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Old 08-15-2013, 12:06 AM
 
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These leeching idiots can push themselves back to Mexico where they belong.
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Old 08-15-2013, 12:16 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,012,769 times
Reputation: 601
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
He cut off the Indians' feet to control them and teach them a lesson.



Facts On File History Database Center

Four centuries ago, in 1598, Juan de Oņate led a group of settlers out of modern-day Chihuahua, Mexico, to colonize New Mexico. Previous white explorers had visited New Mexico before Oņate, most notably Francisco Coronado in 1540, but none of these earlier expeditions led to successful long-term European settlement. Although he is largely forgotten today, Oņate settled the first colony in New Mexico, at San Juan de los Caballeros, nearly a decade before the English founded their first permanent settlement at Jamestown, Virginia, in 1607.

Oņate, reasoning that any rebellion must be punished immediately before the spirit of resistance spread, dispatched a force of 70 soldiers to attack the pueblo. Eight hundred Indians died in the resulting battle, and 500, including men, women, and children, were taken prisoner. The captives were convicted on charges of murder and of failing to give the Spanish the supplies they demanded. All prisoners over the age of 12 were sentenced to 20 years of slavery, and all men over the age of 25 had one foot cut off. The children were given as servants to Spanish settlers and monasteries.
But Oņate wasn't Mexican, he lived and died before that nation was established...
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Old 08-15-2013, 07:17 AM
 
31,512 posts, read 14,580,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antarez View Post
These leeching idiots can push themselves back to Mexico where they belong.
All illegals need to go back to their homelands. I wish the defenders of them would make up their minds which country and which citizens their loyalty lays with. If their loyalty doesn't lay with this country and its citizens then perhaps they should move to the country where their loyalty does lay with.
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Old 08-15-2013, 10:06 AM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,712,641 times
Reputation: 299
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
We are not a Hispanic nation in identity and never were. English has always been our de facto national language.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackscorpion View Post
Umm yes we were, jesus did you learn anything in history? Who was here fighting with the indians over land before the colonization of America? So yes at one point native americans as well as mexicans did inhabit this land. Actually since oldglory has such a problem with people not learning English, then maybe he can start teaching it to people that need it? Still waiting for an answer! lol
Lets look back upon history..... So the Spanish who claimed the West Indies and Florida and then later what is now Central America to include now Mexico, weren't here "fighting" with the "Indians" over land. The Spanish explored areas of what is now our SW, they set up small garrisons and later small settlements, mostly along the gulf and inland along the rivers within a few short miles from the gulf.

Now, the English and French arrived later and claimed different territories and pretty much did the same as the Spanish, small settlements. Only the English prevailed in populating with its colonizing, Spain was never interested in colonizing, only exploring and extorting riches. The French merely explored.

Spain inhabited small portions of the SW. When Spain was defeated in 1821, the northern territories, our now SW, was not Mexico. They were claimed territories by Mexico, provided they wanted to be. California didn't become a Mexican territory until 1823, 2 years after independence after it was put to a vote by the Californios.

Mexico was trying to get people to move to the territories, most Mexicans wouldn't move to far into the territories due to Indians raiding them, Mexico even attempted to pay Mexicans to move to the territories to no avail. New Mexico and Arizona had less than a 1000 Mexicans living north of their boundary, mostly just across the river from Mexico. Texas and California were the only two territories with any type of population, mostly Spanish with some English and French Settlers, roughly 18000 and 10000 respectively. Most of those were still from when Spain ruled. Colorado, Utah, etc, had no Mexican populations other than native "Indians" who did not recognize Mexico and some Settlers that came after Lewis and Clark.

So, now, please explain where "Mexicans" inhabited this land to a point of this land having a Hispanic identity.

To answer your question.... Nobody was here fighting with the natives over land prior to colonization, the natives fought among themselves over territory.

