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Old 10-09-2007, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,633,862 times
Reputation: 3785

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Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Yeah, it's just the "illegal" part you folks object to. If only they had a few extra pieces of unexpired paper, then it would all be A-OK with you. The schools, the medical care, the work, the remittances, the language, the culture, the extended families, the whole nine yards of it. None of that would be any problem at all for you if only these people had their papers in order. That's a real hoot...
In a nutshell; correct.

Fair is fair--------play by the rules one receives the goodies. If cheating; (illegal) immigrants need to be deported-------minimum.

My own father who was an immigrant and now a US citizen sent remittances to his family in Hungary about 30-40 years ago. Again: he played it by the rules; sponsor, was drafted for Korea (kept stateside), and got his citizenship over 50 years ago.

In all fairness; he probably had help leaving Displaced Person refugee camps in today's Germany due to being a political refugee from Hungary back ca. 1948--------most of our illegals are economic 'refugees'. The difference is significant.

 
Old 10-09-2007, 07:55 AM
 
19,183 posts, read 27,746,995 times
Reputation: 4000
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
In a nutshell; correct. Fair is fair--------play by the rules one receives the goodies. If cheating; (illegal) immigrants need to be deported-------minimum.
Belied by the content of this and every other thread in the forum. Scroll back to read anger over hospital emergency rooms being overrun by illegals. Who checked the papers on those folks? No one. The word 'illegals' is merely being used as a placeholder for the word 'Hispanics'. People have told me they can walk into a store and tell who among the staff are illegals by how well they speak English. People have indicated to me that they can drive down the highway, see a group of Hispanics congregated on the sidewalk, and tell that they are all illegals. At this point, it's senseless even to attempt to claim that it's 'illegal' that makes all the difference.
 
Old 10-09-2007, 08:06 AM
 
Location: Good ol Georgia
348 posts, read 914,676 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Yeah, it's just the "illegal" part you folks object to. If only they had a few extra pieces of unexpired paper, then it would all be A-OK with you. The schools, the medical care, the work, the remittances, the language, the culture, the extended families, the whole nine yards of it. None of that would be any problem at all for you if only these people had their papers in order. That's a real hoot...

Well yeah, that would be a start. The law is the law and should be followed or consequences paid.
 
Old 10-09-2007, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,374,882 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Belied by the content of this and every other thread in the forum. Scroll back to read anger over hospital emergency rooms being overrun by illegals. Who checked the papers on those folks? No one. The word 'illegals' is merely being used as a placeholder for the word 'Hispanics'. People have told me they can walk into a store and tell who among the staff are illegals by how well they speak English. People have indicated to me that they can drive down the highway, see a group of Hispanics congregated on the sidewalk, and tell that they are all illegals. At this point, it's senseless even to attempt to claim that it's 'illegal' that makes all the difference.
Once again, being inside the beltway does not allow you to see the "real world"

Identification of those in this country illegally, and not just those from Mexico as you allege, is being done - be in housing, medical, education, welfare centers etc.

A study recently released by the Az Dept of Econ Security showed that while the illegal population contributed some 280 million dollars in tax revenue last year, the cost of illegal’s on the AZ economy was 1.3 Billion Dollars - this cost represented taxpayer support for medical, education, welfare, housing etc.

That is a significant cost to AZ taxpayers and one of the reasons that AZ has passed some of the toughest legislation to deal with the illegal population in the nation. Employers are going to risk their businesses if they knowingly hire illegals. Those here illegally will not get "in state" benefits such as tuition or state funded scholarships. Those here illegally will not be able to qualify for state funded welfare benefits etc.

What I speak of is the REAL WORLD -

Oh, and btw - the above? Applies to all those here illegally - regardless of their country of origin

Oh, and btw - the above? Those here LEGALLY - they are welcome and welcome to all the benifits that AZ has to offer
 
Old 10-09-2007, 08:20 AM
 
Location: Oxygen Ln. AZ
9,321 posts, read 16,140,804 times
Reputation: 5685
I meet a few now that I really enjoy talking to. They actually speak our language, are very cheerful in general. I have been aware of this issue since the 70's and it seems to me that most of them now absolutely hate this country and hate everything American. The icy glares I get in the stores, the cold chill I feel when I say good morning is becoming the norm. The radical groups that seem to be mentoring them is a concern. I do now question why they come here, is it to better their life or is it to take ours? Mr. Fox can stay home and heal thyself as far as I am concerned. He is just another anti American corupt Mexican.
 
