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Old 10-24-2007, 06:16 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785

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Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
Runs both ways. Apparently you are saying that any nation that cannot protect its territory did not deserve to have it.. So, why complain when the Mexicans take back the Southwest?
Actually; I can 'see' at least the northern tier of Mexican states devolve to the USA--------there are some real fears (as told to me by a Mexican) that the former country may shatter courtesy of a civil war.

Apparently; the relatively affluent northern states (Baja California through Nuevo Leon) are being quite annoyed at subsidizing Chiapas, etc.

 
Old 10-24-2007, 06:17 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,706,273 times
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Actually Lakewooder, I would like you to read my post, and after that, tell me where I compared the US to Germany, as a follow up I would like you to paraphrase what I actually said, which had absolutely no reference to either the US nor Germany.

Did I call you a racist? Did you refer to particular cultural characteristics of illegal Mexicans? Are you able to discriminate between particular cultural characteristics of illegal and illegal Mexicans?

I went to a "harvest festival" at a local elementary school today. Food was brought in and all the fourth graders shared in the feast. This school is very poor, a mix of poor whites and Hispanics. A salient characteristic of the Hispanic parents is that they dressed well, the mothers wore nice slacks and blouses and jewelry and had their hair done up, the husbands wore clean jeans and button shirts.

The white parents didn't.

I saw among the Hispanic parents pride in themselves, in the school and in their children. These Hispanic families are mostly illegal, how do I know? The legal Hispanics and whites put their children on the free lunch program. The illegals pay for their children's lunch because they are afraid that if they fill out the paperwork ICE will come and get them. So, interestingly enough, the illegals are not getting the "free lunch" the citizens are taking.

A problem with this is Title 1. If a school has more than 50% of the students on the free lunch program they qualify as a Title 1 school and get federal dollars, enough to hire extra reading teachers (not esl, race is not a consideration for Title 1). Since the crackdown has begun illegals are hesitant to apply for free lunch, dropping the count to below 50% in many schools, and costing all the poor kids (whites too) the remediation they sorely need.
 
Old 10-24-2007, 06:24 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,706,273 times
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Quote:
And in 1821 Mexico won its independence from Spain. Had the former lost that war; many people (including the fathers of the Alamo defenders) would likely have been executed for treason.
Eh? Do you mean the fathers of Jim Bowie, Travis, Crockett etc? and how different was that from the fate of their sons?

Quote:
Actually; I can 'see' at least the northern tier of Mexican states devolve to the USA--------there are some real fears (as told to me by a Mexican) that the former country may shatter courtesy of a civil war.
They had one in the twentieth century a million persons lost their lives, they aren't going to have another, the sole reason for the Mexican army is to keep the internal peace, which is why the Army is scattered in small detachments throughout the country upon the Prussian model.

Arizonabear, are you aware that the US Army occupied Mexico City for two years, along with all the west coast ports and Veracruz?

Mexicans have a well founded fear and resentment of the United States.

The old saying, Poor Mexico, so far from God and so close to the United States.
 
Old 10-24-2007, 07:36 PM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,294,821 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Actually; I can 'see' at least the northern tier of Mexican states devolve to the USA--------there are some real fears (as told to me by a Mexican) that the former country may shatter courtesy of a civil war.

Apparently; the relatively affluent northern states (Baja California through Nuevo Leon) are being quite annoyed at subsidizing Chiapas, etc.
Don't count on it ArizonaBear, it is just a rumor that has been around since my grandparents were kids LOL and while it's true that we Mexicans are divided in a lot of issues, kind of like Americans on Illegal immigration nobody would ever want a civil war to happen or support it

but just for your information, there was a big budget rearrangement to give the poorest and most underdeveloped states (Chiapas, Oaxaca and Guerrero) a lot more money, Mexico's city mayor got mad because they took a big chunk of it's budget to give it to the other states

imho it was the best thing they did in all fairness it is true that millions were sent to those states, but is less than 3% of Mexico city's budget
 
Old 10-24-2007, 07:43 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,706,273 times
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Remember that Mexico is coming out of 70 years of corrupt single party rule, it may do very well in the next 20 years
 
Old 10-24-2007, 07:48 PM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,294,821 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
Remember that Mexico is coming out of 70 years of corrupt single party rule, it may do very well in the next 20 years
Yes I believe it too, actually Mexico had living standards similar to those of european countries from 1934 to 1970, it was after we had presidents of the George W Bush kind that our economy suffered a meltdown.

