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Old 05-20-2013, 11:18 AM
 
Location: Oak Park, IL
405 posts, read 358,190 times
Reputation: 315

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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post

What happens when they all sign up for welfare benefits ?
The balance of the real price for that cheap remodeling, lawn care and restaurant food you've enjoyed over the past 25 years will come due and your taxes will go up. You know that of course!

 
Old 05-20-2013, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 69,881,813 times
Reputation: 27519
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Still not seeing the connection. Even if you really believe this, and I have no doubt you do because it's just so much more easy and convenient to malign people you think are inferior to yourself, I still don't see how low-skill, low-education, or even poor, automatically equates to lazy, welfare queens. There are plenty of people who fit that description who still work full-time jobs and do their best to support themselves and their families. Anyone who has ever been to a nation like Mexico could easily see that, yet you're telling me that that all changes instantly at the border? Nonsense.

And sorry, but you can find better sources than that. "Low immigration, pro immigrant". What could that possibly be code for? Hmmm...
Who said they are lazy ? Poor is poor. If you are un or under educated and have no skills you will end up in a low paying job and need government subsidies to live.

More than likely you don't see the connection because you don't want to.

The US has gone to great strides to get society educated at least through HS.
You now have a group, a rather large group, coming from a county where education is not valued and only mandated to 5th grade.

The Center for Immigration Studies puts out some realistic papers and articles.
Try reading them.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Center_...ration_Studies
The Center's staff have been called on to give testimony before federal and state legislators dozens of times and on numerous subjects within the realm of immigration.[10] In 2006 and 2007, as the U.S. Congress took up comprehensive immigration reform, they gave Congressional testimony on 27 different occasions.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 11:59 AM
 
Location: Phoenix
2,176 posts, read 862,447 times
Reputation: 1287
11 million is definitely low balling it. we need to build a border fence before discussing anything imo. anyone who wants to grant amnesty to atleast 11 million illegals before securing the border should be deported.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 03:08 PM
 
10,026 posts, read 8,856,225 times
Reputation: 5888
Get this, I recently went with a friend to apply for a job at WIC and she was rejected because she doesn't speak Spanish. I knew for awhile to get a job at public aid, welfare or any of the other safety net groups you needed to speak Spanish but it is now a requirement. Soon they won't even care if you can speak English to apply for a job there.

Sorry but I don't want to support people who come here from other countries legally or illegally. What has it gotten us? for one the Boston Marathon bombing by freeloaders from another country. In Illinois our taxes keep going up to pay for them. I know many Americans who lost jobs to both illegals and legal immigrants.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 03:34 PM
 
Location: Somewhere extremely awesome
2,836 posts, read 2,301,841 times
Reputation: 2181
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokesalad4u2 View Post
Once given amnesty don't forget they can bring in all their relatives.Also most agree its more like 30 million illegals here than 12.

But figure if they only have 5 relatives each,most have dozens some hundreds,so good bye America. Hello Mexico,Somalia,Asia and other nations with millions waiting for the gift.
Yay another thread full of people who dislike illegal immigration so much that they stop understanding math and geography (I thought Africa was the continent everybody wrongly thinks is a country, not Asia.)

I don't like illegal immigration at all, but demographics in the countries where most illegal immigrants come from are not favorable to sustain the increases that we had before. In fact, illegal immigration rates have slowed massively and may even be negative for the past few years.

Let's hail that as good news that America's policies to keep out illegal immigrants are working, instead of inventing bogeymen to hate on liberals. It will make your agenda a lot more credible.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 03:42 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,425 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
I wouldn't exactly call European colonization legal.
Most of it actually was, the natives here welcomed the settlers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
According to the Census, international migration will be the dominant form of US growth. International Migration is Projected to Become Primary Driver of U.S. Population Growth for First Time in Nearly Two Centuries - Population - Newsroom - U.S. Census Bureau

I can only imagine how frightening this must be for some of you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
No, they lived in tenements 20 to a room and contracted tuberculosis on a regular basis. Ah, the good old days Oh, and these were probably your ancestors. I'm not talking about Hispanics.
And most were screened prior to entry or leaving their own home lands, since most had to have the authorization of their own government to leave in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Because clearly none of these immigrants have a shred of pride, motivation or intelligence, so as soon as they're legal, they will immediate decide to live off the system. Despite the fact that they're leaving countries like Mexico that basically pay for their health care.
Some already are living off the system. Health care has no bearing on the matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Yes, I realize you missed the point. The nation already brought in millions and millions of impoverished long before Hispanics. Seems to have worked out just fine, despite the equally rabid anti-immigrant, anti-poor and pro-"real American" sentiment. A status on paper makes no guarantees as to a person's character. After all, I wouldn't trust most of you scooping my dog's crap off the sidewalk, and you're all legal.
If you look up the laws over the years, the impoverished were not allowed entry, most weren't even allowed citizenship prior to the Federal government taking it over.
I have your dogs crap on my shoe, I'll let you clean it off.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Just curious, though... what Native Americans had to give up their land for your ancestor homesteaders? Or were they already killed or moved beforehand so they didn't have to deal with the unwashed savages?
While it is a terrible thing that happened, to the victor go the spoils. Look at Latin American countries, all populated and ran by Europeans as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Because it's fun to watch you guys scramble and make excuses against historical context.
We wouldn't need to if you actually knew historical context, but since you need the education, we seem happy to teach you. I suggest learning instead of thinking you are smarter then the teacher.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Why only Spain?
Because if you knew anything about history you would know that Spain conquered and made slaves of the Indians, while the English, German, French, made agreements with the Indians.

