18 years of life, they are as much an American as my son is.

And no one is doing the jobs of the "undocumented" or "illegals", so I say let them stay here. Hell, we need to open the border up more.

Free country and all, we should accept everyone. It'll drive down labor costs, increase production in factories, and make us competitive with China because we'll have cheaper labor.
Sorry, I feel for them but they are not US citizens. No one is doing the job of illegals because they are doing it. Anchor babies are American citizens but if their legal guardian is illegal they then can leave the US with their child, raise their child and when they become of age they can re-enter the US. Millions of illegals have raided our tax base and modified our pay scales. It's long past due that our governments, local and federal, represent the tax paying US citizen not illegal cheap labor and cheap support and votes. If not it means our governments are acting criminally.
 
Old 08-25-2012, 11:07 AM
 
Location: SARASOTA, FLORIDA
11,501 posts, read 13,036,047 times
Reputation: 4875
Criminal trespassers in what they need to be called.
 
Old 08-25-2012, 11:08 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,889 posts, read 20,314,353 times
Reputation: 8606
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmking View Post
Sorry, I feel for them but they are not US citizens. No one is doing the job of illegals because they are doing it. Anchor babies are American citizens but if their legal guardian is illegal they then can leave the US with their child, raise their child and when they become of age they can re-enter the US. Millions of illegals have raided our tax base and modified our pay scales. It's long past due that our governments, local and federal, represent the tax paying US citizen not illegal cheap labor and cheap support and votes. If not it means our governments are acting criminally.

I'm saying let all of them become citizens on a trial basis, tax them, make sure they aren't breaking the law, and they'll increase production, lower wage costs, and everyone will be the better for it.

Thats a "Free market" solution.

Illegal immigrants aren't going anywhere, so we might as well use them in the best way possible, by allowing them to become real full citizens, and tax them like everyone else is.
 
Old 08-25-2012, 11:11 AM
 
Location: Southcentral Kansas
44,924 posts, read 27,036,620 times
Reputation: 4269
Quote:
Originally Posted by andywire View Post
Wrong Jackson. I've worked in factories and shops all my life. I love my work. I think this kind of work would do our kids a great deal of good, maybe instil some work ethic in them and harden their character. Seems all they are good for anymore are excuses and entitlement. And we wonder why American labor is UNCOMPETITIVE on the global market??? Because the illegals have destroyed the structure of our workforce, economy, and livelyhood. My dad remembers a time when working with your hands was a respectable living. Today, the kids sit on mom and dad's couch and look down on honest work. Why did this happen? Because illegals derailed the structure of our workforce, our wage structure and even our economy. While we wait for something to come along and pry the young Americans off mommy's couch, the illegals will keep doing these jobs, for a wage most Americans cannot live on, and the cycle will continue... Until the system can't bare it anymore and America is diminished forever.

This country was built by people with strong work ethics and a drive to do a job right. Today, it is the illegals doing the building, making, and DOING. They are benefiting no one... Except the boss collecting the bulk of the fruits of their labor, while expecting Americans to pick up the difference in the way of subsidies. Americans were NEVER afraid of doing dirty, hard, even dangerous work. Today, the wage doesn't match the job. I blame the illegals for that one.



They don't work any harder than Americans used to work... When wages were respectable for entry level work. They just work much cheaper, with the aid of food cards, free health care, and other freebies thanks to generous tax payers (you and me). And there is no competition with China's labor rates. None at all. Even Mexico can't compete on their wage structure. The only thing that can give American manufacturing the edge is A) superior quality and B) automation (which drastically reduces the need for labor). With regards to B, automation makes labor prices almost irrelevant, as machinery and interest payments become the greatest cost burden. This isn't grandpas age of labor intensive manufacturing, which is exactly why illegal immigrants are no longer needed in many areas of manufacturing. That in of itself largely explains why illegals aren't pouring across the border the way they were a decade ago. Aside from that, their middle class is growing while ours is shrinking. Turns our the free market smiles upon their superior work ethic, as opposed to this generations ballooning entitlement mentality and refusal to undertake honest livings deemed only good for illegal labor. I don't blame them... I blame the illegals and what they have done to my generation.
An outstanding post by one of the people who have been there and is not a student, or whatever else many of our libs are. The bolded words of your post are the things that illegal supporters never seem to realize what makes it possible for them to live.

I get very tired of seeing those illegals who did take the jobs of citizens in meat packing plants in Dodge City, Kansas spending all those goodies that they got to supplement what they get paid in packing plants that were in existence before they moved in and took over.
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