Echeverria, Lopez Portillo, Miguel de la Madrid and Salinas de Gortari each one of those shattered the economy, imagine what would happen if you had 4 Bushes one after the other running the American government.

I guess only time will tell, but I'm 95% sure that we'll start to see a yearly decline on illegal immigration from Mexico starting this year
 
Old 10-24-2007, 08:02 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
Eh? Do you mean the fathers of Jim Bowie, Travis, Crockett etc? and how different was that from the fate of their sons?
Please note the names of the defenders who survived the siege.

Quote:
Alamo survivors:

Susanna Dickinson
Angelina Dickinson
Joe the slave of William B. Travis
Sam the slave of Jim Bowie
Juana Navarro Alsbury
Alijo Perez Jr. ( he was the last living survivor of the Alamo battle, he died in 1918 )
Gertrudis Navarro
Ana Esparza
Enrique Esparza
Francisco Esparza
Manuel Esparza
Maria de Jesus Castro
Trinidad Saucedo
Petra Gonzales
Brigidio Guerrero
Henry Wornell
Battle of the Alamo
 
Old 10-24-2007, 08:10 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
They had one in the twentieth century a million persons lost their lives, they aren't going to have another, the sole reason for the Mexican army is to keep the internal peace, which is why the Army is scattered in small detachments throughout the country upon the Prussian model.

Arizonabear, are you aware that the US Army occupied Mexico City for two years, along with all the west coast ports and Veracruz?
I am aware of that history; yes

Quote:
Mexicans have a well founded fear and resentment of the United States.

The old saying, Poor Mexico, so far from God and so close to the United States.
Considering how many other cultures/races/ethnicities have suffered in just the last 150 years and are socio-economic powerhouses today: what makes Mexico so special?

If the Jews, Irish, Japanese, and many other groups can rise from poverty/wartime destruction/prejudice to affluence since 1848: why not the Mexicans?

For the record: the birthrate SOB is 2.39-----which is barely above replacement level (2.1). In other words: the 'little people' SOB are starting to take responsibility for themselves as a group
 
Old 10-24-2007, 08:18 PM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,294,821 times
Reputation: 1423
Hey, I know that a lot of immigrants come from Mexico, but that doesn't mean Mexico is a poor country, or that is economy is weak, the thing was that corruption created a monoparty system that concentrated all power and wealth.

this system allowed their friends to become extremely wealthy at the cost of the rest of the population, presidents had too much power and were ignorant of macroeconomics that created a series of crises starting around 1970 who destroyed purchasing power and life standards, if we add the effects of all the crisis our currency lost like 7000% of it's value and the combined inflation rate was around 17,000%

the last crisis we had was in 1994 and it was terrible, I still remember it but it was that crisis what finally brought democracy so I guess it was a necesary "evil"

I believe Mexico is on the right track to be a socio economic powerhouse and there might be some people who resents americans, but trust me they are a minory, most mexicans don't care and others like americans, specially those of us who make business NOB
 
Old 10-24-2007, 08:23 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Travelling fella View Post
Hey, I know that a lot of immigrants come from Mexico, but that doesn't mean Mexico is a poor country, or that is economy is weak, the thing was that corruption created a monoparty system that concentrated all power and wealth.

this system allowed their friends to become extremely wealthy at the cost of the rest of the population, presidents had too much power and were ignorant of macroeconomics that created a series of crises starting around 1970 who destroyed purchasing power and life standards, if we add the effects of all the crisis our currency lost like 7000% of it's value and the combined inflation rate was around 17,000%

the last crisis we had was in 1994 and it was terrible, I still remember it but it was that crisis what finally brought democracy so I guess it was a necesary "evil"

I believe Mexico is on the right track to be a socio economic powerhouse and there might be some people who resents americans, but trust me they are a minory, most mexicans don't care and others like americans, specially those of us who make business NOB
I suspect you are 100% right

Using Spain as an example: I truly believe that Mexico has a better than 50/50 shot at achieving affluence within 25 years.
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