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Old 11-07-2014, 04:35 PM
 
Location: USA
18,536 posts, read 13,678,653 times
Reputation: 12125

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
That's changing real fast.

Too: "illegal alien" ain't a race; they ALL need to leave the US, even blue eyed blonde "white" people.
"illegal alien" ain't a race;"
It's the only tool they have in their shed. They can't comprehend that we don't care what race, ethnic group, or nation they come from. We only care that they are illegally here and have their own countries, whether that be Russia, Chechnya, Guatemala or China. We can not absord all the people in the world that want to move here.
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Old 11-07-2014, 04:41 PM
 
Location: USA
18,536 posts, read 13,678,653 times
Reputation: 12125
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvoc View Post
First off their behavior is illegal. But it is not necessarily criminal. Mostly this stuff is civil rather than criminal.

There is no good mechanism to make illegals life hard enough to send them home. Things are simply better here particularly for those long established. You can do things which will increase the gray market but that is probably worse for the US than it is for the illegals.

Crime convictions are not mass actions against a group of citizen children. Many of the proposals are such an action. Those actions are basically un-American and likely not Constitutional..

And virtually all of this is Bluster with no factual basis. There is no will to do any of it. And there is no funding. So basically you folks are blustering yourself into inaction allowing the problem to worsen while you sit and dream about how good it will be when you put those illegals into their place. Meanwhile the problem will grow and we will end up with 20 million to deal with instead of 11.
And they shouldn't be "citizen children" in the first place as thats what brings their parents here illegally. Almost every country in the world requires at least one of the parents be a citizen for a good reason.
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Old 11-07-2014, 04:48 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 12,137,944 times
Reputation: 5398
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun View Post
And they shouldn't be "citizen children" in the first place as thats what brings their parents here illegally. Almost every country in the world requires at least one of the parents be a citizen for a good reason.
Shoulda, woulda, Coulda and $5.00 gets you a ride on the IRT...They are citizens and nothing is going to change that.
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Old 11-07-2014, 05:15 PM
 
Location: USA
18,536 posts, read 13,678,653 times
Reputation: 12125
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvoc View Post
Shoulda, woulda, Coulda and $5.00 gets you a ride on the IRT...They are citizens and nothing is going to change that.
Oh, it is going to change, just as it is going that way in the rest of the world. Nobody wants their borders over run and violated. Why shouldn't we have the same laws as Mexico, Australia and others who value and protect their sovereignty.

What makes you think it will stop at 11 million, or 20 or 100 million? We can't absorb the total number of people wanting to illegally immigrate here from the rest of the word? It would be our destruction.
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Old 11-07-2014, 05:22 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 12,137,944 times
Reputation: 5398
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun View Post
Oh, it is going to change, just as it is going that way in the rest of the world. Nobody wants their borders over run and violated. Why shouldn't we have the same laws as Mexico, Australia and others who value and protect their sovereignty.

What makes you think it will stop at 11 million, or 20 or 100 million? We can't absorb the total number of people wanting to illegally immigrate here from the rest of the word? It would be our destruction.
No it is not. More Alice in Wonderland. There is no place near the consensus required to change the Constitution and there is no sign that such a consensus is remotely buildable.

And the children are citizens and that is not going to go away.

And unless we quickly get the illegal population down to a level which we can manage...that is way under a million...it is going to get worse and become even less manageable. And even if we reduce the illegals by regularizing their status we can still screw it up and let it grow again. And we may.

But the existing course offers no hope.
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Old 11-07-2014, 05:26 PM
 
11,485 posts, read 5,507,878 times
Reputation: 9861
"Crime convictions are not mass actions against a group of citizen children"
---------------
Really? Every single day American citizens get sent to jail. Many of these citizens have children.

As for "mass actions" where illegals are concerned---If the parents get deported and don't take their kids with them, then they are horrible parents. Any decent parent would never leave a child behind. At least deported illegals have this option. People going to jail can't bring their kids with them.

Besides, when illegals set out to thumb their noses at our immigration laws, then they need to be prepared to face the consequences of their actions. They get caught and deported? Good! They have kids? That is not this country's problem. If families get "torn apart", it's the fault of the illegal. They only have themselves to blame for this.
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Old 11-07-2014, 05:55 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,282,218 times
Reputation: 5895
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun View Post
Oh, it is going to change, just as it is going that way in the rest of the world. Nobody wants their borders over run and violated. Why shouldn't we have the same laws as Mexico, Australia and others who value and protect their sovereignty.

