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Because there are PLENTY OF LEGAL CITIZENS in this country who CANNOT get the help! A legal citizen, who has worked, who has contributed, who has a need for "generous help" can not always get it but some illegal with seven fricken kids can just swim a river, be here ILLEGALLY, (which is a CRIME), and get all kinds of money. And then sign up her friends to do the same!
And why, praytell, is that allowed to happen? Because of people with your mindset.
Genius.
To hell with the legal citizens of this country, they don't know hardship, (bullsh**), give it to those from poor countries who come here illegally and take advantage of the system, NEVER contribute, never pay back and recruit their friends and family to ALSO take, take, take.
Take your strawman and burn it. It does not have any place in this particular discussion.
Tell me about it, i have a friend who was turned down for disability. She has a pacemaker, diabetes, can't move her hands, arthritis so very bad, and bad legs from her diabetes. She cannot work, too many problems.
She was turned down for disability. She is a legal citizen of this Country who before all her problems worked her butt off and took care of herself and her husband, they both worked. Until she no longer could.
It is outrageous that she was turned down with all her problems, and those who can so easily break our laws, make demands, get all the assistance that we provide them. Something very wrong with this picture. What if you needed disability, and were turned down, but a illegal got that assistance you need.
But illegal aliens can't collect benefits they say...!
Oh wait.
You all have known for years illegal aliens have been recieving benefits. I could understand if this thread was 5 years old...but it is not new nor is should the realization that illegal aliens recieve benefits is "news" in any sense of the word.
come on KAAC...how long have you known illegal aliens recieve benefits?
You all have known for years illegal aliens have been recieving benefits. I could understand if this thread was 5 years old...but it is not new nor is should the realization that illegal aliens recieve benefits is "news" in any sense of the word.
come on KAAC...how long have you known illegal aliens recieve benefits?
I was being sarcastic because a lot of the illegal alien sympathizers swear up and down they don't.
The greed in this country is so absurd to me. In my culture, we are hospitable and respectful to all human beings. <snip>
If people need help and you have the means to provide in a rationed amount that's helpful, then we shouldn't be selfish. <snip>
But this is just my own opinion that America needs to be open to a different reality now.
<snip>
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yiuppy
<snip>
But it's happening, and they can't be left starving and diseased and homeless - undocumented or not. Humans are imperfect, circumstances happen that weren't foreseeable, and we take care of one another. <snip> .
I suppose!
In the illegal immigration forum you are ALL for assisting in whatever fashion is necessary to accomodate undocument immigrants to this country, America. In the c-d forum, Washington, D.C. specifically, there is a recent rant about vagrants begging for change (change Yiuppy, not healthcare, not food stamps, not housing...change, coins from a fast food purchase.
After reading it I cannot fathom how you are able to be so glib about providing benefits to illegal aliens (yes, that's exactly what they are Yiuppy...illegal aliens) and their numerous offspring and yet you cringe at giving him a quarter to avoid cursing at him and seeming selfish in front of 20 people, but it really felt like I had been robbed.
So what is it exactly? When you have to SEE the poverty IN REAL LIFE does it offend your delicate sensibilities? As long as you don't have to deal with the poverty and illegality of illegal aliens you're just fine with us paying our taxes and all the financial needs are met through the various governmental agencies to provide for those less fortunate.
I sincerely doubt that you will reply to my query but I would really like to know how you justify the various benefits for so many illegal aliens and yet are so offended and disgusted about what appears to be a legal resident of Washington, D.C. and his begging for spare change.
I certainly hope you develop a better conscience and attitude to those among us who are in as such dire straits as you perceive the illegal aliens to be in. As you inferred, the vagrants begging for change are human beings as well and perhaps just as deserving of the same compassion and generosity you would give freely to illegal aliens.
The nerve of those vagrants begging for loose change...
I grabbed lunch from a place the other day EOTR, and some guy was inside begging for change from customers AT the cash register. It was unbelievable to me that in this restaurant, I felt like I got robbed of a quarter when I paid for my food, because this man came to the line, where people make their transactions, and while collecting change, he'd ask for change. I gave him a quarter to avoid cursing at him and seeming selfish in front of 20 people, but it really felt like I had been robbed.
What ever happened to people being OUTSIDE and just holding out a cup for people to give on their own will? Now beggers are coming right up to the transaction counter while you exchange money, and ask for it. Really absurd and it will not happen again to me. So I think the OP makes a good point. However, it's not the begging or just being at public places that's so bad; it's how they behave that's such an annoyance to everyone else.
In the illegal immigration forum you are ALL for assisting in whatever fashion is necessary to accomodate undocument immigrants to this country, America. In the c-d forum, Washington, D.C. specifically, there is a recent rant about vagrants begging for change (change Yiuppy, not healthcare, not food stamps, not housing...change, coins from a fast food purchase.
After reading it I cannot fathom how you are able to be so glib about providing benefits to illegal aliens (yes, that's exactly what they are Yiuppy...illegal aliens) and their numerous offspring and yet you cringe at giving him a quarter to avoid cursing at him and seeming selfish in front of 20 people, but it really felt like I had been robbed.
