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Old 11-20-2012, 05:32 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,133 times
Reputation: 299

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Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro View Post
Firstly you have to understand the immigrati9n system as it stands today.

There is not just a green card to be legal here but also a work permit. The work permit allows people to work here legally. The green card gives a immigrant permenent residence and the opportunity for Citizenship.

There are people who come here as Students and have Student visas and their are some who can get a Fiance Visa. All of the above are legally here and have legal Status.

Illegals are people who are 'UNDOCUMENTED".

The Dream Act gives legal status to youngsters brought over by parents and have been educated here and this is the only home they know........ In fact they are no different to the original settlers wjho came here uninvited but stayed to become American's. Maybe the Native American's should have ignored the plight of the original settlers, let them starve to death but hey the Native American's had more humanity than many in the Republican party today.
I know it (the immigration system) quite well. DACA applicants that obtain work authorization are still illegal immigrants, they are allowed work authorization, they are not legal in any way, only allowed to work here until they are either removed (prior to the 2 year application) or if the application is extended (must again apply) or if Congress passes some sort of amnesty.

Duh!

The DREAM Act has not passed Congress, DHS issued a policy to allow for deferred action against illegal immigrants (DACA) who were brought here at a young age. Maybe you should look a little deeper into the policy to realize that deferred action is just that, deferred action. It does not give you a legal status, it only authorizes one to work provided they received the work authorization as well. There is no form for the illegal (DACA applicant) to fill out that will place them on the path to legalization or citizenship.

Your last bit about first persons is hilarious, which actually shows you have very little knowledge of history. Your "starve to death" of pilgrims is from 1620, you should be aware that there were already established English colonies here starting from 1606, or even Spanish garrison outposts established here in the 1500's along what is now the Florida coast and the Texas coast.
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Old 11-20-2012, 05:34 PM
 
Location: Chicago Area
7,382 posts, read 3,849,087 times
Reputation: 2605
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
We had an amnesty in 1986 and now we have 4 times the number of illegal immigrants here. Stronger control of the border? That is what we were promised in 1986. Yeah, that worked out great, didn't it? You say stronger control and yet you say even a large wall across our southern border won't stop them. Kind of contradictory, isn't it?
Just doing one thing won't work, that's what I'm saying. Do nothing else other than putting up a 100 foot tall, 100 foot thick concrete wall between us and Mexico doesn't solve the problem all by itself.

Quote:
Do I have to repeat once again that amnesty means they will be able to retain the jobs they are working and continue to compete with Americans for jobs? How does that help the American worker while we have millions out of work? I'd like to know why enforcing our immigration laws alienates the Hispanic population in the first place. Hispanic countries have immigration laws also. Are you suggesting that only whites comprise the GOP? What does what race/ethnic group being a majority or minority in the future have to do with this? Are you saying that if Hispanics become the majority in this country we can kiss our immigration laws goodbye?
Obama won reelection and minorities made his victory possible. Mitt Romney got almost no votes from any minority group. The GOP is viewed by minorities as a sexist, bigoted, racist political party. How do you suggest they go about changing that perception?

The Dems will continue to benefit from the illegal immigrant issue for as long as they possibly can. The GOP needs to take a different approach. It's not so much that taking a hard line on immigration is inherently racist, but the Dems can and will spin it that way. Immigration laws stand to trample a lot of good and decent people and there will be no shortage of specific examples come election time.

Hispanics will have to make their peace with immigration policy once they become the majority. Right now, they can be manipulated by what we have in place currently and specific examples of who gets hurt by those laws.

Quote:
As Eleanora pointed out most of those we would amnesty are low wage earners and will depend on government subsidies to survive. We don't need those kinds of immigrants in our country.
Sounds an awful lot like the widespread hatred of the Irish and Italians. They were poor, uneducated and low wage earners. Fast forward 100+ years and it turns out that the Irish and Italians didn't destroy America after all. If you pick and choose who is desirable and how is not, those dubbed undesirable will just enter the United States anyways.

It's matter of directing traffic. If the front door looks like a good option you go through the front door. If the front door is locked, you look for other options.
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:08 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,559,147 times
Reputation: 8350
Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post
Just doing one thing won't work, that's what I'm saying. Do nothing else other than putting up a 100 foot tall, 100 foot thick concrete wall between us and Mexico doesn't solve the problem all by itself.

Obama won reelection and minorities made his victory possible. Mitt Romney got almost no votes from any minority group. The GOP is viewed by minorities as a sexist, bigoted, racist political party. How do you suggest they go about changing that perception?

The Dems will continue to benefit from the illegal immigrant issue for as long as they possibly can. The GOP needs to take a different approach. It's not so much that taking a hard line on immigration is inherently racist, but the Dems can and will spin it that way. Immigration laws stand to trample a lot of good and decent people and there will be no shortage of specific examples come election time.

Hispanics will have to make their peace with immigration policy once they become the majority. Right now, they can be manipulated by what we have in place currently and specific examples of who gets hurt by those laws.

Sounds an awful lot like the widespread hatred of the Irish and Italians. They were poor, uneducated and low wage earners. Fast forward 100+ years and it turns out that the Irish and Italians didn't destroy America after all. If you pick and choose who is desirable and how is not, those dubbed undesirable will just enter the United States anyways.

