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Old 06-15-2014, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
20,807 posts, read 41,473,197 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
You're right Hispanics are not a huge voting block so I don't know why our politicians are falling all over themselves to appease them on amnesty when it isn't in the best interests of the rest of the populous.
Because- this is a political reality, unpalatable as it may be. Which is why Graham and Cantor - both political pragmatists - have decided the issue can't be avoided.

Well in advance of the 2012 election all political strategists (both sides) said that any candidate who couldn't secure at least 30-32% of the Hispanic vote could not win. Romney got 27% of that vote - and he lost. That percentage increases exponentially with each election as the Hispanic voter population grows.

And, I am all for securing the border, ending all welfare for those here illegally, send them all back to their country of origin whenever and wherever found, no citizenship status to those born in this country to noncitizens (end the anchor baby scam now), and doing nothing with the kids invading TX and AZ - except turning them away. Period.

Last edited by Ariadne22; 06-15-2014 at 10:00 PM..
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Old 06-15-2014, 10:00 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,290,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
Not really. Lindsay Graham won a majority over all five opponents - and he is VERY pro-immigration reform. He was on Face The Nation this morning outlining the argument.

Immigration isn't the only reason Cantor lost - and the GOP is doomed if they don't try to figure out a way to get the huge Hispanic voting block to at least consider that party.

No,no. If GOP continues to ignore the issue, it will go the way of the Whig. Demographics are inexorably against them - and getting worse every nine months.
Uh; are you saying that "Hispanics" think it's Ok to break the laws in this country?? That's a real good reason to put a stop to most immigration from at Central America and Mexico and come down HARD on all illegal aliens since their kind don't believe in following the laws. Sheesh!
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Old 06-15-2014, 10:06 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
20,807 posts, read 41,473,197 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Uh; are you saying that "Hispanics" think it's Ok to break the laws in this country?? That's a real good reason to put a stop to most immigration from at Central America and Mexico and come down HARD on all illegal aliens since their kind don't believe in following the laws. Sheesh!
Oh, yeah. I have no idea what "Hispanics think" - but clearly those who vote and are willing to abide by our immigration laws are in the minority - think the 27% who voted for Romney - which is why GOP is trying to figure out some way to attract the vote of those who have undocumented relatives here - i.e., the 'lawbreakers.' Go figure - this country is going to hell in a handbasket. It's nuts.
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Old 06-15-2014, 10:16 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,290,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
Oh, yeah. I have no idea what "Hispanics think" - but clearly those who vote and are willing to abide by our immigration laws are in the minority - think the 27% who voted for Romney - which is why GOP is trying to figure out some way to attract the vote of those who have undocumented relatives here - i.e., the 'lawbreakers.' Go figure - this country is going to hell in a handbasket. It's nuts.
Many people who voted for Obama in 2012 ain't in favor of amnesty for illegal aliens. Too; many people who could've voted sat out the last election so that 27 percent number of voters against amnesty with 73 percent in favor is bogus at best.
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Old 06-15-2014, 10:20 PM
 
11,501 posts, read 5,515,070 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
Oh, yeah. I have no idea what "Hispanics think" - but clearly those who vote and are willing to abide by our immigration laws are in the minority - think the 27% who voted for Romney - which is why GOP is trying to figure out some way to attract the vote of those who have undocumented relatives here - i.e., the 'lawbreakers.' Go figure - this country is going to hell in a handbasket. It's nuts.
No politician, on either side of the aisle, should be pandering to lawbreakers and those who aid and abet said lawbreakers.

Hispanics generally tend to vote democrat. Even when Reagan got the 1986 amnesty passed, republicans still didn't garner much of the Hispanic vote.

It's a fool's errand for republicans to pander to illegal aliens and those who aid and abet them. Not only will the majority of Hispanics still not vote for them, but neither will their base.

