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Old 10-07-2007, 09:22 PM
 
Location: Fort Myers Fl
2,305 posts, read 2,629,773 times
Reputation: 916

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Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
A country is in many respects the "home" of those who are citizens. They feel a proprietary interest in their country, just as anyone would feel toward his own home. If you want to get along with a person- ANY person I've ever met, in ANY country--- you don't barge into his home, shove your way past the family, and proceed to sit down make yourself at home. This would cause instant hostility almost anywhere. If you want to be accepted, you knock at the door--greet the person inside---and enter when you are invited in. Normally, at that point, you'll be given a warm and hospitable welcome. If not, you leave. That's how to get along with people in their home.

Countries are somewhat the same as homes. Sneak in, make yourself at home, disrespect the residents, and begin loudly demanding all sorts of rights and privileges, and you'll probably be met with hostility. Go through the proper procedures, enter legally, and show a bit of respect, and you'll be welcomed warmly, at least in this country.

It amazes me how this simple analogy seems to mystify so many people. It's really not a bit difficult to understand, yet some of the most brilliant minds in government just don't seem to "get it"....
Very well said. And I also find it amazing how simple it is.
When i was young and not very smart, anytime I broke the law I never got any breaks. So why should someone from another country here illegally get any breaks?

 
Old 10-07-2007, 09:40 PM
 
1,735 posts, read 4,137,914 times
Reputation: 1436
Quote:
Originally Posted by theimmigrant View Post
To the people who believe that immigrants are ruining America,( by not paying taxes, taking jobs from Americans, going to the hospital because they are sick, or just trying to find a better life, etc). - How about the ones trying to make a difference in their country, or paying taxes, or helping the American people? Well, how come not many see the difference in this, and just lump us all together in one category? Those of you who are against immigrants should realize that we are not all the same, but a group of people with different perspectives. By the way, just because we are immigrants does not mean out life goal is to become your nanny or gardener.
If an American didnít pay their taxes they would go to jail. Al Capone was responsible for killing unknown numbers of people, not to mention all the other crimes he and his men committed. He was imprisoned not for these crimes, but for tax evasion. Why should an illegal get away with not paying taxes?

Every job in America was done by legal Americans prior to the illegal invasion. A job in America should only be done by the most qualified not the person who would accept the lowest wage. By under bidding other workers it forces all workers to accept lower wages or not work.

Americans only go to hospitals when they need surgery, or they are injured and need fast medical attention. Illegals go to hospitals for common illnesses such as cold or flu because they know the hospital canít refuse them and the treatment is free. Next time you are injured I hope you have to go to a county hospital. Then you will see first hand how long you have to wait because the doctor has to deal with 50 other patients with minor illnesses that any American would go to their doctor for.

I donít know what help you are referring to, but some how I got along fine for 36 years in the hart of illegal CA and I never had an illegal do anything for me. Not that I didnít get approached every time I went to Home Depot, 7-eleven, out working in the yard, countless flyers, and cards I had to throw away every couple of days. I didnít hire them because I have principles. If I hired illegals then I would have been part of the problem and I didnít want that on my conscience.

You are fixated on the immigrant and ignoring the ILLEGAL part. No one is against immigrants, no one. Come here legally and you are welcome, come her illegally and you are not welcome.
 
Old 10-07-2007, 11:23 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,884,971 times
Reputation: 6517
Legal immigrants are not the problem. Its illegal immigrants who are the problem. Big difference.
As for americans who commit crimes v.s Illegals? If I wreck my car out of anger its a disgrace. If a stranger does the same damage its an outrage. The car was mine to damage.
Identity theft committed by so many illegals has infact ruined lives.
They are criminals by defintion of coming here with out a visa. They compound the misdeed by fraud, identity theft, tax evasion, and quite possibly worse act stealing jobs from legals and citizens. They make place their own needs above their victims just like all criminals do.
 
Old 10-08-2007, 12:50 AM
 
Location: In an illegal immigrant free part of the country.
2,087 posts, read 1,053,512 times
Reputation: 382
The immigrants of years ago came here to assimilate and become an American. They never demanded we cater to their country or their culture that they left behind. Now in the last 20 years we have Mexicans that demand everything in Spanish, Muslims that demand prayer rooms in schools or foot baths. They demand we acknowledge their holidays while demanding ours should not be recognized in the schools so they will not get offended. In fact I cannot come up with any other immigrants that demand so much to accommodate them but those two groups, all driven by the sue happy whining liberals in this country that would love to see all our traditions destroyed.

