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Old 11-23-2007, 06:38 AM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,592,488 times
Reputation: 1431

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I started this post after reading simpleman post of what are the benefits of illegal immigrants.

Well this is a post intended to create a dialogue, from citizen to citizen, from person to person instead of cold and impersonal numbers, but real stories from real people.

What do you think? are you interested in knowing what a middle class Mexican citizen could do or has done to benefit the middle class American citizen?

If you are interested let me know please and I'll post it here.

Some interesting data to be known is that Mexico has poverty yup 40% of the people are poor, but it has a bigger middle class

of those 40% who are poor, only 9% live in extreme poverty.

and the other 60% are classified like this (in the webpages bellow it says that it's about 40%, but I chose to classify it in this way because if 40% of Mexicans are poor, then where would the other 60% fit??)

Middle class 30%
Upper Middle class 20%
Wealthy citizens 15%
Millionaires 4%
Billionaires 1%

Marginal Revolution: Facts about the Mexican middle class
Mexico’s middle class - PSD Blog - World Bank Group



Picture source: Business Filter
Middle class Mexico - Business Filter - The Boston Globe





Regards

Last edited by Travelling fella; 11-23-2007 at 08:02 AM..
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:10 AM
 
273 posts, read 195,356 times
Reputation: 101
They can only hurt our great country.
Middle class mexicans aren't going to leave their country to risk everything in a country where they are generally not accepted.
The lower class mexicans will risk everything and take anything that isn't nailed down, making the 40% of mexicos' lower class OUR PROBLEM.

I guess if the middle class mexican wanted to do something, they would adopt a "take care of your own first" policy. I sure wish our Federal Govt. would. The illegal aliens are rapidly taking away all the freedoms our ancestors fought for.
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Old 11-23-2007, 08:28 AM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,592,488 times
Reputation: 1431
Quote:
Originally Posted by pablo-me View Post
They can only hurt our great country.
Middle class mexicans aren't going to leave their country to risk everything in a country where they are generally not accepted.
The lower class mexicans will risk everything and take anything that isn't nailed down, making the 40% of mexicos' lower class OUR PROBLEM.

I guess if the middle class mexican wanted to do something, they would adopt a "take care of your own first" policy. I sure wish our Federal Govt. would. The illegal aliens are rapidly taking away all the freedoms our ancestors fought for.
Dear friend, don't be so fast in drawing conclusions, this is not about Middle class Mexicans leaving Mexico to help the USA, but how can the average middle class Mexican help America from Mexico.

Also as a middle class Mexican let me tell you that what my experience has been on this statement you wrote

Quote:
Middle class mexicans aren't going to leave their country to risk everything in a country where they are generally not accepted.
I've been in America several times (legally), for several reasons, Leisure, Business, Trainning, etc, and I've always received a warm welcome and a hearty welcome to America! , from the people I've met there.

I wanted to share my story of how America has benefited me and how I've humbly done things to benefit her even if they are microscopic, like I stated before, real answers from real people ) but only if other people is interesting in hearing the testimony of a middle class Mexican citizen, that has a piece of American in his heart

we, the users who like the City-Data forums, are a community, and it's a great community not just this section but every one, and I thought that maybe we could use that to our advantage, how can we benefit from each other? I already DM'ed a member of this forum with the possibility of making a business that benefits both countries

Let's use the Nafta to our advantage and not viceversa, both countries middle classes could be greatly benefited from business and trade, we live in the internet age, let's use that tool for something good!

Peace, Love, Light and Harmony

Last edited by Travelling fella; 11-23-2007 at 09:22 AM..
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:20 AM
 
