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View Poll Results: Should we let them stay because they are from a living hell?
Yes, they are refugees! 2 1.82%
In most cases, yes... 6 5.45%
NO! There are kids living in hellish conditions all over the world 102 92.73%
I don't know 0 0%
Voters: 110. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-08-2014, 05:48 PM
 
18,242 posts, read 11,645,412 times
Reputation: 11850

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Here is the take away message.

Due to changes in immigration laws back in 2002 these children from Central American countries lone among any other have the right to a formal deportation hearing before a judge. Thus a court date must be set up and then they are released into the population, that is the law. Just as with many other illegals once these kids are with their families and or vanish into the American population chances of them showing up for those hearings are nil to none. Long story short most if not all of these illegal children all ready on US soil and those that keep arriving will *NEVER* be sent home.

The longer they remain as time passes they will attend US schools and so forth and in ten, twenty or so years you'll hear their supporters fight any attempt to deport the now adult illegals for the reasons they give about the "Dreamers". That is these illegals came here as young children and the United States is the only country they know, and how it would be cruel and unjust to deport.

Many will either marry American citizens and gain GCs that way or find other ways of becoming legal residents and or US citizens.

Sad thing is Obama knows all this very well, yet he keeps running his mouth about how these illegal children will be sent home. Rubbish, he knows it and everyone in the DHS/federal government knows it as well.

When all is said and done nearly one million or more of these Central American women and children will have effectively resettled into the United States by simply walking over the border.
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Old 07-08-2014, 06:00 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,559,147 times
Reputation: 8350
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
Here is the take away message.

Due to changes in immigration laws back in 2002 these children from Central American countries lone among any other have the right to a formal deportation hearing before a judge. Thus a court date must be set up and then they are released into the population, that is the law. Just as with many other illegals once these kids are with their families and or vanish into the American population chances of them showing up for those hearings are nil to none. Long story short most if not all of these illegal children all ready on US soil and those that keep arriving will *NEVER* be sent home.

The longer they remain as time passes they will attend US schools and so forth and in ten, twenty or so years you'll hear their supporters fight any attempt to deport the now adult illegals for the reasons they give about the "Dreamers". That is these illegals came here as young children and the United States is the only country they know, and how it would be cruel and unjust to deport.

Many will either marry American citizens and gain GCs that way or find other ways of becoming legal residents and or US citizens.

Sad thing is Obama knows all this very well, yet he keeps running his mouth about how these illegal children will be sent home. Rubbish, he knows it and everyone in the DHS/federal government knows it as well.

When all is said and done nearly one million or more of these Central American women and children will have effectively resettled into the United States by simply walking over the border.
That's the summation of how I see this situation unfolding also. We essentially have no borders anymore.
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Old 07-08-2014, 06:36 PM
 
18,242 posts, read 11,645,412 times
Reputation: 11850
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
That's the summation of how I see this situation unfolding also. We essentially have no borders anymore.
We *HAVE* borders just as we have immigration laws, it is just that no one in Washington seems to have the balls to enforce either.

Obama and his administration are no saints in this either. Their "selective" deportation policies along with ratcheting up the noise about "Dreamers" and immigration reform that is tantamount to amnesty sent a clear message to those who traffic in illegal aliens and or such seeking to arrive on US soil; get here while the getting is good and you'll probably remain.

Women and children from Central America. Gays and transgender from South America, Africa, the Middle East, anyone that can get themselves to our Southern border just walks across and starts playing various games from asylum claims to whatever knowing their chances of being set home are nil. These persons even have family all lawyered up waiting for them to reach this side to better and faster speed the process.
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Old 07-08-2014, 08:28 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,559,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
We *HAVE* borders just as we have immigration laws, it is just that no one in Washington seems to have the balls to enforce either.

Obama and his administration are no saints in this either. Their "selective" deportation policies along with ratcheting up the noise about "Dreamers" and immigration reform that is tantamount to amnesty sent a clear message to those who traffic in illegal aliens and or such seeking to arrive on US soil; get here while the getting is good and you'll probably remain.

Women and children from Central America. Gays and transgender from South America, Africa, the Middle East, anyone that can get themselves to our Southern border just walks across and starts playing various games from asylum claims to whatever knowing their chances of being set home are nil. These persons even have family all lawyered up waiting for them to reach this side to better and faster speed the process.
All of the above is why I said "essentially" we have no borders.
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Old 07-09-2014, 04:05 AM
 
33,134 posts, read 39,067,107 times
Reputation: 28484
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
Is it our responsibility to accept the kids who come to America illegally by themselves because it is a living hell in Central America? Gangs, murder, harassment, etc.
Reminds me of poem that supposedly represented an American ideal but i guess it no longer applies or i got it wrong.
Goes something like this.

