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Old 12-28-2007, 07:02 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
Reputation: 2983

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
Although, just beacause people abuse the race card, doesn't mean that racism doesn't exsist
This is true---but so is THIS: "Just because racism EXISTS, does NOT mean it's the only possible reason to be "against" an issue. You can be against crime and violence and lawbreaking and general all-around trashy behavior, even if you don't KNOW the race(s) of the perpetrators".

And you can be against illegal immigration regardless of your RACE--many people, in fact ARE--even people (like my wife) who SHARE the race of most illegals. Try telling HER she's against illegals because she's a 'racist', and see how far you get.....
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:13 PM
 
Location: escondido,ca
194 posts, read 400,477 times
Reputation: 121
I'm sorry, but I don't consider somebody coming here to work a criminal. Every bushel has bad apples, but for the most part people come here to work and a better quality of life. I've known many illegals who are blue collar guys just like me except they have to look over their backs because they chose to give their family a better life. The number of illegals comitting crimes and collecting welfare pales in comparison to the number of our own citzens who sell dope and collect welfare and food stamps from generation to generation. The only reason illegals burden our social services in places is because their legal status leaves them with limited options, amnesty would change that and they would be required to pay into that system just like we do. They're not going to leave and we don't have the resources to make that happen, besides personally, I think that would be morally WRONG
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:35 PM
 
902 posts, read 505,464 times
Reputation: 184
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
I'm sorry, but I don't consider somebody coming here to work a criminal. Every bushel has bad apples, but for the most part people come here to work and a better quality of life. I've known many illegals who are blue collar guys just like me except they have to look over their backs because they chose to give their family a better life. The number of illegals comitting crimes and collecting welfare pales in comparison to the number of our own citzens who sell dope and collect welfare and food stamps from generation to generation. The only reason illegals burden our social services in places is because their legal status leaves them with limited options, amnesty would change that and they would be required to pay into that system just like we do. They're not going to leave and we don't have the resources to make that happen, besides personally, I think that would be morally WRONG

Anyone that came here without permission and is working in our country is a damn criminal. PERIOD!!! You don't personally have to call them that because it makes no never mind. They still stay criminals no matter how you feel.

Stop trying to say that because we have our own citizen criminals that we should put up with illegals that are criminals, and all illegals are criminals. That is just like the neo-cons who blame everything on Clinton even though he has been out of office low this many years now. Blaming others is not changing the fact that illegals are criminals and will never be anything but.
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:36 PM
 
13 posts, read 25,669 times
Reputation: 12
Default the poor hard working mexican

If you only knew. Most of the illegal hispanics I have ever worked around (A) are here by illegal means (B) I would say 75% admitted to smuggling drugs. and (C) they are illegal. I worked on a Wal-Mart store in the Mid-West and some of your beloved illegals went out and raped a 15 year old girl. The police and town Shut down our job site. Treated us all like criminals legal and illegal.And I bet you the one who raped that girl is back in America mowing some cheap SOB's lawn.
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:44 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,706,920 times
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Quote:
Anyone that came here without permission and is working in our country is a damn criminal. PERIOD!!! You don't personally have to call them that because it makes no never mind. They still stay criminals no matter how you feel.
I find Americans working "illegally" all over the resort areas of Mexico and Europe, darned criminals.
Quote:
If you only knew. Most of the illegal hispanics I have ever worked around (A) are here by illegal means (B) I would say 75% admitted to smuggling drugs. and (C) they are illegal. I worked on a Wal-Mart store in the Mid-West and some of your beloved illegals went out and raped a 15 year old girl. The police and town Shut down our job site. Treated us all like criminals legal and illegal.And I bet you the one who raped that girl is back in America mowing some cheap SOB's lawn.
I think 100% of the illegals got here by illegal means.
Look, you haters, can hate, it is a free country (actually the 17th freeist country in the world but, hey) each day you benefit from the labor of these people. Statistics of arrest and imprisonment show that about 2.8% of illegals commit crimes.
That means 97.8 % don't, aside from the heinous criminal act of entering this country without bothering the bureaucrats.

Any of you having a glass of wine or a beer this fine evening? Thank an illegal agricultural worker.