And don't think that the RNC is unaware as to how angry pandering to illegals makes their base. A couple of years ago, the RNC called our house and tried to get us to join. I told the person on the phone that as long as the RNC is for amnesty, they won't get a cent from us. Also, I let him know how insulting it is for me to be perceived as a one-issue voter who wants amnesty. The person on the phone told me that I wasn't the first one to tell him all of this. Yet he still persisted in trying to get us to join, even lowering the amount of the donation. I told him that when the RNC comes out loudly and clearly against amnesty, only then would I consider joining. I say "consider" because I'm an independent who has never been a member of either party.
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Old 06-16-2014, 06:57 AM
 
31,500 posts, read 14,580,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
Because- this is a political reality, unpalatable as it may be. Which is why Graham and Cantor - both political pragmatists - have decided the issue can't be avoided.

Well in advance of the 2012 election all political strategists (both sides) said that any candidate who couldn't secure at least 30-32% of the Hispanic vote could not win. Romney got 27% of that vote - and he lost. That percentage increases exponentially with each election as the Hispanic voter population grows.

And, I am all for securing the border, ending all welfare for those here illegally, send them all back to their country of origin whenever and wherever found, no citizenship status to those born in this country to noncitizens (end the anchor baby scam now), and doing nothing with the kids invading TX and AZ - except turning them away. Period.
But don't you see that what you are advocating for is that our immigration laws should be upheld and not sell out our country to a special interest group and I commend you for that. That's the same thing that most GOPers are for. Should they change their stance on that for some so-called political reality even though it's not in the best interests of our citizens and country?
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Old 06-16-2014, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
20,807 posts, read 41,473,197 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
.....that most GOPers are for. Should they change their stance on that for some so-called political reality even though it's not in the best interests of our citizens and country?
It is not a "so-called" political reality. It - IS - the political reality. If a GOP president is unelectable on the national level because of disparate voting blocks (Hispanics, women), what good is their philosophy to the citizens and the country?
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Old 06-16-2014, 01:28 PM
 
31,500 posts, read 14,580,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
It is not a "so-called" political reality. It - IS - the political reality. If a GOP president is unelectable on the national level because of disparate voting blocks (Hispanics, women), what good is their philosophy to the citizens and the country?
But I asked you should some supposed political reality justify the GOP thumbing their noses at our immigration laws for a special interest group? You haven't answered that question yet. What philosophy? Our immigration laws aren't a philosophy.
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Old 06-16-2014, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Wisconsin
20,807 posts, read 41,473,197 times
Reputation: 14037
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
But I asked you should some supposed political reality justify the GOP thumbing their noses at our immigration laws for a special interest group?
That's not my question to answer. As a GOP voter, it's yours.
  • How high of a price do you, the GOP voter, want to pay for ignoring the political reality?
  • Do you want the GOP in the White House, or not?
If you don't care, then ignore the political reality - and forever be the party of the opposition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
What philosophy? Our immigration laws aren't a philosophy.
Oh, my goodness. Follow the law is a philosophy. Amnesty compromises on that. You need to argue your point with the leaders of your party - i.e., Lindsay Graham, Boehner - and, yes, Cantor. We should have stopped this undocumented worker stuff 30 years ago, but business wants this cheap labor - and the politicians close their eyes because big business lines their pockets.
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Old 06-16-2014, 02:24 PM
 
31,500 posts, read 14,580,770 times
Reputation: 8367
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariadne22 View Post
That's not my question to answer. As a GOP voter, it's yours.
  • How high of a price do you, the GOP voter, want to pay for ignoring the political reality?
  • Do you want the GOP in the White House, or not?
If you don't care, then ignore the political reality - and forever be the party of the opposition.


Oh, my goodness. Follow the law is a philosophy. Amnesty compromises on that. You need to argue your point with the leaders of your party - i.e., Lindsay Graham, Boehner - and, yes, Cantor. We should have stopped this undocumented worker stuff 30 years ago, but business wants this cheap labor - and the politicians close their eyes because big business lines their pockets.
Where did I say I was a GOP voter? If either party is willing to sacrifice our country for votes from those who don't have the national interest at heart then they can go down in flames as far as I'm concerned.

What you are saying essentially is that our politicians should do that to stay elected. We need a new party or a politician that cares about the rule of law and will stop at nothing to see that it's enforced. Most sane Americans can see why that is necessary. Hispanics only make up 10% of the voting block anyway. Maybe they could be educated on how desiring what they do based on ethnic ties will in the end affect them negatively also. Or are they unreachable on this issue? Laws are in place to protect the innocent. Are you saying they don't care?
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