It's matter of directing traffic. If the front door looks like a good option you go through the front door. If the front door is locked, you look for other options.

Did you not read that I not only advocate for a physical barrier at our southern border but internal enforcement and removing all the incentives to come here?

The GOP is viewed by Hispanics as being bigoted and racist simply because they want our immigration laws enforced and not another failed amnesty and it is no coincidence that most illegal immigrants are Hispanic also. Just who is the racist here? They will never get the majority of the Hispanic vote unless they thumb their noses at our immigration laws and give into their ethnic demands. Is that what you think they should do?

What about good and decent Americans getting their rights trampled by illegal immigrants? Or don't they count? That's why we have immigration laws so that doesn't happen.

I don't know what you mean by "Hispanics will have to make peace with immigration policy once they become the majority". Hispanics are bound by our immigration laws now just like everyone else. Too bad they think their ethnic group should be above them. Hispanics aren't being manipulated by our politicians. It is the other way around.

There is no widespread hatred of Hispanics. There certainly is objection to them being here illegally though. Are you aware that Hispanics enjoy the largest quotas of legal immigration into our country today by far? So much for your claims of being disliked and discriminated against.

As for your last sentence yes that is how criminals think. "I'll take what I want even if I have to break down the door to get it"

I have no further need to debate with you.
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:17 PM
 
19,122 posts, read 21,362,274 times
Reputation: 7313
Quote:
Originally Posted by EdwardA View Post
Get ready folks I for one will not fight it anymore the Left has won might as well speed the decline up.
Just read YOU no one else.... I agree. The strange thing will be when the illegals get it so bad in the USA, because we will be worse than where they came from they will go back, because they want to go back. I am not to sure where we will go.

But maybe we will slip over their border eh?

To me this is kin of exciting really. The left and the libs will take the USA down, never understanding how it happened.

They will be living less than 3rd world conditions and never get it..... Fine by me since i can do stone age times to anything between.......

Let them eat grass literally...... I won't care
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:47 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,009,391 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
...Are you aware that Hispanics enjoy the largest quotas of legal immigration into our country today by far?...
If it so obvious, and such a numerical difference, do you have a source for that tidbit?...

There is a nation (some might falsely call it "Hispanic") that has extremely long wait times for U.S. quota-based visas...
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Old 11-21-2012, 06:47 AM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,559,147 times
Reputation: 8350
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
If it so obvious, and such a numerical difference, do you have a source for that tidbit?...

There is a nation (some might falsely call it "Hispanic") that has extremely long wait times for U.S. quota-based visas...
I already posted that link in here several times. Does it really matter if it is quota based or some other reason they are the largest group of legal immigrants here or whatever other term you want to call them for their legal status?
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Old 11-21-2012, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,009,391 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
I already posted that link in here several times. Does it really matter if it is quota based or some other reason they are the largest group of legal immigrants here or whatever other term you want to call them for their legal status?
It matters that you made a claim that "Hispanics enjoy the largest quotas of legal immigration into our country by far" but are unable or unwilling to provide a link to show that detail...

"By far" means easily a majority, this isn't another one of those "shift the goalposts" moments, it means whether you are able to substantiate a claim that you have made or not...
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Old 11-21-2012, 09:21 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
It matters that you made a claim that "Hispanics enjoy the largest quotas of legal immigration into our country by far" but are unable or unwilling to provide a link to show that detail...

"By far" means easily a majority, this isn't another one of those "shift the goalposts" moments, it means whether you are able to substantiate a claim that you have made or not...
They are by far the bulk of legal immigrants -- because legal immigrants enjoy the family chain migration. That's the whole purpose in giving birth here, they can even return home until the child is 18, and then the child can sponsor them to all come here --- legally.

And no -- the family sponsor is not required to actually provide financial support for his or her immigrants. Sponsorship only means the sponsor's income is included with the immigrants in determining food stamps, SSI, and other welfare programs, nor is the sponsor required to even provide health insurance or pay for the medical care of his or her immigrants --- all that gets dumped on the taxpayers.
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Old 11-21-2012, 09:23 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
Reputation: 22158
The obvious clue is that American birth rates stabilized some time back -- our exploding population increase is due only to massive immigration rates -- legal and illegal.

One ethnic group is growing at extremely high rates -- and not because the non-immigrants of that ethnic group started gulping fertility pills.
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Old 11-21-2012, 09:54 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,009,391 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
They are by far the bulk of legal immigrants -- because legal immigrants enjoy the family chain migration. That's the whole purpose in giving birth here, they can even return home until the child is 18, and then the child can sponsor them to all come here --- legally...
Don't you mean age 21?...

And I've corrected you on that very detail before...

"Oldglory" made the claim that "Hispanics enjoy the largest quotas of legal immigration into our country by far", somebody please help him out over the claim...

Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
...And no -- the family sponsor is not required to actually provide financial support for his or her immigrants. Sponsorship only means the sponsor's income is included with the immigrants in determining food stamps, SSI, and other welfare programs, nor is the sponsor required to even provide health insurance or pay for the medical care of his or her immigrants --- all that gets dumped on the taxpayers.
Can you source that, or is that another unsubstantiated claim made on this forum that we just have to take on faith?...
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