And, at the risk of sounding like a broken record, Ozark I am still waiting for my little problem with your recollection (or is it mine? only Ozark knows, and she ain't talking).
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:51 PM
 
38 posts, read 53,485 times
Reputation: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
Suspect whatever you want. I could not care less. Pulling out the race card usually signifies a weak argument in the first place, IMO.
-I agree, the race card is played way too much these days, maybe cutural bias/misunderstanding is a better way to describe the vibe, as far as illegals thumbing their noses at our laws, I would thumb my nose at any law to ensure that my family had a roof over their head, a safe enviroment, and dinner every night!
This person is openly condoning illegal activity against the United States.
Administrator: please revoke his/her Forum privileges.
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:53 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
I'm sorry, but I don't consider somebody coming here to work a criminal. Every bushel has bad apples, but for the most part people come here to work and a better quality of life. I've known many illegals who are blue collar guys just like me except they have to look over their backs because they chose to give their family a better life. The number of illegals comitting crimes and collecting welfare pales in comparison to the number of our own citzens who sell dope and collect welfare and food stamps from generation to generation. The only reason illegals burden our social services in places is because their legal status leaves them with limited options, amnesty would change that and they would be required to pay into that system just like we do. They're not going to leave and we don't have the resources to make that happen, besides personally, I think that would be morally WRONG
I won't get into it with you--you sound well-intentioned. But we've been going over this for months. The status of an illegal has nothing to do with his "goodness"---nor does it have anything to do with the "badness" of Americans. I'm "nicer" than many wealthy people--but I cannot live in their homes, nor can I play at their country clubs. I'm not legally entitled to, even though I'm "nice".

Laws are arbitrary--particularly civil laws. You are either "legal" or "illegal", in many walks of life. In this case, illegal imigrants are in violation of American law--period. Just like a trespasser, nice guy or NOT, is in violation of the law when he trespasses. If you drive within the speed limit, you're "ok". Go 90 MPH, and you're breaking the law--and you are subject to a penalty.

Laws are really all we have holding our society together. We admit people here regardless of race, ethnicity, color, or religion. We require very little, EXCEPT a willingness to live under our laws.

As far as the "bums" in America, that's an ENTIRELY separate issue. Legally, we are "stuck' with our domestic lawbreakers--we cannot "transport" them, or otherwise get rid of them. It has nothing to do with the issue of immigration. If we could bring in "good" people, and get rid of "bad" people, of course we'd do it. But those are two separate issues, having no real bearing on each other.

"Wanting to work" really isn't an indicator, either. I may WANT to work at General Motors, but I can't just walk in an put myself on the payroll, EVEN if I'm a better worker than those already there. I have to wait until General Motors HIRES me--until then, I have no special "claim" to the company.

There are untold MILLIONS of poor people in dozens of countries. How do we figure out how to accomodate all of them? Who gets 'preferential treatment'? Why?---and what about the ones we DON'T take in? What do we owe THEM?

Having good morals and a social conscience does NOT equate with open borders.....you want to bring people in to "help out"?---by all means, do so. Get their names, find out a little about them, and weed out the criminals. Then, when you have enough "helpers", put up a "temporarily closed" sign. Tell the others "Sorry--we're full now, Check back in a few weeks"....Meanwhile, though, this "open Borders, anyone who argues is a big 'meanie'" stuff is just SILLY. Open borders advocates would NEVER advocate "unlocked houses"--or "unlocked cars".....for obvious reasons

Last edited by macmeal; 12-28-2007 at 08:03 PM..
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Old 12-28-2007, 07:58 PM
 
4,828 posts, read 6,790,161 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
Although, just beacause people abuse the race card, doesn't mean that racism doesn't exsist
I have been getting bad reputation points just because people don't agree with my posts. Most of the reasons i've heard is i'm race baiting, pulling the race card etc. Some people think NONE of this is about race but that is a big lie.
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Old 12-28-2007, 08:11 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
I find Americans working "illegally" all over the resort areas of Mexico and Europe, darned criminals.
.
I don't doubt this for a moment. I would, however, guess that the numbers of these illegal Americans are very small. When, and if, their numbers increase to the point that they begin to provoke the annoyance of the 'locals', I have no doubt that the authorities will respond by rounding them up and deporting them. And when they do, I doubt that these Americans will rampage through the streets in anger----NOR do I think most other Americans will have a lot of sympathy for them, nor will we think they're being mistreated. We'll regard them simply as 'adventurers' who tried something they KNEW was illegal, and ended up getting 'busted'. VERY different from the situation here in the US.
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Old 12-28-2007, 08:15 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacknight04 View Post
I have been getting bad reputation points just because people don't agree with my posts. Most of the reasons i've heard is i'm race baiting, pulling the race card etc. Some people think NONE of this is about race but that is a big lie.
I think you're way "overboard' on the race card issue---but I'll tell you this now. I don't believe in giving 'negative rep', finding this to be a sneaky and cowardly thing to do. (I've gotten a few myself)....

I think there are MANY objections to illegal immigration that have nothing to do with race---unfortunately the 'racists' get all the attention, and the legal issues are seldom addressed.
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