So what is it exactly? When you have to SEE the poverty IN REAL LIFE does it offend your delicate sensibilities? As long as you don't have to deal with the poverty and illegality of illegal aliens you're just fine with us paying our taxes and all the financial needs are met through the various governmental agencies to provide for those less fortunate.
I sincerely doubt that you will reply to my query but I would really like to know how you justify the various benefits for so many illegal aliens and yet are so offended and disgusted about what appears to be a legal resident of Washington, D.C. and his begging for spare change.
I certainly hope you develop a better conscience and attitude to those among us who are in as such dire straits as you perceive the illegal aliens to be in. As you inferred, the vagrants begging for change are human beings as well and perhaps just as deserving of the same compassion and generosity you would give freely to illegal aliens.
The nerve of those vagrants begging for loose change...
What's the matter, Yiuppy? It bothered you when the money came directly from your own pocket?!
THAT'S THE POINT!
So...who cares about those who are legal citizens and need help, you only care about those who are flooding across the border, ILLEGALLY, because you think that back in their home country, it is all dirt fields and mud houses.
Honestly, I would be quite offended with how you think those countries are if I came from there. The way you talk, they are dumb, dirt poor, and live in caves. Do you seriously think NONE of them know how to fish or sew? Seriously? Do you really think they are stupid? Because that is what your words say. Your words say that they have NO skills and the only way for them to get skills is to come here.
No, this is a "get rich quick" scheme. They come here, they get benefits and hand outs, some do work, under the table and they send all of that money back to their family from their country. Now, it's too bad that their country does not have livable wages, according to them, but they need to work on things in THEIR country, not come here for hand outs.
If you TRULY wanted to help, Yiuppy, you know, "teach them to fish", instead of handing them fish every day, you would help them learn to live in THEIR OWN COUNTRY.
So, aside from a quarter, only so that you didn't look bad in front of others, what HAVE you done for anyone who is in desperate need of fishing and sewing skills and "generous help"?
For those who say illegals can't receive welfare, just look at Illinois "moms and babies" program where it states "you qualify regardless of immigration status" or "you don't need a social security card". It is common knowledge in Illinois a huge percentage of people on assistance are illegals.
What's the matter, Yiuppy? It bothered you when the money came directly from your own pocket?!
THAT'S THE POINT!
So...who cares about those who are legal citizens and need help, you only care about those who are flooding across the border, ILLEGALLY, because you think that back in their home country, it is all dirt fields and mud houses.
Honestly, I would be quite offended with how you think those countries are if I came from there. The way you talk, they are dumb, dirt poor, and live in caves. Do you seriously think NONE of them know how to fish or sew? Seriously? Do you really think they are stupid? Because that is what your words say. Your words say that they have NO skills and the only way for them to get skills is to come here.
No, this is a "get rich quick" scheme. They come here, they get benefits and hand outs, some do work, under the table and they send all of that money back to their family from their country. Now, it's too bad that their country does not have livable wages, according to them, but they need to work on things in THEIR country, not come here for hand outs.
If you TRULY wanted to help, Yiuppy, you know, "teach them to fish", instead of handing them fish every day, you would help them learn to live in THEIR OWN COUNTRY.
So, aside from a quarter, only so that you didn't look bad in front of others, what HAVE you done for anyone who is in desperate need of fishing and sewing skills and "generous help"?
If you read the post (which is in a thread which I did not create), I did not complain about giving money, nor about giving charity, but about the manner that I was approached for it that I found inappropriate. Never said anything about not giving to charity. And since you ask, my life has almost always been in non-profits and positions where I was working for close to free for causes I believe in because I grew up in poverty and a violent environment. I've been in the position of a begger. I haven't responded to these posts because they're just argumentative and just their opinion I'm not going to spend forever arguing fundamentally different opinions; but I haven't contradicted myself in my actions at all. Nothing I said is contradicted at all.
And I'd appreciate a lack of personal attacks on my life, you don't know anything about my life so keep your opinion on the topic.
I don't agree with letting people die in the streets just because they don't have citizenship. I won't be changing my opinion on that any time soon. As I said before: the only viable, humane option for resolving the so-called problem of an influx of undocumented people is to treat them like human beings, have essential services available to them (food, shelter, labor, education) without a threat of prosecution unless they're a public safety threat, and that would provide an incentive to pursue the legal right-of-way in becoming citizens.
Many are in fear of being sent to jail and/or deported. Not all undocumented people are from Mexico - many are from Guatemala, Honduras, Colombia, El Salvador, and Russia among others. Some of these countries are infamous for cartels, and Honduras currently is the most dangerous place in the world due to its high murder rate - the murder capital of the world. And Mexico is not so wonderful, as those touristy commercials may make it seem. Almost every person I've ever met who was a foreigner wants to work and just want to earn a decent living, not make trouble or be "welfare queens". Look around you, I see lots of legal residents working. If they all came here to "take our jobs" then they wouldn't just be coming to collect "an easy living" on welfare as some of you have said. What an ignorant perception of people you know nothing about.