I am for legal immigration, with restraint, for those that want to become an American. For those that want to force their culture on us, they need to stay in their own country where their practices are acceptable. Illegal immigrants simple need to be deported or jailed.
 
Old 10-08-2007, 01:01 AM
 
Location: Cali
3,885 posts, read 5,995,057 times
Reputation: 2200
Quote:
Originally Posted by citigirl View Post
The immigrants of years ago came here to assimilate and become an American. They never demanded we cater to their country or their culture that they left behind. Now in the last 20 years we have Mexicans that demand everything in Spanish, Muslims that demand prayer rooms in schools or foot baths. They demand we acknowledge their holidays while demanding ours should not be recognized in the schools so they will not get offended. In fact I cannot come up with any other immigrants that demand so much to accommodate them but those two groups, all driven by the sue happy whining liberals in this country that would love to see all our traditions destroyed.

I am for legal immigration, with restraint, for those that want to become an American. For those that want to force their culture on us, they need to stay in their own country where their practices are acceptable. Illegal immigrants simple need to be deported or jailed.
Bravo citigirl! So eloquently put too.:-)
 
Old 10-08-2007, 06:02 AM
 
Location: Northern VA (for now)
23,003 posts, read 31,957,905 times
Reputation: 30387
Quote:
Originally Posted by citigirl View Post
The immigrants of years ago came here to assimilate and become an American. They never demanded we cater to their country or their culture that they left behind. Now in the last 20 years we have Mexicans that demand everything in Spanish, Muslims that demand prayer rooms in schools or foot baths. They demand we acknowledge their holidays while demanding ours should not be recognized in the schools so they will not get offended. In fact I cannot come up with any other immigrants that demand so much to accommodate them but those two groups, all driven by the sue happy whining liberals in this country that would love to see all our traditions destroyed.

I am for legal immigration, with restraint, for those that want to become an American. For those that want to force their culture on us, they need to stay in their own country where their practices are acceptable. Illegal immigrants simple need to be deported or jailed.
LEGAL immigration is okay with me. but restraints need to be in place. operate within sensible limits and make sure every immigrant speaks enough english to function without an interpreter's assistance and i'll shut up.
 
Old 10-08-2007, 08:10 AM
 
Location: Anchorage, Alaska (most of the time)
1,222 posts, read 3,286,531 times
Reputation: 1881
Let me see if I understand this...
Quote:
Originally Posted by theimmigrant View Post
To the people who believe that immigrants are ruining America,( by not paying taxes, taking jobs from Americans, going to the hospital because they are sick, or just trying to find a better life, etc). - How about the ones trying to make a difference in their country, or paying taxes, or helping the American people? Well, how come not many see the difference in this, and just lump us all together in one category? Those of you who are against immigrants should realize that we are not all the same, but a group of people with different perspectives. By the way, just because we are immigrants does not mean out life goal is to become your nanny or gardener.
I think what theimmigrant is trying to say, is that no ALL people immigrating to the US lives on wellfare, pays no taxes or are disgraceful to the American people. People are individualists and should not all be lumped together into one group, which has already been done in this thread alone.
The subject has not been touched in the way desired in this thread. The OP tried to make a point, that would maybe engage people in a discussion seen from another point of view/angle, but failed, since again, as always - the thread is now only about illegal immigration and that ALL illegals are bad and disgraceful and pays no taxes.

You are talking about atleast 12 million people here, but no one seems to realize this.

Take 12 million average Americans and join that group yourself with your family and friends. Are you all the same? Aren't you an individual? If I have a bad encounter with an American- can I say you are just as horrible?
When visiting London this summer, I went to the Towern. This is to anyone from a European country a place where you show respect. It's old, and it's Royal. Royalties are people who are going to be treated with respect, period. In a castle, you move and whisper as if you were in a church. That is how important Royalties and history are to us.
You can spot an American in a European croud without any trouble- they are yelling, talking loudly, being disrespectful, you name it.
And you are all the same.
Get my point? Are you like that, just because YOU are an American?
I say ALL American tourists are obnoxious, loud and disrespectful. Do you agree? Is that really you, or is it just MY view of an entire people of 300 million, based on a small sample of Americans?