Old 10-09-2007, 10:42 AM
 
Location: California
236 posts, read 399,345 times
Reputation: 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista View Post
Belied by the content of this and every other thread in the forum. Scroll back to read anger over hospital emergency rooms being overrun by illegals. Who checked the papers on those folks? No one. The word 'illegals' is merely being used as a placeholder for the word 'Hispanics'. People have told me they can walk into a store and tell who among the staff are illegals by how well they speak English. People have indicated to me that they can drive down the highway, see a group of Hispanics congregated on the sidewalk, and tell that they are all illegals. At this point, it's senseless even to attempt to claim that it's 'illegal' that makes all the difference.
Let me start off we saying that I am 100% against illegal immigrants, BUT, I get what you and Sweden are saying. I have spent the last hour reading this thread. I am amazed a how articulate and bright Sweden is for an 18 year old. I will tell you how I interpreted it.

I found no insult by Sweden. I am a true American but our citizens do believe that we are superior than other countries. But this is why other countries turn to us to help then with their problems. If you constantly pump someones ego then they will strut their stuff. I know I do. LOL .

What I got out of what she said and by what you said is that we ( I am included because I honestly do) assume that a person is an Illegal by how they speak, look, live, and act. By that assumption it is by default racist. We can not tell just by looking at an individual whether they are a Legal or an Illegal immigrant. But as I have stated on other threads, Our government and big businesses have caused many people who normally are cuturally sensitive to become (borderline) racist. I say this because I am one of them. I do not hate anyone but I have become intolerant of cultural diversity. I do not have any issues with any other illegal immigrant but Mexican but that is because I don't have contact with immigrants of other nationalities. This is from my experiences and from what I have witnessed happening in my state of California. Is it wrong? Well of course it is!!!! Our government needs to get control of the Illegal Immigration problem and start listening to the citizens of this country. We want control of immigration and we want big businesses punished when they break immigration laws. Our country needs to start focusing on our problems at home beginning with the enforcement of our immigration laws. I believe as do many people that if our government does not start listening to the people and start enforcing our laws this country we are headed for another civil war. Mark my words we are headed there. Listen to the people who post in the immigration threads we are tired of our voices not being heard. It is only going to get worse and our government will be to blame not the illegal immigrants, but unfortunatley they recieve the brunt of our anger.
 
Old 10-09-2007, 10:49 AM
 
Location: Good ol Georgia
348 posts, read 914,676 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinasgt2005 View Post
Let me start off we saying that I am 100% against illegal immigrants, BUT, I get what you and Sweden are saying. I have spent the last hour reading this thread. I am amazed a how articulate and bright Sweden is for an 18 year old. I will tell you how I interpreted it.

I found no insult by Sweden. I am a true American but our citizens do believe that we are superior than other countries. But this is why other countries turn to us to help then with their problems. If you constantly pump someones ego then they will strut their stuff. I know I do. LOL .

What I got out of what she said and by what you said is that we ( I am included because I honestly do) assume that a person is an Illegal by how they speak, look, live, and act. By that assumption it is by default racist. We can not tell just by looking at an individual whether they are a Legal or an Illegal immigrant. But as I have stated on other threads, Our government and big businesses have caused many people who normally are cuturally sensitive to become (borderline) racist. I say this because I am one of them. I do not hate anyone but I have become intolerant of cultural diversity. I do not have any issues with any other illegal immigrant but Mexican but that is because I don't have contact with immigrants of other nationalities. This is from my experiences and from what I have witnessed happening in my state of California. Is it wrong? Well of course it is!!!! Our government needs to get control of the Illegal Immigration problem and start listening to the citizens of this country. We want control of immigration and we want big businesses punished when they break immigration laws. Our country needs to start focusing on our problems at home beginning with the enforcement of our immigration laws. I believe as do many people that if our government does not start listening to the people and start enforcing our laws this country we are headed for another civil war. Mark my words we are headed there. Listen to the people who post in the immigration threads we are tired of our voices not being heard. It is only going to get worse and our government will be to blame not the illegal immigrants, but unfortunatley they recieve the brunt of our anger.

I agree with you whole heartedly...I have found that I assume all hispanics are illegal now. I never used to be this way. The numbers of illegals in our country is so great, that I've just gotten to the point of believing most hispanics I see are illegal. Maybe once we get control over the high numbers of illegals then I'll feel differently...I don't know. I do think that the gov't has made many American's "borderline racists" because of their failure at out border.
 
