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Old 08-07-2013, 07:10 AM
 
62,727 posts, read 28,935,937 times
Reputation: 18489

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It is against the law to stand on corners waiting for a contractor to pick one up for day labor. It is evading taxes, insurance, etc. by both the worker and the contractor. If that person is an illegal then that is another infraction of the law. Just what doesn't make sense and what has this to do with conservatism?
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Old 08-07-2013, 07:29 AM
 
Location: Too far from home.
8,732 posts, read 6,769,906 times
Reputation: 2374
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
You might be interested in this also. Sounds like someone needs to address their own hypocricy. Scroll down to the last post. Quote: " You are un-American when you support illegals entering the US illegallly when there is no demand for them, support illegals who take from Americans in more ways than one"

Don't call me a "racist"
Hola inta humar. You failed to understand my original post. I admitted that I allowed myself to get sucked into the ugliness you embrace and is so ingrained in you. Not one of my most proudest moments, but one of my most embarrassing moments. I checked myself and corrected myself. I also didn't make that statement to anyone in particular.

But thank you for taking such an interest in me and making me your pet project.
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Old 08-07-2013, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,299 posts, read 4,835,771 times
Reputation: 603
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
It is against the law to stand on corners waiting for a contractor to pick one up for day labor. It is evading taxes, insurance, etc. by both the worker and the contractor. If that person is an illegal then that is another infraction of the law. Just what doesn't make sense and what has this to do with conservatism?
It is illegal in some areas of the United States to proposition for day labor by those methods. The portions of SB1070 for the state of Arizona that were going to enforce sanctions on day labor were struck down as unconstitutional. Don't represent something as being "against the law" across the country when it is not.
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Old 08-07-2013, 12:23 PM
 
1,866 posts, read 2,697,206 times
Reputation: 1467
Quote:
Originally Posted by softblueyz View Post
Hola inta humar. You failed to understand my original post. I admitted that I allowed myself to get sucked into the ugliness you embrace and is so ingrained in you. Not one of my most proudest moments, but one of my most embarrassing moments. I checked myself and corrected myself. I also didn't make that statement to anyone in particular.

But thank you for taking such an interest in me and making me your pet project.
I know right! Doesn't it make you feel good when old yeller takes special interest in you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
It is illegal in some areas of the United States to proposition for day labor by those methods. The portions of SB1070 for the state of Arizona that were going to enforce sanctions on day labor were struck down as unconstitutional. Don't represent something as being "against the law" across the country when it is not.
Well if they had there way, I am sure it would be lol
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Old 08-07-2013, 12:40 PM
 
Location: The Brat Stop
8,347 posts, read 7,224,659 times
Reputation: 2279
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Come on Jive I made no such statement. The illegals didn't show up in mass, it was a gradual affair. And yes they did force legals out because they can do it cheaper. They dont have to pay the taxes or back their work.
I never met a drywall contractor standing on a corner waiting for a builder to hire them. Builders learned that they could find the illegals by trolling the home depot parking lots etc. Legals have been forced from their trades and this is only one piece of the problem.
One can argue that illegals are hard workers. So are americans. One can not argue that this country can't survive without illegals.
Basically, it is, I just helped clarify your statement.

Illegals didn't show up en masse?

I don't want to be condescending to you, but, may I ask how old you are? where have you been?

Let me expound, in 1990, I drove a semi tractor trailer, picking up and delivering foods. Most prepared foods were either put onto the floor of trailers with slip sheets, or on pallets. At the delivery points, the food warehouses required that the foods be put onto what they called "small wood" that is, a standard pallet/skid is 40"x 48" small wood was considered 40" x 40" or smaller.

It was the driver's responsibility to move these foods from either standardized pallets or floor loads onto "small wood". Many drivers, like myself, after driving for 10-12 hours wanted no part of moving freight off of their trailers, therefore, hanging around at the warehouses were Mexican illegals, which were called "lumpers". For a fee, they would move the driver's load from standard pallets or the floors of trailers onto the warehouse's "small wood".

The "lumpers" or Mexican illegals were everywhere. They sat in the break rooms of these warehouses and waited for truckloads to arrive to earn money.
Not only that, but many illegals picked produce for farmers before automation took over where it was primarily human labor before.