If the pathway to legal residency-to-citizenship were cleared for undocumented persons to pursue without threat of prosecution, they will take it.
There is currently no better more realistic way of dealing with it. You can't kill them all, you can't jail them all, and you can't deport them all. It makes more sense and is more practical to help them live here than to have our government attempt to change policies or the economics of countries - of which America knows very little about for the most part - to make them more accommodating. If that means paying an extra two dollars per year, it won't break us. Greed and war is, though, regardless of the immigration situation. Nearly three trillion dollars (not including the so-called black budget) on unnecessary warfare versus xx billion dollars on food stamp programs? Drop in the bucket. It's clear where the compensating funds should be coming from and what the anger over the perceived lack of affordability for providing services to amnesty should be directed toward. Just my opinion.
I don't agree with letting people die in the streets just because they don't have citizenship. I won't be changing my opinion on that any time soon. As I said before: the only viable, humane option for resolving the so-called problem of an influx of undocumented people is to treat them like human beings, have essential services available to them (food, shelter, labor, education) without a threat of prosecution unless they're a public safety threat, and that would provide an incentive to pursue the legal right-of-way in becoming citizens.
Many are in fear of being sent to jail and/or deported. Not all undocumented people are from Mexico - many are from Guatemala, Honduras, Colombia, El Salvador, and Russia among others. Some of these countries are infamous for cartels, and Honduras currently is the most dangerous place in the world due to its high murder rate - the murder capital of the world. And Mexico is not so wonderful, as those touristy commercials may make it seem. Almost every person I've ever met who was a foreigner wants to work and just want to earn a decent living, not make trouble or be "welfare queens". Look around you, I see lots of legal residents working. If they all came here to "take our jobs" then they wouldn't just be coming to collect "an easy living" on welfare as some of you have said. What an ignorant perception of people you know nothing about.
There is currently no better more realistic way of dealing with it. You can't kill them all, you can't jail them all, and you can't deport them all. It makes more sense and is more practical to help them live here than to have our government attempt to change policies or the economics of countries - of which America knows very little about for the most part - to make them more accommodating. If that means paying an extra two dollars per year, it won't break us. Greed and war is, though, regardless of the immigration situation. Nearly three trillion dollars (not including the so-called black budget) on unnecessary warfare versus xx billion dollars on food stamp programs? Drop in the bucket. It's clear where the compensating funds should be coming from and what the anger over the perceived lack of affordability for providing services to amnesty should be directed toward. Just my opinion.
Have you traveled? I have and a lot. Take thailand for example. No welfare, no social security and no unemployment. Yet I see more people begging in this country in DC or NY in 1 hour than I see on a 3 week trip to Bangkok.
What makes you think that they would starve? Who feeds them when they first sneak over the border?
They will self deport.
Take away the means and they will self deport. Look at the states who stepped up enforcement. Those illegals self deported to more friendly states.
It is a myth that they will starve.
I don't agree with letting people die in the streets just because they don't have citizenship. I won't be changing my opinion on that any time soon. As I said before: the only viable, humane option for resolving the so-called problem of an influx of undocumented people is to treat them like human beings, have essential services available to them (food, shelter, labor, education) without a threat of prosecution unless they're a public safety threat, and that would provide an incentive to pursue the legal right-of-way in becoming citizens.
Many are in fear of being sent to jail and/or deported. Not all undocumented people are from Mexico - many are from Guatemala, Honduras, Colombia, El Salvador, and Russia among others. Some of these countries are infamous for cartels, and Honduras currently is the most dangerous place in the world due to its high murder rate - the murder capital of the world. And Mexico is not so wonderful, as those touristy commercials may make it seem. Almost every person I've ever met who was a foreigner wants to work and just want to earn a decent living, not make trouble or be "welfare queens". Look around you, I see lots of legal residents working. If they all came here to "take our jobs" then they wouldn't just be coming to collect "an easy living" on welfare as some of you have said. What an ignorant perception of people you know nothing about.
If the pathway to legal residency-to-citizenship were cleared for undocumented persons to pursue without threat of prosecution, they will take it.
There is currently no better more realistic way of dealing with it. You can't kill them all, you can't jail them all, and you can't deport them all. It makes more sense and is more practical to help them live here than to have our government attempt to change policies or the economics of countries - of which America knows very little about for the most part - to make them more accommodating. If that means paying an extra two dollars per year, it won't break us. Greed and war is, though, regardless of the immigration situation. Nearly three trillion dollars (not including the so-called black budget) on unnecessary warfare versus xx billion dollars on food stamp programs? Drop in the bucket. It's clear where the compensating funds should be coming from and what the anger over the perceived lack of affordability for providing services to amnesty should be directed toward. Just my opinion.
No. Another viable alternative is mining the border and shooting anyone who crosses illegally. Those are both viable options too and one day, like it or not, its going to come to that point. This country is already bursting at its seams with being able to provide social programs of the people who live here legally. When that money starts to dry up even more, people ARE going to force the government to do something about it. Pretty soon something is going to give and when it does, its not going to be pretty.
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Really, it is all about perspective...