Old 10-09-2007, 10:53 AM
 
2,039 posts, read 5,678,742 times
Reputation: 557
Quote:
Originally Posted by happymom4 View Post
I agree with you whole heartedly...I have found that I assume all hispanics are illegal now. I never used to be this way. The numbers of illegals in our country is so great, that I've just gotten to the point of believing most hispanics I see are illegal. Maybe once we get control over the high numbers of illegals then I'll feel differently...I don't know. I do think that the gov't has made many American's "borderline racists" because of their failure at out border.
Here is my solution to the illegal immigration situation.
Please bear (bare?) with me as I describe my idea before you jump to conclusions. Thanks.

First of all, allow anyone in the country who is here illegally immediate LEGAL status. No matter what country they are from.

To accomplish this, so that the illegals can move about freely, a card must be issued.

I would suggest that, anyone who wants amnesty be allowed to be granted it by following through with this action:

Each individual illegal immigrant must go to a selected location, be finger printed, DNA taken and have their mug shots taken (afterall, they are criminals...)

Then issue them a color coded license (or school ID, whatever, depending on the age) that is valid for 5 years. IF within those five years they are arrested for ANYTHING - minor or not, they are immediately deported and not allowed back into the country.
If, like "most" illegals already here in the US, they stay out of trouble, they will be then be given full citizenship at the end of five years.

What this accomplishes, is this:

It allows the person to stay at whatever job they have now, AND they can begin to pay TAXES. They won't have to lie about status in the hospitals, they will actually have to be in the system like everyone else and pay up - or go bankrupt like other US citizens facing high hospitals bills. They'll have to have car insurance - just like everyone else.
If they are no longer allowed a free ride they may chose not to stay. But it will be their choice.
The employer (who is knowingly breaking the law) must pay the fees (workers compensation, etc) but shouldn't have to be forced to pay his employee any more than what he is already paying them. Because the illegal is free to go about his business without fear of being deportation he can then choose to either keep his job at his present pay or find another one.
This way prices will not raise substantially.

It's not a perfect solution, but it's a beginning. We all know the illegals are NOT going anywhere. That the government will NEVER enforce the new laws to begin with. Neither illegals NOR employers will be punished. So why not just make it easier on everyone?
But (and I use this term lightly) track the illegals for a few years and if they have proven themselves, then heck, let them stay. If they have caused a ruckus, send them home.
 
Old 10-09-2007, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Colorado
10,017 posts, read 16,698,771 times
Reputation: 2086
Never say never
 
Old 10-09-2007, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Cali
3,886 posts, read 5,997,218 times
Reputation: 2200
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinasgt2005 View Post
Let me start off we saying that I am 100% against illegal immigrants, BUT, I get what you and Sweden are saying. I have spent the last hour reading this thread. I am amazed a how articulate and bright Sweden is for an 18 year old. I will tell you how I interpreted it.

I found no insult by Sweden. I am a true American but our citizens do believe that we are superior than other countries. But this is why other countries turn to us to help then with their problems. If you constantly pump someones ego then they will strut their stuff. I know I do. LOL .

What I got out of what she said and by what you said is that we ( I am included because I honestly do) assume that a person is an Illegal by how they speak, look, live, and act. By that assumption it is by default racist. We can not tell just by looking at an individual whether they are a Legal or an Illegal immigrant. But as I have stated on other threads, Our government and big businesses have caused many people who normally are cuturally sensitive to become (borderline) racist. I say this because I am one of them. I do not hate anyone but I have become intolerant of cultural diversity. I do not have any issues with any other illegal immigrant but Mexican but that is because I don't have contact with immigrants of other nationalities. This is from my experiences and from what I have witnessed happening in my state of California. Is it wrong? Well of course it is!!!! Our government needs to get control of the Illegal Immigration problem and start listening to the citizens of this country. We want control of immigration and we want big businesses punished when they break immigration laws. Our country needs to start focusing on our problems at home beginning with the enforcement of our immigration laws. I believe as do many people that if our government does not start listening to the people and start enforcing our laws this country we are headed for another civil war. Mark my words we are headed there. Listen to the people who post in the immigration threads we are tired of our voices not being heard. It is only going to get worse and our government will be to blame not the illegal immigrants, but unfortunatley they recieve the brunt of our anger.
Very well put Tina!
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