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Old 12-30-2007, 05:05 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,622,458 times
Reputation: 3785

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozark-Baby View Post
Sorry Mac, but we do have a culture!!!!
Macmeal has sarcasm down to a fine science
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Old 12-30-2007, 05:29 PM
 
902 posts, read 505,812 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Macmeal has sarcasm down to a fine science
Ahhhh, I see. Then I apologize.
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Old 12-30-2007, 07:07 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,710,869 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
Is this a "trick question"?.....you won't get a "rational" answer, because there IS none. You will get lots of IRRATIONAL answers, if that is any consolation...among them are:

(1) The US is a "western" liberal, democratic, open society. We should take care of others because we CAN. If we don't, we're BAD. We're not allowed to compare ourselves with other countries--no matter what THEY do, we're still selfish, and we should feel guilty....

(2) Other countries DON'T take in large numbers of illegals, because their cultures won't tolerate outsiders. These are PROUD cultures, and want to maintain themselves. We really don't have a culture at all, so it doesn't matter who comes here...

(3) We have no right to keep OTHERS out, since we are ALL immigrants, anyway. Even if we were born here, and even if we're Native Americans. WE're still really "immigrants".

(4) We have no right to object to others coming here, with permission or without, as the US is really "stolen" land. In fact, Mexicans really own a large part of the US anyway, so they can hardly be expected to "ask permission"...

(5) Modern-day America was started by white people, who have stolen just about all their technology, land, and riches from various groups of non-whites; therefore, whites have no moral right to anything. Whites would not be where they are today unless they did something crooked and "underhanded"...Education and hard work never worked in building America--it was pretty much just stolen from others.

(6) Illegal immigrants come from wonderful places where they're valued and have plenty of opportunity, to the US, where they're mistreated and abused. This "proves" that they are lured here against their will, under false pretenses. Most would love to go home, if we'd only let them.

(7) Everyone has a right to work and make a living, but this rule is true ONLY in the United States...therefore, it's an incomplete statement. The entire statement would be "Everyone in the world, regardless of circumstances, has a right to make a living and find housing IN THE U.S.".....Other nations are exempt from this rule.

(8) America has ALWAYS welcomed immigrants. Therefore, it has become understood that this is America's responsibility, now and for all time. Other nations do NOT welcome immigrants, so they aren't EXPECTED to; and because they don't tolerate immigrants, they can't mistreat them. Only America mistreats its immigrants. And it's not important that immigrants be legal, either. As long as they are "nice", and want to work, we need to accomodate them....Remember, "There are no illegal human beings".

(9) The fact that a FEW illegal immigrants commit violent crime and welfare fraud shouldn't concern us. Our OWN citizens commit crimes, too, so we're really USED to it...A little more crime can't possibly be that important.

Sorry that I can't offer you a well-reasoned answer as to why America doesn't have the rights to its borders that other nations have....but I hope the above IRRATIONAL reasons will give you something to think about. Hopefully some other reader can come up with the "reasonable" answer. I just can't think of any...
Let's see now..........the gringo stole their land, no human being is illegal, we are a nation of immigrants. Wait! You forgot one.

They are here to do all the jobs that Americans are too lazy to do.

Just remember that when you are sitting in the morning rush hour traffic tomorrow.
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Old 12-30-2007, 07:56 PM
 
Location: So. of Rosarito, Baja, Mexico
6,571 posts, read 17,953,604 times
Reputation: 5919
Hola Macmeal, Como esta ud? I am a legal human person. I want to work. I am a nice human legal people. I want to know where you have casa. I hope you have nice fence outside you casa. I want to climb over your fence and put up a chica casa on you terrana por favor. Wait a minute, I cannot do that as I am a legal AMERICAN CITIZEN who was Naturalized. If I jumped over your fence and decided to live on your front lawn, there would be hell to pay. Arrested and put into jail. Hows them cookies. Stefhen
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:02 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,622,458 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bagu View Post
Hola Macmeal, Como esta ud? I am a legal human person. I want to work. I am a nice human legal people. I want to know where you have casa. I hope you have nice fence outside you casa. I want to climb over your fence and put up a chica casa on you terrana por favor. Wait a minute, I cannot do that as I am a legal AMERICAN CITIZEN who was Naturalized. If I jumped over your fence and decided to live on your front lawn, there would be hell to pay. Arrested and put into jail. Hows them cookies. Stefhen
Damn straight there, Istvan
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:04 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,707,816 times
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In reviewing the chain of title for some of our California properties I found deeds written in Spanish longhand legalese. Those deeds did not count for much with the American courts set up after the invasion of 1846, thousands of Mexicans did have their land stolen by the gringo, all nice and legal.
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:14 PM
 
Location: So. of Rosarito, Baja, Mexico
6,571 posts, read 17,953,604 times
Reputation: 5919
ARizona Bear :Koszonam Szepen. Pista
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:18 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,622,458 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
In reviewing the chain of title for some of our California properties I found deeds written in Spanish longhand legalese. Those deeds did not count for much with the American courts set up after the invasion of 1846, thousands of Mexicans did have their land stolen by the gringo, all nice and legal.
My immediate family lost almost everything in post WW II Hungary and my father (despite his problems) built a Middle Class life here in the USA. He had enough moxie to use the 'tools' handed to him.

Possession, money, even political influence, etc. can all be lost-------the one thing that cannot be taken away from a group of people (short of murder or severe torture) is Human Capital.
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:20 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,707,816 times
Reputation: 350
It is easy to dismiss the problems of Mexico as the problems of the people. There are sound historical reasons why Mexico is the way it is. It is well worth taking the time to read up on it, since Mexico and Mexicans seem to weigh heavily on your mind.
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:27 PM
 
28,906 posts, read 45,211,944 times
Reputation: 45815
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
In reviewing the chain of title for some of our California properties I found deeds written in Spanish longhand legalese. Those deeds did not count for much with the American courts set up after the invasion of 1846, thousands of Mexicans did have their land stolen by the gringo, all nice and legal.
Well, that really has nothing to do with the question at hand. I'm really interested in today, not what happened 160 years ago. However, if we use your logic, then I assume that any remaining Aztecs have a right to Mexican territory.
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