Quote:
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
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Old 07-09-2014, 05:37 AM
 
5,762 posts, read 2,955,896 times
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I saw quite a few pregnant women in the groups. These babies will be born here, become immediate citizens, and no way the mothers will be sent back.
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Old 07-09-2014, 12:43 PM
 
Location: East Coast
673 posts, read 552,010 times
Reputation: 642
Angry Please do your research and provide sources BEFORE you post!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by coffeendonuts View Post
So they decide to come into a country where they don't speak the language, don't plan on assimilating (because that's racist according to them, but not according to Asians) and they're uneducated, but somehow they're suppose to live a better life?

Moving from living in poverty in one country only to live in poverty again and expect the government to take care of you isn't exactly a smart idea.

So why are we not inviting kids from the Philippines or Democratic Republic of Congo? Statistically they have higher college attendance and graduation rates and lower teen pregnancy rates. And they make up a large portion of STEM programs, where as certain other groups have high teen pregnancy rates and low high school graduation rates

And they come from worse off conditions.
-Good, informative post. Add to that the rest of the kids living in miles and miles of refugee camps all throughout war-torn Africa. We can certainly take them in at a very young, tender age, and educate them to be contributing citizens of the US. I've personally worked with some of these refugees...they usually hadn't relied on handouts, being very self-sufficient at a very young age...part of their culture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cb73 View Post
Using that definition, a bunch of kids living in parts of Detroit and Chicago would qualify as needing to be saved. Yet no one seems interested in rushing in to save those two cities.

I think we should clean up our own problems before we take on everyone else's.
I think we can all agree on that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by shiftymh View Post
They could have stopped at Mexico.
Why didn't these people "go south"? To Brazil, Peru, Columbia? More latino-type cultures, more in line with what they're used to. Oh! is it because they will make them work and earn their keep??? Or perhaps they have more rational immigration policies than we do???

Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
I wonder if this poll was on another site there would be a more mixed viewpoint on this. TV New Channels are full of pundits who say America owes these poor children a new home.
-And just WHY does America "owe" anybody anything??? Why don't our so-called journalists "finish" the entire line of questioning???

Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
We are not our brothers keepers, people have to understand that. No one could care for kids anymore than I do; my heart goes out to these kids, but it isn't our responsibility to take care of them. If we send them back, sooner or later their families will get the idea. They are using these kids, it is as simple as that. The next thing you know we will be letting all the parents in so they can see little Rosa and Pedro. Why not just send planes to Africa to bring back the sick, poor and kids with no parents or invite the kids living in No. Korea to come here and escape dictatorship.
-I've said this before. Seems to be "racist" to me. There's no "la Raza" fighting for THEIR rights (Africa or Korea!)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jm31828 View Post
No- it is our government's responsibility to take care of us, the people of the United States. It is up to the governments of each of these kids' countries to take care of them. Until every single person in this country is well cared for, and everything is perfectly in order here, we should not be spending our money trying to care for these others.

And if we do let these kids stay, we need to find a way to make sure NO local, state, or federal funding goes towards any benefits for them- no medical care, food, or even public school- our social programs are overburdened as it is and can't afford to cover all of the citizens and legal residents, so we shouldn't even begin to think about spending even ONE DOLLAR on any of these illegal immigrants. Make them pay for private school, pay their own way for everything- I'll bet many would leave!
Great idea! Write your reps on this one! Although, I disagree that our gov't is here to "take care of us". It's here to provide our society a voice...of the people, by the people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by majesticat View Post
It's a tough situation...little kids coming from dysfunctional, corrupt, and violent countries. My heart goes out to them. However, realistically, we just can't take in everyone who comes from that type of environment;there are too many--similar to trying to overload one life boat with an ocean full of drowning people. Everyone goes down.

The answer to me is to secure the darned border. Have an orderly immigration system. Streamline that if needed. I have a feeling the legal immigration system is convoluted and confusing. But in today's modern welfare state, we just cannot have virtually open borders. It's just common sense.

Try to help these people as much as possible in their home nations. I don't know what the answer is to repairing a dysfunctional, corrupt, violent nation. We're having enough trouble fixing our own dysfunction here. Just my two cents.
Yes, right on! I've used this analogy many times. WHEN do we say NO, and ENOUGH!!! Imagine America as a liferaft...becoming overloaded and sinking. No matter how much we WANT to help, we just CAN'T!!! Actually, we need a legal immigration REFORMED system. It's both not enforced, and is broken.

- Add your 2 cents to mine. Now we have 4 cents. Anybody else? Don't forget, we must come up with $9 Trillion dollars to take care of these illegals! We need more of you "2-centers!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
Here is the take away message.