I've been to Alaska. Are you all like Alaskans?

Yes, people are influenced by nature and nurture, but we are still individualists. Are you the same as your siblings? I know I'm not. And yet we are brought up the same way.

It's called social psychology. The environment that we are in affects how we behave at that moment. If this was the relationship forum, would you start talking negative about immigrants? No, but you have no problem doing so in THIS particular forum. Why is this? Because that's the purpose of this forum- to discuss immigration, and that's what OTHER PEOPLE are doing here too. You are not alone, this is how OTHER PEOPLE behave here.
You say hispanic immigrants are bad, because it's how they are as a group and just proves how much they disrespect the US.
Then think about the attitude towards them. Is it positive? Do they feel like YOU respect them? Do they feel judged based on what they look like and not what they are as individuals? You don't know who is an illegal and who is an legal immigrant by just looking at someone, yet you say, repeatedly that it was an illegal that once spat on you.
Now put yourself in that position. You are an American, and looks like an American, and you are in a crowd with other people who are not Americans and do not like Americans, because one once spat on them. You might be a really nice person, and you may not be what these people consider to be an average American, yet you are judged based on that scheme. Is that fair? Wouldn't you react negatively if someone judged you based on your looks and origin?
In school, would you have liked it if your teacher graded you based on what other people looking like you in your age had performed?

There are 9 million people in Sweden. We are not all the same.
There are some thousand people in jail in Sweden. They all have in common that they are criminals, but they are not the same. Some made something truly horrible and don't regret it and don't do anything to try do make it any better. But some, who also made something just as bad, are trying to make things better, and when given the chance, they will make life better for others.
Same with illegals. Some are bad, some are good. But they are in no way all the same. And some pay taxes, makes life better for others.

And all immigrants aren't living on wellfare or being disrespectful. Not all hispanic immigrants want the US to come under their rule.
They are individuals just as everyone of you.

You are talking about homes and countries, but when are you going to realize that you are talking about individuals, and not some numbers in a statistical report?

Don't we all know that statistics lie?
 
Old 10-08-2007, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Colorado
10,017 posts, read 16,694,959 times
Reputation: 2086
So what are we suppose to take a poll on who is doing what, and expect them to be truthful? No, whats good for one is good for all illegals. This isnt pick and choose. Oh you are nice you can stay. No sorry does not work like that. I know they are all not on welfare, but they are all here illegally. End of story. Legals are welcome, but we need to use restraint right now.
 
Old 10-08-2007, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Cali
3,885 posts, read 5,995,057 times
Reputation: 2200
It would be great if we could go back to pre-1965 immigration laws!
 
Old 10-08-2007, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Anchorage, Alaska (most of the time)
1,222 posts, read 3,286,531 times
Reputation: 1881
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nea1 View Post
So what are we suppose to take a poll on who is doing what, and expect them to be truthful? No, whats good for one is good for all illegals. This isnt pick and choose. Oh you are nice you can stay. No sorry does not work like that. I know they are all not on welfare, but they are all here illegally. End of story. Legals are welcome, but we need to use restraint right now.
It's not about who can stay or not. It's about not keep saying that ALL illegals are the same. It has nothing to do with deportation in this case. That is not what it is about in this thread. It is about attitudes.

The OP didn't want to talk about immigration-laws or what to do with immigrants here, based on the info he/she gave in the thread starter. He/She wanted to discuss the attitudes against immigrants. Please read what he/she said and discuss that instead of discussing what you always discuss in other threads that concerns that. Read what the OP said instead of posting the same posts you've already posted in other threads. We know you don't want illegals in the US, ok. I agree. But can we now, in this thread, discuss another thing in this matter.
The subject about immigrants are not just about illegals that have to get out of the country. It is also about legals, and even about the illegals. Let's all agree they should leave the country and come back legally. Now, we've already said that.
Can we now please leave that sub-subject and discuss another part of it?
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