3 posts, read 15,155 times
Reputation: 15
Default About the mexican middle class

im a 22 y.o. mexican ,and consider myself to be upper-middle class
no more no less
my parents´ total income for a year is 120,000 dllrs.
my sister studies in barcelona,spain, im gonna study in london
and my lil sis probably goes to paris.
nobody(from the people i know) wants to go to the US coz it´s seen as less cool than going to europe, and because we believe the image of mexicans is soooo bad over there and that they think every mexican is short ,brown, ugly,uneducated, blah blah
yes, many go for postgraduate studies, but most come back.
i have many friends living in canada, spain , germnay, france and uk
but not a single one who lives in the US.
on the contrary most of the lower-middle class and working classs males aged 14-50 that live in the little town at the outskirts of x city i live in have been in the us and many several times, obviously illegally
...
anyway
ohh no wait¡¡ i do have mex-american frendsne who is middle-class but has not mcuh money who studies in earlham college in indiana, and others who live in a sikh(indian religion)community in new mexico but ...anyway...
whatever...hahaha
my guess would be:
and my sources are my sociological studies, those oof my mom who is a socioologist, and all the people i see everyday in the streets of mexico, and the trips i´ve made across the country:
--10% extreme poverty-they earn between 600 and 1200($50-$100dllrs) pesos per month working a lot, without insurance,bonuses,etc and are peasants and beggars, and indians whohave terrible nutrition and the same shoes for years and live in slums, and improvised homes.
they have less than grammar school education in average.
--40%are the working class: these folks earn between $100 dllrs and $350 per household in a family of 4-6.both parents work. they still live in squalid houses and many live in a single room house but others who are constructuon workers build their concrete houses over the years.
they are cops, construction workers, gardners, housemaids, all working class people, mnay self -employed people,etc. most public servants. all
military men.cab men, bus drivers,.they are highly discriminated are kitsch and nacos and bad taste, and hear rancheras, country,cumbias,most fill the stereotypical image of the mexican and these ones can afford to sneak into the US. they have between grammar school education and less
than a high school diploma.but some do have one. hihi¡¡ they have very cheap cars.
--20% are lower-middle class they all live in the cities.most live in low income "cheap" buildings. two small rooms, a living-dinning room, a small kitchen and a small bathroom. they earn between $350-and 600 dllrs per month as a total household income. most parents have junior high school diploma and half have high school diploma and half don´t.
they work in low paid white collar jobs and other slightly skilled jobs. many got technical and other 2 yr education, like in a community college but with zero prestige at all. some of them look like the stereotypical mexican but many are more hairy and taller and many are light skinned.
most have tv. dvd.a nice stereo. a second hand car not that bad.
some of the kids finish their college degrrees and end up working in a lower skilled job ,but most dont finish them.
--10% are middle-middle class:they are the majority in the univerisities, they earn between $650-to 1500 maybe some 3000 dllrs monthly.
some speak english. some have travelled to europe. some have masters .
like 1/6 have college degrees. they are balck market commerciants, white collar workers, slighly successful professionists, small bussines owners,
they want to be like the higher classes so much. some are quite cultured and learned. they are like half are interested in the arts, go to museums, to college , interested in politics, etc. and the other half is just here by income but has no interest in culture or in manage their money wisely,etc.
--then comes the less than9% of the mexicans, my beloved upper-middle class¡¡
household income for a family of 3-5 (but no more), is 3700-10000 dllrs per month. all the kids go to private schools from kinder to college(some go to unam cause it´s cool), all go to private $60 dllrs a date medics, all have extracurricular activites, most live in either gated communities with security and parks, swimmingpools or in inhereted bigger houses.
most can afford to travel to europe for holidays and know most of the nicest mexican beaches.most speak english fluently and many speak french and other languages. many study in el tec de monetreey , la ibero ,etc, and pay tution fees similar to those in the us and uk.
brand new cars, and many kids also have theirs. all are either professionist, higher or middle-higher publci servants o entrepreneurs.
many artist and intellectuals. a part is very conservative and other is medium conservative , and a smalle rpart is liberal, progressive etc, and a tiny part is very liberal.most have ipods, modern cellphones, fancy brand clothes, use facebook, ebay, will get postgraduate degrees, many will study in the us, europe and canada, and will be politicians and etc.
most houses have at least one maid, and a gardner. it´s not uncommon to have 2 homes .etc.many have european parents or grandparents. "everybody knows each other" is commonly said, cause of the scenes that are for preps are very different than the ones for average ppl than for the liberal-hippie-ravers-bohemians.-etc. most are aloof and think themselves better than most. most are either moslty white or totally white.many blonds, blue eyed blahblha.most foreign enter here. most ex pats. most foreign exchange students etc. enter here and stay with a family in this class , cause they have extra rooms but most importanlty cause they ar einterested i the cultural experience, ontrary to the upper class
--1%, the upper class. are the culturally and financially rich: the very successful entrpreneurs, top ranking politicians, narcos, celebrities,wealthy retired ex pats. they have sooo mcuh power and influenece. many homes in mexico, europe and usa. ultra small circles.
many domestic fulltime servants, many luxury cars, go shopping to nyc ,paris, london, educated in management, finances, economy, and so on. not in culture or arts.
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:27 AM
 
7,020 posts, read 10,241,108 times
Reputation: 1101
Quote:
Originally Posted by pablo-me View Post
They can only hurt our great country.
Middle class mexicans aren't going to leave their country to risk everything in a country where they are generally not accepted.
The lower class mexicans will risk everything and take anything that isn't nailed down, making the 40% of mexicos' lower class OUR PROBLEM.

