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Old 10-06-2012, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,958,746 times
Reputation: 3029

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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
So, did anyone read deeper into the story, and find out there isn't any illegal aliens involved?...
Did you miss this?

Quote:
They said all this was a hoax, an elaborate fraud to get Natallia a green card.
The last time I checked, one is either here through our legal immigration process, or they are here illegally. And, obtaining a green card through fraudulent means does not qualify as a legal channel. So, an "illegal alien" is indeed involved.
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Old 10-06-2012, 05:12 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,061,894 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
...The last time I checked, one is either here through our legal immigration process, or they are here illegally. And, obtaining a green card through fraudulent means does not qualify as a legal channel. So, an "illegal alien" is indeed involved.
Ok, you just qualified him for DACA then...
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Old 10-07-2012, 06:27 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,958,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
Ok, you just qualified him for DACA then...
I did no such thing. He is clearly not here through "no fault of his own." Nor, should a person who participates in an illegal conspiracy qualify. If I'm not mistaken, immigration fraud is a felony. Unless the DACA requirements have changed, felons do not qualify.
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Old 10-07-2012, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,061,894 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I did no such thing. He is clearly not here through "no fault of his own." Nor, should a person who participates in an illegal conspiracy qualify. If I'm not mistaken, immigration fraud is a felony. Unless the DACA requirements have changed, felons do not qualify.
He was in his teens when he came, and is the only one of the family that has not been charged. The U.S. government can invalidate his visa (derivied from his mother's), but it is going to be damn hard to prove he had any part (as a child at the time) in a would-be conspiracy. They may just try to appease the strong community support for the mother by leaving her and Ivan alone, and going after the stepfather (and possibly the older brother).
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:35 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,958,746 times
Reputation: 3029
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
He was in his teens when he came, and is the only one of the family that has not been charged. The U.S. government can invalidate his visa (derivied from his mother's), but it is going to be damn hard to prove he had any part (as a child at the time) in a would-be conspiracy. They may just try to appease the strong community support for the mother by leaving her and Ivan alone, and going after the stepfather (and possibly the older brother).
And? Criminal investigations take time. The fact that he hasn't been charged means nothing.

Our laws should now be enforced on the basis of "community support" for criminals?
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:14 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,061,894 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
And? Criminal investigations take time. The fact that he hasn't been charged means nothing.

Our laws should now be enforced on the basis of "community support" for criminals?
Ivan and his mother don't seem to have the mens rea, if anything, it is something between his stepfather and older brother. I do feel that input from the community is critical for deciding how an individual should be charged. Fellow teachers feel that Ivan's mother is innocent, there might be more lost with a heavy approach.
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Old 10-09-2012, 11:59 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,958,746 times
Reputation: 3029
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
Ivan and his mother don't seem to have the mens rea, if anything, it is something between his stepfather and older brother. I do feel that input from the community is critical for deciding how an individual should be charged. Fellow teachers feel that Ivan's mother is innocent, there might be more lost with a heavy approach.
Are you privy to the particulars of this case? If not, you are doing nothing but speculating. Furthermore, how are you qualified to determine their mental state or innocence? Do you know them personally to even comment on their character or propensity for criminal behavior? His mother has been charged with fraud. Without probable cause she would not have been indicted.

Community input? Are you kidding? With the exception of overt criminal activity, such as drugs being sold from a home, rarely does the "community" realize they are living among criminals, or even a serial killer. In fact, most thought Ted Bundy was a nice guy. Thankfully, Ivan's mother will not be judged by the "feelings" of fellow teachers. Evidence serves that purpose.
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