Last edited by Yac; 05-21-2013 at 02:34 AM.. Reason: 3 posts in a row merged
 
Old 05-20-2013, 04:28 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,565,596 times
Reputation: 8350
"Malign people you think are inferior to yourself"? WTH does that mean? No, we object to people in our country illegally just like we object to citizen lawbreakers doing what they do.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Mexico City, formerly Columbus, Ohio
12,765 posts, read 12,744,983 times
Reputation: 5440
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Who said they are lazy ? Poor is poor. If you are un or under educated and have no skills you will end up in a low paying job and need government subsidies to live.

More than likely you don't see the connection because you don't want to.

The US has gone to great strides to get society educated at least through HS.
You now have a group, a rather large group, coming from a county where education is not valued and only mandated to 5th grade.

The Center for Immigration Studies puts out some realistic papers and articles.
Try reading them.
Center for Immigration Studies - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Center's staff have been called on to give testimony before federal and state legislators dozens of times and on numerous subjects within the realm of immigration.[10] In 2006 and 2007, as the U.S. Congress took up comprehensive immigration reform, they gave Congressional testimony on 27 different occasions.
You continue to associate things that don't have an automatic association, such as poor=uneducated, or immigrant=welfare. This is a classic case of forcing people into stereotypical groups to serve an agenda.

Education isn't valued in these other countries? What a laughably simplistic statement.

"Some" realistic papers? I don't doubt that, but there is also a very clear bias and I don't think this issue deserves that treatment. And let's be honest, television actors have been called to testify on issues. That's not that impressive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Most of it actually was, the natives here welcomed the settlers.



And most were screened prior to entry or leaving their own home lands, since most had to have the authorization of their own government to leave in the first place.

Some already are living off the system. Health care has no bearing on the matter.

If you look up the laws over the years, the impoverished were not allowed entry, most weren't even allowed citizenship prior to the Federal government taking it over.
I have your dogs crap on my shoe, I'll let you clean it off.

While it is a terrible thing that happened, to the victor go the spoils. Look at Latin American countries, all populated and ran by Europeans as well.
In some cases, they did, but there is a hell of a lot of backstory that goes with that. And it certainly wasn't universal or widespread. It happened a bit at the beginning of colonization, but it certainly wasn't a theme further west.

Because the letter of the law was the primary concern of European immigrants. Right. And give me a break about them not being impoverished. I'm sure the famines going on were no big deal and played no part in the waves of Irish and others. Citizenship is not the same as immigrating to a country. It's a granted status once they're there.

Why would you have my dog crap on your shoe to begin with?

What a lovely way to excuse continental genocide. BTW, if Hispanics end up being the majority in America, and they will, they have technically won too. I guess they can take whatever they want too, since the "victor go the spoils". I'm sure you'd be okay with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Because if you knew anything about history you would know that Spain conquered and made slaves of the Indians, while the English, German, French, made agreements with the Indians.
Wow, what incredibly ignorant and revisionist nonsense. No disagreement that the Spanish were awful to the people in Central and South America, but there is plenty of similar atrocity attributed to other groups in what would become the US and Canada. There is not a single European group that didn't have significant blood on its hands.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
"Malign people you think are inferior to yourself"? WTH does that mean? No, we object to people in our country illegally just like we object to citizen lawbreakers doing what they do.
The people you just described, the ones solely focused on the law, are an extreme minority when it comes to the anti-illegal group. I can't think of a single poster here like that. There are clear tones of racism, classism, etc. It's just easier for you to frame it as about the law, but people just aren't that pure of intent, not on issues like this.

Last edited by Yac; 05-21-2013 at 02:35 AM.. Reason: 4 posts in a row merged, please finally learn how to multi quote
 
Old 05-20-2013, 05:41 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,711,425 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
In some cases, they did, but there is a hell of a lot of backstory that goes with that. And it certainly wasn't universal or widespread. It happened a bit at the beginning of colonization, but it certainly wasn't a theme further west.
So it was all the "white" mans fault? Indians attacked many travelers as they went through territories for no other reason then they were white and wanted what ever they could get to trade for guns.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Because the letter of the law was the primary concern of European immigrants. Right. And give me a break about them not being impoverished. I'm sure the famines going on were no big deal and played no part in the waves of Irish and others. Citizenship is not the same as immigrating to a country. It's a granted status once they're there.
Look at that, you do know a little something about the first half of the 1800's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Why would you have my dog crap on your shoe to begin with?
You left it on the sidewalk instead of cleaning it up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
What a lovely way to excuse continental genocide. BTW, if Hispanics end up being the majority in America, and they will, they have technically won too. I guess they can take whatever they want too, since the "victor go the spoils". I'm sure you'd be okay with that.
Continental genocide? Hispanics have a long way to go to become the majority, centuries. Until that happens, none of us today will be around to see it, I guess your OK with keeping out illegals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
Wow, what incredibly ignorant and revisionist nonsense. No disagreement that the Spanish were awful to the people in Central and South America, but there is plenty of similar atrocity attributed to other groups in what would become the US and Canada. There is not a single European group that didn't have significant blood on its hands.
Revisionist non-sense? Actually there is very little "other" atrocities by other groups. Significant blood on their hands? Talk about revisionist history?

Last edited by Yac; 05-21-2013 at 02:36 AM..
 
Old 05-20-2013, 05:57 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,565,596 times
Reputation: 8350
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Revisionist non-sense? Actually there is very little "other" atrocities by other groups. Significant blood on their hands? Talk about revisionist history?
My question would be what has that to do with today? Those people are all dead now. Or are we guilty of what our ancestors did or didn't do long ago? My ancestors came here well after any conflicts with the so-called natives. The Mestizo Mexicans are the descenants of the Spaniards so what makes them any better than us?
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