I guess if the middle class mexican wanted to do something, they would adopt a "take care of your own first" policy. I sure wish our Federal Govt. would. The illegal aliens are rapidly taking away all the freedoms our ancestors fought for.


Agreed. Summed up nicely in a nut shell.
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Old 02-21-2009, 08:16 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 37,914,088 times
Reputation: 3806
titopuente's post was very hard hitting to say the least..............
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Old 02-21-2009, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,172 posts, read 16,472,095 times
Reputation: 3030
Quote:
Originally Posted by pablo-me View Post
They can only hurt our great country.
Middle class mexicans aren't going to leave their country to risk everything in a country where they are generally not accepted.
The lower class mexicans will risk everything and take anything that isn't nailed down, making the 40% of mexicos' lower class OUR PROBLEM.

I guess if the middle class mexican wanted to do something, they would adopt a "take care of your own first" policy. I sure wish our Federal Govt. would. The illegal aliens are rapidly taking away all the freedoms our ancestors fought for.
Agreed. If Travelling fella and other middle-class Mexicans sincerely want to “help” the U.S., they can start by devising a viable long-term strategy to improve conditions in Mexico for ALL of their citizens. Personally, I’m sick of Mexico dumping their problems on the US. We have spoon-fed them long enough; it’s time for them to help themselves.

It’s also time for Mexican illegal aliens to return home. We have nothing else to offer them -- the kitty is dwindling, and we barely have enough for our own citizens.
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Old 02-21-2009, 11:05 AM
 
8,973 posts, read 15,106,010 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Agreed. If Travelling fella and other middle-class Mexicans sincerely want to “help” the U.S., they can start by devising a viable long-term strategy to improve conditions in Mexico for ALL of their citizens. Personally, I’m sick of Mexico dumping their problems on the US. We have spoon-fed them long enough; it’s time for them to help themselves.

It’s also time for Mexican illegal aliens to return home. We have nothing else to offer them -- the kitty is dwindling, and we barely have enough for our own citizens.
This is pretty much my position, word-for-word....since you asked.
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Old 02-21-2009, 11:19 AM
 
7,020 posts, read 10,241,108 times
Reputation: 1101
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Agreed. If Travelling fella and other middle-class Mexicans sincerely want to “help” the U.S., they can start by devising a viable long-term strategy to improve conditions in Mexico for ALL of their citizens. Personally, I’m sick of Mexico dumping their problems on the US. We have spoon-fed them long enough; it’s time for them to help themselves.

It’s also time for Mexican illegal aliens to return home. We have nothing else to offer them -- the kitty is dwindling, and we barely have enough for our own citizens.
I could not agree more. They have sucked the tit of this country bone dry for decades. It's long past time for their revolutionary weening of all things provided by America.

All of mexico's wealthy and middle class with oligarchy membership needs to put their money where their collective mouths are. If they love mexico as much as they profess, then they should have no problem paying their fair share of taxes in order to help their poverty stricken masses. Otherwise they need not continually question why Americans are fed up with sending them millions in foreign aid and being forced to foot the bills for the social services, health insurance, education, and the overall financial drain placed on us via massive illegal immigration to this country coupled with our government using even more of our tax dollars to perpetually prop up mexico's status as a legitimate, independent country.

When they start taking care of their own poverty stricken masses and stop them from invading America, only then will those warm and fuzzy mexico is so wonderful stories convince me that there is one iota of truth coming out of the mouths of the story tellers.

As usual, great post

Last edited by JDubsMom; 02-21-2009 at 11:32 AM..
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Old 02-21-2009, 01:46 PM
 
362 posts, read 702,455 times
Reputation: 140
Quote:
Originally Posted by pablo-me View Post
I guess if the middle class mexican wanted to do something, they would adopt a "take care of your own first" policy. I sure wish our Federal Govt. would. The illegal aliens are rapidly taking away all the freedoms our ancestors fought for.

but isn't this socialism? this idealogy isn't liked in the U.S. by not too many people.
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