Due to changes in immigration laws back in 2002 these children from Central American countries lone among any other have the right to a formal deportation hearing before a judge. Thus a court date must be set up and then they are released into the population, that is the law. Just as with many other illegals once these kids are with their families and or vanish into the American population chances of them showing up for those hearings are nil to none. Long story short most if not all of these illegal children all ready on US soil and those that keep arriving will *NEVER* be sent home.

The longer they remain as time passes they will attend US schools and so forth and in ten, twenty or so years you'll hear their supporters fight any attempt to deport the now adult illegals for the reasons they give about the "Dreamers". That is these illegals came here as young children and the United States is the only country they know, and how it would be cruel and unjust to deport.

Many will either marry American citizens and gain GCs that way or find other ways of becoming legal residents and or US citizens.

Sad thing is Obama knows all this very well, yet he keeps running his mouth about how these illegal children will be sent home. Rubbish, he knows it and everyone in the DHS/federal government knows it as well.

When all is said and done nearly one million or more of these Central American women and children will have effectively resettled into the United States by simply walking over the border.
- "O" and congress have the ability for an emergency bill to halt the skewed laws which are unprepared for this number of illegals crashing our borders. Also, for rejecting the gang members coming in. Write your reps!!!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Reminds me of poem that supposedly represented an American ideal but i guess it no longer applies or i got it wrong.
Goes something like this.
Jambo101- The entire poem is called, The New Colossus" which is a sonnet by American poet Emma Lazarus (1849–87), written in 1883. It WASN'T to "represent" an American ideal, BTW.

from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Colossus

It's original, intended purpose:

"This poem was written as a donation to an auction of art and literary works, conducted by the "Art Loan Fund Exhibition in Aid of the Bartholdi Pedestal Fund for the Statue of Liberty" to raise money for the pedestal's construction. Lazarus's contribution was solicited by fundraiser William Maxwell Evarts. Initially she refused but Constance Cary Harrison convinced her that the statue would be of great significance to immigrants sailing into the harbor.

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,"

Also:

"The title of the poem and the first two lines refer to the Colossus of Rhodes, one of the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World. The poem talks about the millions of immigrants who came to the United States (many of them through Ellis Island at the port of New York).
The "air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame" refers to New York City and Brooklyn, not yet consolidated into one unit in 1898."

Jambo, please note that originally, it was NOT to represent any immigrants coming over in the late 1880's- 1920's:

"John T. Cunningham wrote that "The Statue of Liberty was not conceived and sculpted as a symbol of immigration, but it quickly became so as immigrant ships passed under the statue. However, it was Lazarus's poem that permanently stamped on Miss Liberty the role of unofficial greeter of incoming immigrants".

However, the meaning of the poem was later changed:

"Paul Auster wrote that "Bartholdi's gigantic effigy was originally intended as a monument to the principles of international republicanism, but 'The New Colossus' reinvented the statue's purpose, turning Liberty into a welcoming mother, a symbol of hope to the outcasts and downtrodden of the world".

Jambo101- You must put this into the context of that time period. There were NO handouts, free rides, welfare, housing, etc. Legal Immigrants (including my grandparents) came here FULLY EXPECTING to WORK HARD to not only prove to the US that they would contribute and help build America, but to assimilate and beco me PART of the dream...AS CONTRIBUTORS.
VERY DIFFERENT from the current ILLEGAL ALIEN "takers" with their hands out asking "what will you do to take care of ME???"


Do you see the difference?

I wish upon wish people would do their research and provide sources BEFORE they post!!!!! This one was misleading, ill-informed, and just plain old "wrong"!!!
~ Dandi

Last edited by DandiDay; 07-09-2014 at 12:48 PM.. Reason: double quote
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:25 PM
 
33,134 posts, read 39,067,107 times
Reputation: 28484
Thanks for the history lesson, from what i was taught in school it was implied that the poem represented American freedom, compassion and generosity, i never gave it more thought,probably just as well as you've pointed out its just a piece of meaningless fluff.
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Old 07-09-2014, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Oak Park, IL
405 posts, read 358,117 times
Reputation: 315
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
Is it our responsibility to accept the kids who come to America illegally by themselves because it is a living hell in Central America? Gangs, murder, harassment, etc.
Right. Once you start taking them from one area you pretty much need to do it for all. Word will get out quickly on that.
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Old 07-09-2014, 03:23 PM
 
4,707 posts, read 3,338,366 times
Reputation: 4412
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
I wonder if this poll was on another site there would be a more mixed viewpoint on this. TV New Channels are full of pundits who say America owes these poor children a new home.
Talking heads on tv rarely if ever make any sense.

America owes these poor children NOTHING. They are coming here illegally.

It's a harsh reality, but there are millions of children who are citizens who need help. We don't need any further problems.
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