Last edited by Liquid Reigns; 08-15-2013 at 10:34 AM..
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Old 08-15-2013, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Bay Area, Calif.
2,435 posts, read 2,721,196 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
Why should English go the way of the dinosaur in this country? Why not Spanish instead? We are not a Hispanic nation in identity and never were. English has always been our de facto national language. As I said, the reason Spanish is required today is because of the large number of illegal alien Spanish speakers here. We should learn Spanish to accommodate them? I don't think so! These same people pushing Spanish in this country are the same ones who claim that Hispanics are assimilating in our country. I wish they would make up their minds which way it is.
Well said and actually correct! And as far as assimilation, I have yet to witness that on the part of non english speaking Mexican immigrants. During the 1980's when we started noticing them moving into South Los Angeles, they kept far distances for whatever reason, from those of us already living there. There never appeared to be any noticable interest to learn the local culture/customs, english or to "do as the Romans do" sorta speak. Eventually, the city caved and decided to convert everything to espanol as we are now required to dial "1" for english when calling many businesses.
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Old 08-18-2013, 07:27 PM
 
181 posts, read 238,742 times
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Guys, net migration from Mexico, legal and illegal, is at 0.

Net Migration from Mexico Falls to Zero

But why did illegal immigration happen? A faulty immigration system.

Here's another report from ABC.

Report: Immigration From Mexico Won't Go Back to Peak Levels of 1990s - ABC News

"By forecasting the need for Mexican labor in the U.S., the study projected that from 2011 to 2017, the net inflow of Mexican immigrants coming to the states -- both legally and illegally -- would resemble the levels seen in the 2000s. By net inflow, the researchers mean the number of immigrants coming into the country after subtracting the number leaving the country."

"The estimates don't take into account the potential effects of immigration reform bills that are currently being drafted by Democrats and Republicans in both houses of Congress."

So as our economy recovers, we should expect to see more immigrants. But not illegal, legal.
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Old 08-18-2013, 07:46 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,722,338 times
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I definitely do not believe that net migration is at 0.

Asylum petitions from Mexicans at the border are soaring --- far up from in the past which tells you that illegal entries would also be up -- including those coming in on "borrowed" border crossing cards and then "overstaying" their visas.

They might not be coming in through the desert but they're still pouring over the border. Nothing has changed except that now they're being promised easy and quick legal status and the fast path to citizenship. Why would they stay in Mexico? Mexico still doesn't give life long government handouts like food stamps and Medicaid as a reward for giving birth. And the wages in Mexico are still low compared with those of the USA -- there has not been any jump in minimum wage in Mexico. Every reason driving the millions already here are still there.

Plus it's known that illegals from Central America are way way up.
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Old 08-20-2013, 04:21 AM
 
Location: Striving for Avalon
1,403 posts, read 2,001,773 times
Reputation: 3239
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sco View Post
Most police and fire departments in major cities prefer their employees to be able to speak and understand basic Spanish. Several agencies in my area actually will pay for classes and after completion the employee's pay goes up due to their new job skills. Where I live, it would be almost impossible to do the job if you couldn't communicate at a basic level in Spanish.

Nativist objections aside, the simple answer is for all public schools nationwide to institute a true bilingual curriculum for all students. The days of the United States being a monolingual English-only society are over and institutions like schools and law enforcement should adapt to the changing needs of the people they serve. The younger generations would grow up bilingual and English only speakers would go the way of the dinosaur.
Quite frankly, I am not sure that the US would bear such a cultural shift well. Language is a huge component of culture and identity, and a bilingual US signifies a shift. Quite frankly, the US isn't going to go the way of Switzerland in that regard. Even Canada would be an optimistic outcome. The world is shifting ever more to English as a global lingua franca. Spanish is a language of languidly developing states.

I'll leave out the utter injustice done to the imparting of the language on our young people.

On a macro-level, I see no major advantage in a massive national move towards Spanish, only disadvantages: further burdens on already overstressed educational systems and the opportunity for some ugly political polarisation.

How would the Spanish language be systematically adapted throughout the US? I'd foresee English surviving as the language of the privileged: private schools, universities, industry & commerce, law, etc etc. The re-education of hundreds of millions is a tremendous undertaking.

Now, if we wish to discuss Spanish language education on a regional level, that's another matter.
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