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Old 03-17-2013, 02:27 PM
 
Location: The land where cats rule
10,946 posts, read 7,976,337 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
"The law"? The 14th Amendment has the Due Process Clause and the Equal Protection Clause in addition to the Citizenship Clause. It's a landmark notion in its entirety, and not just limited to the descendents of slaves.
But it is supposed to be limited to legal residents.
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Old 03-17-2013, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,112,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
I would change the law so that you are born a US citizen only if one of your parents is a US citizen.
That will require more than a "change (to) the law." That would require an Amendment to the Constitution.
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Old 03-17-2013, 02:39 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,112,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
The law was never intended for illegals to use it as a way to get around the immigration laws of this country.
That's because there was no such thing as "illegals" during most of the 500 years of Anglo-American common law that defines birthright citizenship. The Founders and Framers never even considered the idea that we should keep out people who want to come here.

So this is one of those cases where "original intent" pretty much bites the conservative position on the ass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute
The law was only intended for the children of slaves.
Wrong. You speak here of the 14th Amendment. But birthright citizenship was already the law here since before Independence. The 14th extended citizenship to freed slaves, certainly. But not by being "only intended" for them. Congress (and later the States via ratification) declared for everybody. Note: it says "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof..." not just "The children of slaves." And as the author of the citizenship clause pointed out, he was not changing the citizenship law one iota. He was merely being declarative of the law as it had always been.

Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute
It's best to replace this law with something that fits the modern situation -- which is that we offer far too generous of welfare handouts that only entice those who can't make it in their own countries to come on in.
Then you better get started on the Constitutional Amendment. They are hard and they take a long time.
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Old 03-17-2013, 02:40 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,112,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arjay51 View Post
But it is supposed to be limited to legal residents.
A half millennium of Anglo-English common law says, "Wrong."
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Old 03-17-2013, 04:24 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,565,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
"The law"? The 14th Amendment has the Due Process Clause and the Equal Protection Clause in addition to the Citizenship Clause. It's a landmark notion in its entirety, and not just limited to the descendents of slaves.
Liquid Reigns has debunked this over and over in here.
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Old 03-17-2013, 04:27 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
21,483 posts, read 26,089,700 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HistorianDude View Post
Then you better get started on the Constitutional Amendment. They are hard and they take a long time.
In your opinion, should we do this? It is not only poor illegals who are coming here to have babies in order to attain citizenship for them, people come here legally to do it, even though they have no desire to live and work here.
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Old 03-17-2013, 05:02 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,112,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
In your opinion, should we do this? It is not only poor illegals who are coming here to have babies in order to attain citizenship for them, people come here legally to do it, even though they have no desire to live and work here.
I am quite ambivalent as to whether or not birthright citizenship should be changed. But like John Adams I consider ourselves a nation of laws and not of men. The Constitution was made difficult to change specifically to buffer it from political fashion or the emotions of the masses. With the sole exception of the 18th Amendment, that carefully contrived gauntlet of Constitutional modification has not failed us.

If it is the desire of our nation to change our Constitution to eliminate or modify birthright citizenship, then the path before is clear regarding how to get that done.
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Old 03-17-2013, 05:03 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,112,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
Liquid Reigns has debunked this over and over in here.
Liquid Reigns has certainly made the effort. Sadly, he/she never was quite capable of the task.
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Old 03-17-2013, 06:11 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,010,077 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
Liquid Reigns has debunked this over and over in here.
I'm not sure what you are claiming has been "debunked", that the Equal Protection and Due Process Clauses are not also present in the 14th Amendment, or that the entire Amendment applies to more than just the descendents of slaves...
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Old 03-17-2013, 07:32 PM
 
Location: The land where cats rule
10,946 posts, read 7,976,337 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HistorianDude View Post
A half millennium of Anglo-English common law says, "Wrong."
And this is codified in the US Constitution? Where, exactly except in your biased imagination.
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