What makes you think it will stop at 11 million, or 20 or 100 million? We can't absorb the total number of people wanting to illegally immigrate here from the rest of the word? It would be our destruction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lvoc View Post
No it is not. More Alice in Wonderland. There is no place near the consensus required to change the Constitution and there is no sign that such a consensus is remotely buildable.

And the children are citizens and that is not going to go away.

And unless we quickly get the illegal population down to a level which we can manage...that is way under a million...it is going to get worse and become even less manageable. And even if we reduce the illegals by regularizing their status we can still screw it up and let it grow again. And we may.

But the existing course offers no hope.
Uh; it's a question of WHEN; NOT "if" when birthright is stopped in the US and Canada.

Too: just a few years back; many people wrote off the Repubs having control of BOTH houses of Congress in 2014.

My point is this: never say "never".
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Old 11-07-2014, 06:38 PM
 
11,485 posts, read 5,507,878 times
Reputation: 9861
Illegals should NEVER have their status "regularized". To do so would be a slap in the face to the millions who came here legally and those who are patiently awaiting their turn to legally immigrate here.

If this country makes life hard for illegals, it will drastically reduce their population. Make E-verify the law of the land and run everybody through the work force through it, then weed out the no-matches. If any of those no-matches engaged in ID theft, then arrest them. Change the law so that despicable loophole that says it's okay for someone to use your SSN as long as they don't use your name with it gets closed once and for all. Once it is closed, go after those who are using someone else's SSN. Go after any employer who refuses to use E-verify. Deal with the whole anchor baby/birth tourism fiasco.

Once illegals realize that they won't be able to find jobs and that their spawn won't automatically be US citizens, they will leave on their own accord.

Will it get rid of all of them? Of course it won't. There will still be scofflaws who pay under the table or family members who aide and abet them but their numbers would be drastically reduced. As for families who aid and abet their illegal family members, prosecute them for doing so.

Secure the borders, put the promised tracking system in place to deal with those who overstay visas.

It's not rocket science, is it? Illegals should NEVER be rewarded with amnesty. Instead, they should be deported.

Again, anyone who makes excuses for illegals, needs to put their own money where their mouth is and support several of them.
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Old 11-07-2014, 07:48 PM
 
12,973 posts, read 12,137,944 times
Reputation: 5398
Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
Uh; it's a question of WHEN; NOT "if" when birthright is stopped in the US and Canada.

Too: just a few years back; many people wrote off the Repubs having control of BOTH houses of Congress in 2014.

My point is this: never say "never".
Again you are having a discussion with the Mad Queen.

There is no place near a consensus on changing birth right citizenship. There just is not. Simple as that. And there is not going to be any time soon. Even the fine pot you dudes are smoking is not going to make it happen.

The Republican Wave was foreseeable and well forecasted. There were question about whether it would be big enough to effect Senate control but nothing that there was not going to be the normal mid term swing against the incumbent. And Obama has done a poor job politically the last period making it worse.

It would appear that Obama is going to proceed with an executive order partially regularizing things though he can only do a partial job. So the question will continue to fester though the possibility of deportation will basically go away for most illegals. The problem though is that there will still be too many illegals not resolved...leaving conditions ripe for a furuther expansion of the illegal population down the road. If we don't cut that off it will again occur.
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Old 11-07-2014, 07:50 PM
 
20,611 posts, read 12,282,218 times
Reputation: 5895
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOS2IAD View Post
Illegals should NEVER have their status "regularized". To do so would be a slap in the face to the millions who came here legally and those who are patiently awaiting their turn to legally immigrate here.

If this country makes life hard for illegals, it will drastically reduce their population. Make E-verify the law of the land and run everybody through the work force through it, then weed out the no-matches. If any of those no-matches engaged in ID theft, then arrest them. Change the law so that despicable loophole that says it's okay for someone to use your SSN as long as they don't use your name with it gets closed once and for all. Once it is closed, go after those who are using someone else's SSN. Go after any employer who refuses to use E-verify. Deal with the whole anchor baby/birth tourism fiasco.

Once illegals realize that they won't be able to find jobs and that their spawn won't automatically be US citizens, they will leave on their own accord.

Will it get rid of all of them? Of course it won't. There will still be scofflaws who pay under the table or family members who aide and abet them but their numbers would be drastically reduced. As for families who aid and abet their illegal family members, prosecute them for doing so.

Secure the borders, put the promised tracking system in place to deal with those who overstay visas.

It's not rocket science, is it? Illegals should NEVER be rewarded with amnesty. Instead, they should be deported.

Again, anyone who makes excuses for illegals, needs to put their own money where their mouth is and support several of them.
Agreed and HOW!
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