So, saying illegals didn't show up en masse isn't exactly fact, it's just that these days, with the problems America faces, illegals have been put onto the front burner from the back burner of the stove, so to speak.

If America, and Americans weren't facing tough times, and financial difficulties, rest assured, this illegal immigration stuff would be on the back burner again, where it's been for years and years until recently.

In 1976, I worked as a truck mechanic for a company in Chicago. One sunny afternoon, many unmarked cars filled with immigration officers raided my workplace. Many illegals fled the building into the streets and were chased for blocks, most, if not all were rounded up and taken into custody. In all, approximately 35 to 40 illegals were found. Chicago police showed up after the raid.

Just so you and everyone reading knows, illegal immigration into the United States has been a ongoing problem for years and years, the description of en masse just didn't happen last year.
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Old 08-07-2013, 12:43 PM
 
62,727 posts, read 28,935,937 times
Reputation: 18489
What is against the law all over this country is standing on street corners soliciting for work if one is here illegally in our country and also evades taxes by doing so. Tax evasion is also against the law whether the worker is legal or illegal and the employer evades taxes also. Those are the facts.
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Old 08-07-2013, 01:01 PM
 
2,463 posts, read 2,780,074 times
Reputation: 3627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
Why would anyone get ticked about someone pointing out the facts and truth such as how much illegals are costing our country? Does one prefer to stick their head in the sand because they can't accept the truth because it doesn't fit their agenda/ideologies?
They get ticked because they can't hide from the facts, real statistics don't lie, and they don't necessarily belong just in the "illegal" forum, but....hmm..uh, in the legal forum as well. Illegal immigration costs this country an enormous amount of money. I work in a hospital and I see the effects it is taking alone on health care. Not only do illegals come here for free health care, but often times their condition is very serious, and their illness puts other workers, patients, and other citizens at risk.

The cost of allowing children here illegally, who don't speak English, whom receive free breakfast and lunches, are not just expensive for the tax payer, but put a toll on the quality of education as a whole. When we see these commercials with Al Roker from the Today show talk about how the U.S. could be in trouble, unable to compete with other industrialized countries which are graduating more students better able to handle math and science, this is about immigration. I have known many teachers who understand all to well this is about foreign students who don't speak English, and often lag behind in studies.

We can also talk about the severe lack of jobs for current U.S. citizens and how immigration exacerbates an already high U.S. unemployment rate; the lack of affordable housing, the drain on subsidies specifically created for citizens given to illegals, and the cost to the environment, with an ever increasing carbon footprint, overfilled landfills, and dwindling water supply, and the disproportionate amount of prison inmates who came here illegally in our legal system, many of which committed terrible crimes which also cost us. The media does a spectacular job at hiding all this from us, afraid of the backlash from the poor illegals only looking for a better life; we have allowed our behavior to be modified, to irrationally fear the most horrible label of all.....to be, labelled "racist!" This word continues to be so misused, and exaggerated because the pro-illegal forces, no it works quite well with their guerrilla tactics.
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Old 08-07-2013, 03:17 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,300 posts, read 22,182,754 times
Reputation: 6552
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoJiveMan View Post
Basically, it is, I just helped clarify your statement.

Illegals didn't show up en masse?

I don't want to be condescending to you, but, may I ask how old you are? where have you been?

Let me expound, in 1990, I drove a semi tractor trailer, picking up and delivering foods. Most prepared foods were either put onto the floor of trailers with slip sheets, or on pallets. At the delivery points, the food warehouses required that the foods be put onto what they called "small wood" that is, a standard pallet/skid is 40"x 48" small wood was considered 40" x 40" or smaller.

It was the driver's responsibility to move these foods from either standardized pallets or floor loads onto "small wood". Many drivers, like myself, after driving for 10-12 hours wanted no part of moving freight off of their trailers, therefore, hanging around at the warehouses were Mexican illegals, which were called "lumpers". For a fee, they would move the driver's load from standard pallets or the floors of trailers onto the warehouse's "small wood".

The "lumpers" or Mexican illegals were everywhere. They sat in the break rooms of these warehouses and waited for truckloads to arrive to earn money.
Not only that, but many illegals picked produce for farmers before automation took over where it was primarily human labor before.

