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Old 02-07-2013, 04:03 PM
 
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Some questions:
The 2nd Amendment explicitly states "...the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

The key word is people, note the 2A doesn't use the more restrictive word "citizens".

Furthermore the 14th Amendment states:
"...nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

Since the 2A protects the people's right to bear arms, and the 14A extends this protection to any person, then illegal immigrants have the right to keep and bear arms. Correct?

What do you say?
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:02 PM
 
Location: Some Beach... Somewhere...
4,572 posts, read 3,835,285 times
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1) They're not citizens.
2) They're here in violation of the law, thus they are CRIMINALS

Criminals do not have Second Amendment rights.
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:28 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,714,115 times
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Simple answer is, NO! Illegals are only covered under the Due Process clauses of the Constitution (5th, 6th, and 14th). The Equal Protection clause of the 14th is directed at the State not the person.

http://nccriminallaw.sog.unc.edu/?p=2556
Quote:
[i]n United States v. Portillo-Munoz, the Fifth Circuit held that illegal immigrants do not have Second Amendment rights. The defendant in the case was charged with being an illegal alien in possession of a firearm, in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 922(g)(5). He argued that the statute was unconstitutional, but the court concluded that “[w]hatever else the term means or includes, the phrase ‘the people’ in the Second Amendment of the Constitution does not include aliens illegally in the United States.” It reasoned that “[i]llegal aliens are not ‘law-abiding citizens’ or ‘members of the political community,’ [terms previously used by the Supreme Court in describing the Second Amendment's reach] and aliens who enter or remain in this country illegally and without authorization are not Americans as that word is commonly understood.”
Here's another case denying 2nd Amendment rights to illegals: http://www.ca4.uscourts.gov/Opinions...d/115063.P.pdf
Quote:
On Carpio-Leon’s Second Amendment challenge, we conclude that the scope of the Second Amendment does not extend to provide protection to illegal aliens, because illegal aliens are
not law-abiding members of the political community and aliens who have entered the United States unlawfully have no more rights under the Second Amendment than do aliens outside of the United States seeking admittance. On Carpio- Leon’s Fifth Amendment challenge, we conclude that prohibiting illegal aliens, as a class, from possessing firearms is rationally related to Congress’ legitimate interest in public safety.

Last edited by Liquid Reigns; 02-07-2013 at 05:37 PM..
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:36 PM
 
Location: Massachusetts
10,032 posts, read 6,865,846 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Workin_Hard View Post
1) They're not citizens.
2) They're here in violation of the law, thus they are CRIMINALS

Criminals do not have Second Amendment rights.
This.


Illegals have the right to deportation. Nothing more.

/thread
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:18 PM
 
2,633 posts, read 2,965,646 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Simple answer is, NO! Illegals are only covered under the Due Process clauses of the Constitution (5th, 6th, and 14th). The Equal Protection clause of the 14th is directed at the State not the person.

Illegal Immigrants and the Fourth Amendment « North Carolina Criminal LawHere's another case denying 2nd Amendment rights to illegals: http://www.ca4.uscourts.gov/Opinions...d/115063.P.pdf
Thanks for a very thorough answer. We were discussing this question today.
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:35 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,131 posts, read 15,685,319 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Workin_Hard View Post
1) They're not citizens.
2) They're here in violation of the law, thus they are CRIMINALS

Criminals do not have Second Amendment rights.
Exactly! And to further clarify, "the People" specifically meant "citizens", thus "the right of the people to keep and bear arms" meant citizens only.

If you don't believe it, do the research on the Second Amendment. It is quite clear.
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:53 PM
 
Location: texas
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There is not federal law banning persons in this country in violation of USC 8 sec. 1325 from gun possesion or ownership.
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:01 PM
 
Location: texas
9,138 posts, read 6,490,529 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Workin_Hard View Post
1) They're not citizens.
2) They're here in violation of the law, thus they are CRIMINALS

Criminals do not have Second Amendment rights.
No. Only felons can not own or purchase a firearm.

Even if a illegal alien is caught and convited of violation of USC8, 1325...he has committed a misdemenor not a felony.

He would have to return repeatedly, and be convited of felony USC8, then his gun possesion is in violation of Federal Firearms Laws.
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:04 PM
 
174 posts, read 127,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
Exactly! And to further clarify, "the People" specifically meant "citizens", thus "the right of the people to keep and bear arms" meant citizens only.

If you don't believe it, do the research on the Second Amendment. It is quite clear.
Wrong.

The Supreme Court has clearly held that 'people' and 'person(s)' in the Constitution refers to both citizens and non-citizens.

You are right that those not here lawfully do not hold rights under Amendment II, but it is not because of the reason you cite. For example, non-citizens here legally do, in fact, hold rights under Amendment II. The reason is that courts have ruled that those who violate the law (as do those here unlawfully) are deprived of their rights under Amendment II.

Here, educate yourself.
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=494&invol=259
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Old 02-07-2013, 08:05 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,714,115 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chimuelojones View Post
There is not federal law banning persons in this country in violation of USC 8 sec. 1325 from gun possesion or ownership.
You might try reading the 2 cases I pointed to. An illegal can not obtain or posses a firearm in the US, if caught, federal felony. So, YES, there is a law banning illegals from possessing or owning firearms witin the US.
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