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Old 09-18-2012, 10:18 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,097,924 times
Reputation: 479

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Why is it you think labor rates will remain at "prevailing wage" or efficient wages? Simple over supply of labor causes reduction in "prevailing wage" and efficient wages don't lower product price. What you propose is a race to the bottom in wages, we would end up like China and India with their overpopulation's.
What you suggest hasn't happened to the extent you claim, with our current black markets. Solving our illegal problem would be ending the black market by creating a more open market in that form of Commerce.

In any case, US labor could be opting to bear true witness to our own laws and pursuing opportunity costs, other than directly competing with foreign labor. Some opportunity costs could be learning new and more marketable vocations or going to school to obtain enough degrees to engender a climate where employers are willing to clamor for employment relationships.
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Old 09-18-2012, 10:20 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,097,924 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
More efficient foreign labor? Robots are efficient, people, especially un-skilled, are not. Who cares if they want to "try their luck" in the US market. Why should we care about foreign labor accumulating enough capital? The few that may start a local business and succeed isn't enough to cover the costs of those that don't. Your economic theory isn't worth the time you have wasted in attempting to explain your avocation for open borders. You're barking up the wrong tree in here.

We already subsidize the least efficient labor (it's called welfare). Your ramblings of the same basic phrase over and over doesn't hep your cause, in fact it turns many away. Do we not already adhere to our morals and bear witness to our own laws (presuming you mean the USC)?
You have yet to explain why Commerce that is well Regulated among the several States would be bad for any private sector in our republic? We already know that Prohibition will never work.
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Old 09-18-2012, 11:02 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,133 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
What you suggest hasn't happened to the extent you claim, with our current black markets. Solving our illegal problem would be ending the black market by creating a more open market in that form of Commerce.

In any case, US labor could be opting to bear true witness to our own laws and pursuing opportunity costs, other than directly competing with foreign labor. Some opportunity costs could be learning new and more marketable vocations or going to school to obtain enough degrees to engender a climate where employers are willing to clamor for employment relationships.
So I ask you questions and you come back and tell me that it hasn't happened to the extent I claim?

Are you saying that wages have not fallen due to the over abundance of laborers in a profession?

There will always be a black market, Prostitution is legal in Nevada yet there is still black market prostitutes in Nevada (they simply don't want to pay the taxes owed). Marijuana is legal in CA yet there is still black market for it here.

What is "bear true witness to our own laws"? So if one can't compete they should attend school with money they haven't got and obtain degrees (more than one at 3 - 4 years for each) to be able to get a better job?

So one won't actually enter the workforce until they are in their 30's and unskilled labor will be there **** ants. How are those students going to pay for their education? College has skyrocketed in costs and tuition.
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Old 09-18-2012, 11:05 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,133 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
You have yet to explain why Commerce that is well Regulated among the several States would be bad for any private sector in our republic? We already know that Prohibition will never work.
How do you plan on getting these other States involved, One World Order? Who is going to be in charge, gov't wise? how do we elect our leaders? How is immigration prohibitive? Isn't it "well regulated"?

You have yet to explain anything beyond very broad claims of opinionated theory and saying its the only way.
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Old 09-18-2012, 11:56 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,133 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
We could be solving poverty in the US through unemployment compensation merely for being able to claim to be unemployed or underemployed. Such simplification in our public policies could provide better governance at lower prices; since our social safety net could be as easy to administer as minimum wage laws are now.
How do you propose the state pay the unemployment? What if everybody decided they didn't want to work and wanted unemployment from the state? Who is going to cover the costs? whats going to happen to the GDP if nobody works?

Last edited by Liquid Reigns; 09-19-2012 at 12:14 AM..
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Old 09-19-2012, 12:17 AM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
212 posts, read 316,896 times
Reputation: 319
When is this country going to enforce the laws that are in place? And change the one where you can just cross the border and pop out a kid and it is legal? What good does the kid being legal even matter, when their parents are not even supposed to be here. This illegal immigration is getting out of hand (has been). Anytime someone wants to do something crazy like ask for an i.d. to vote or rent an apartment, it's shot down. This is not going to end well. Now we can expect a large # of escaped felons from Mexico here in Texas. Yay!! I just can't believe the government is doing everything they can to make it okay for people they know are illegal to be here.
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Old 09-20-2012, 03:54 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,807,269 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
The only problem is that they don't work or we would not have an illegal problem now. I am advocating for a permanent solution to our illegal problem that is also friendly to the markets of Commerce.
There is no "permanent" solution. Certainly, amnesty isn't the answer. These greedy employers are no better than drug cartels. They are far too accustomed to their obscene profits from illegal labor to ever consider employing legal workers. Likewise, their untaxed employees will never volunteer to become taxpayers. The underground economy is a multi-billion dollar enterprise. They're making too much money to choose the legit route. It defies logic.
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:21 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,097,924 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
So I ask you questions and you come back and tell me that it hasn't happened to the extent I claim?

Are you saying that wages have not fallen due to the over abundance of laborers in a profession?

There will always be a black market, Prostitution is legal in Nevada yet there is still black market prostitutes in Nevada (they simply don't want to pay the taxes owed). Marijuana is legal in CA yet there is still black market for it here.

What is "bear true witness to our own laws"? So if one can't compete they should attend school with money they haven't got and obtain degrees (more than one at 3 - 4 years for each) to be able to get a better job?

So one won't actually enter the workforce until they are in their 30's and unskilled labor will be there **** ants. How are those students going to pay for their education? College has skyrocketed in costs and tuition.
What you are describing is phenomena that is normal under Capitalism. It has to do with the laws of supply and demand. Why not use public sector intervention in private sector markets to better ensure full employment of resources in those markets?

Last edited by danielpalos; 09-22-2012 at 01:31 PM..
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:24 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,097,924 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
How do you plan on getting these other States involved, One World Order? Who is going to be in charge, gov't wise? how do we elect our leaders? How is immigration prohibitive? Isn't it "well regulated"?

You have yet to explain anything beyond very broad claims of opinionated theory and saying its the only way.
We are referring the US and promoting the general welfare; you may need to ask gun lovers about that unitary, one world order stuff since that is their angle and not mine.

The general government is already delegated the power and former States' right over immigration since 1808. The amusement park model is a valid business model that actually generates revenue for that sector. Why are you being so fiscally irresponsible as to increase our Tax burden without just cause?
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Old 09-22-2012, 01:27 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,097,924 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
How do you propose the state pay the unemployment? What if everybody decided they didn't want to work and wanted unemployment from the state? Who is going to cover the costs? whats going to happen to the GDP if nobody works?
Revenue generated from a federal, natural public sector monopoly which can be harnessed into a public sector means of production, could be used to fund unemployment compensation for US labor according to the concept and existing legal doctrine of employment at will.

You are welcome to ignore the laws of supply and demand if you want; but, I am only advocating for public policy choices which conform to the theory of supply and demand and the assumption of perfectly competitive markets.
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