So, saying illegals didn't show up en masse isn't exactly fact, it's just that these days, with the problems America faces, illegals have been put onto the front burner from the back burner of the stove, so to speak.

If America, and Americans weren't facing tough times, and financial difficulties, rest assured, this illegal immigration stuff would be on the back burner again, where it's been for years and years until recently.

In 1976, I worked as a truck mechanic for a company in Chicago. One sunny afternoon, many unmarked cars filled with immigration officers raided my workplace. Many illegals fled the building into the streets and were chased for blocks, most, if not all were rounded up and taken into custody. In all, approximately 35 to 40 illegals were found. Chicago police showed up after the raid.

Just so you and everyone reading knows, illegal immigration into the United States has been a ongoing problem for years and years, the description of en masse just didn't happen last year.
51 years old in Dec. Been to or lived in most of the states at some point, been to 27 different countries.
My point about en mass was 11 million illegals didnt show up over night to do construction or any other job in any given state.. This mass illegal immigration problem has been an ongoing problem because our Federal gov refuses to do their job in regards to securing our borders and prosecuting employers.
I agree with most of your post. The illegals started flooding the construction trades in the late 80's and early 90's and it has been a down hill spiral ever since. For a while I did construction with my brothers and cousins as a second job. You would see 10 hispanics show up to hang sheet rock in a house using the most basic of tools. We would wonder how you can split 120 boards at piece rate among 10 people? At the time the going rate was about $3 a board to hang it and the average house was about 120 boards. As many in the trades do we would go look at others work and see how they compare to our own. We used glue and screws, rotozip the outlets etc. We were shocked at the low quality of work. They used nails in the field and no glue. Worse still the standard at the time was if you only used nails you needed a nail every 8 inches on every nailer. They used only 1 in the field. The finisher who was a friend of ours laughed when we asked him about it. He said why do you think the builder wants me here the minute those guys are out of the house? In later years the illegals started doing the finish work as well. By then I was out of the trades doing what I do now.
My cousins now own a large construction company that pretty much sticks to commercial work. They tell me it is only worse.
Locally they have a few stone quarries. 2 of them were caught using illegals. Employees called INS and later homeland security. In a small town people know everyones business. It is one of the few things I don't like about living where I do. They complained about how long it took for the Gov to step in and investigate. The quarries amazingly saw no real penalty, but do to local outrage changed their hiring practices.
A local meat packing plant was also raided, they also have changed their practices. I am fortunate to live in the NE. We do see some illegals but we seem to be far enough away that it isn't the issue that is down south.
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Old 08-07-2013, 03:21 PM
 
62,727 posts, read 28,935,937 times
Reputation: 18489
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9162 View Post
They get ticked because they can't hide from the facts, real statistics don't lie, and they don't necessarily belong just in the "illegal" forum, but....hmm..uh, in the legal forum as well. Illegal immigration costs this country an enormous amount of money. I work in a hospital and I see the effects it is taking alone on health care. Not only do illegals come here for free health care, but often times their condition is very serious, and their illness puts other workers, patients, and other citizens at risk.

The cost of allowing children here illegally, who don't speak English, whom receive free breakfast and lunches, are not just expensive for the tax payer, but put a toll on the quality of education as a whole. When we see these commercials with Al Roker from the Today show talk about how the U.S. could be in trouble, unable to compete with other industrialized countries which are graduating more students better able to handle math and science, this is about immigration. I have known many teachers who understand all to well this is about foreign students who don't speak English, and often lag behind in studies.

We can also talk about the severe lack of jobs for current U.S. citizens and how immigration exacerbates an already high U.S. unemployment rate; the lack of affordable housing, the drain on subsidies specifically created for citizens given to illegals, and the cost to the environment, with an ever increasing carbon footprint, overfilled landfills, and dwindling water supply, and the disproportionate amount of prison inmates who came here illegally in our legal system, many of which committed terrible crimes which also cost us. The media does a spectacular job at hiding all this from us, afraid of the backlash from the poor illegals only looking for a better life; we have allowed our behavior to be modified, to irrationally fear the most horrible label of all.....to be, labelled "racist!" This word continues to be so misused, and exaggerated because the pro-illegal forces, no it works quite well with their guerrilla tactics.
I agree with all you have said. It is a mystery to me how anyone can be such a bleeding heart liberal or so blinded by ethnic ties that don't care how illegal immigration is affecting the citizens of this country and any American who dares protest this mess, desires the enforcement of our immigration laws rather than amnesty and points out the negative facts of this issue gets those nasty, unwarranted labels put on them. All I can do is shake my head in disbelief.
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Old 08-07-2013, 04:07 PM
 
62,727 posts, read 28,935,937 times
Reputation: 18489
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
51 years old in Dec. Been to or lived in most of the states at some point, been to 27 different countries.
My point about en mass was 11 million illegals didnt show up over night to do construction or any other job in any given state.. This mass illegal immigration problem has been an ongoing problem because our Federal gov refuses to do their job in regards to securing our borders and prosecuting employers.
I agree with most of your post. The illegals started flooding the construction trades in the late 80's and early 90's and it has been a down hill spiral ever since. For a while I did construction with my brothers and cousins as a second job. You would see 10 hispanics show up to hang sheet rock in a house using the most basic of tools. We would wonder how you can split 120 boards at piece rate among 10 people? At the time the going rate was about $3 a board to hang it and the average house was about 120 boards. As many in the trades do we would go look at others work and see how they compare to our own. We used glue and screws, rotozip the outlets etc. We were shocked at the low quality of work. They used nails in the field and no glue. Worse still the standard at the time was if you only used nails you needed a nail every 8 inches on every nailer. They used only 1 in the field. The finisher who was a friend of ours laughed when we asked him about it. He said why do you think the builder wants me here the minute those guys are out of the house? In later years the illegals started doing the finish work as well. By then I was out of the trades doing what I do now.
My cousins now own a large construction company that pretty much sticks to commercial work. They tell me it is only worse.
Locally they have a few stone quarries. 2 of them were caught using illegals. Employees called INS and later homeland security. In a small town people know everyones business. It is one of the few things I don't like about living where I do. They complained about how long it took for the Gov to step in and investigate. The quarries amazingly saw no real penalty, but do to local outrage changed their hiring practices.
A local meat packing plant was also raided, they also have changed their practices. I am fortunate to live in the NE. We do see some illegals but we seem to be far enough away that it isn't the issue that is down south.
I will just add these remarks to your post. As an analogy to why illegal immigration has become a major issue today.... when one has a small scratch on their hand they aren't likely to get worked up about it but when it is an infected, gaping wound that's an entire different story. It isn't just that jobs are scarce or that our economy is in the dumps that we have been taking notice about illegal immigration of late but the sheer numbers of illegal aliens compared to say 30 years ago. The more illegals there are here the more our taxes go up also. The more crowded conditions in our schools, jails, hospitals and neighborhoods. Their kids are attending our schools and don't know a lick of English either which burdens our schools and holds our own kids back.

All these things provided in Spanish now isn't because of Hispanic-Americans because they are usually bi-lingual. Many employers are demanding one know Spanish to get a job with them now. Is that due to the number of Hispanic-Americans in this country or even legal immigrants? I don't think so. So now native English speaking Americans are being discriminated against in hiring practices so that these greedy employers can accommodate and tap into the buying power of illegal aliens. I realize that some of them do know English but I don't think most of them do unless they have lived here for a long time. They make their preference to be pandered to in Spanish known anyway and these greedy employers and our PC government is glad to accommodate them.

I can relate to your story about shabby workmanship. There is a whole tract of homes across the street from me that rumor is that a lot of illegal alien labor was used to build. Those homes fell apart in no time and many of the owners who bought them vacated them. It was a dumpy neighborhood for awhile because of all the vacancies. People have since bought them at a fraction of what they cost originally and fixed them up.

So illegals are hanging out at companies and allowed to work odd jobs or even full time jobs? What part of that it is illegal for both the employer and the illegal isn't one getting? It's always the same excuse by these people that they can't find an American to do the job because they are too lazy. Gee, does that include Hispanic-Americans also then? I guess so cause they can only seem to hire the illegal kind. I am sick of these lies. It's all about saving a buck by hiring cheap, illegal labor, period!
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