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Old 02-01-2015, 05:19 PM
 
11,485 posts, read 5,507,878 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo45 View Post
I'm always kinda curious whenever I hear some obvious 'winger ranting the same-old, same-old, but who also claims to be a member of one of those very same groups that the GOP "base" so loves to demonize. And if folks aren't willing to even stand by their own words, then what are they doing here?

As far as 'generalizing', ironically it's the Republicans (aka, "the Official Party of White Folks"), who seem to do that the most. Heck, just look at all their transparently patronizing promotions of "Great Hispanic Hopes", like for example Cruz and Rubio, who in reality have about as much in common with the majority of 'latino' voters as Donald Trump!

Although I suppose if most of your constituency these days is made up of southern-style "real 'Murikins", then just having a couple candidates with 'funny-sounding' names, is probably a "Big Deal"!
1. I'm not a republican. At one time I was a staunch democrat until I realized that today's democrats are not your grandfather's democrats. Democrats of yore once looked out for the poor, working and middle classes and would have been horrified to discover that their constituents were either seeing their wages depressed or were being displaced in the workforce due to illegal immigration. And those democrats of yore would have done something about it---and I don't mean amnesty either.

In fact, one day the RNC called and asked us to join. I gave them an earful and told them that since Reince Priebus started pandering to Hispanics with promises of amnesty, that I would never join.

2. How, exactly, do republicans "demonize" Hispanics? Being an independent, I've supported candidates on both sides of the aisle. Thus, I have been to fundraisers for republican candidates. Never once did I see or sense anyone "demonizing" Hispanics. In fact, I've met some interesting people at these fundraisers. Once, for example, we sat with a young woman from El Salvador, who was a naturalized US citizen. If she felt she was being "demonized", do you seriously think she would support a republican? What about the Hispanic republicans out there? Would they join a party that "demonizes" them? Would the RNC even offer help and support if they "demonized" Hispanics?

3. Funny how you engage in stereotypes, yourself... Your remark about Cruz and Rubio says it all.

The truth is that neither party is looking out for Americans. That said, at one time I expected much, much better from the dems. These days, if any candidate on either side of the aisle comes out strongly against illegal immigration, s/he is the one who gets my vote.
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Old 02-01-2015, 05:22 PM
 
11,485 posts, read 5,507,878 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldglory View Post
Do you think you could refrain from calling conservatives "wingers" and stop demonizing them all the time in the name of civility? Just what groups is the GOP demonizing? Please stop with the racial references also. The GOP is not the party of white folks either. It is merely your opinion that the GOP might consider Cruz or Rubio for the presidency based on ethnicity. It's Americans not "Murikins" also. You just can't seem to stop being sarcastic and mocking all the time, can you? Your opinion would hold a lot more weight if your were to stop that. Just what funny sounding names are you speaking of?

This topic is about Jeb Bush (is that a funny sounding name to you?) wanting to legalize illegal aliens. Could we get back to discussing that?
^Excellent post, Oldglory! Thank you! If I could rep you again, I would.
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Old 02-01-2015, 05:26 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 16,438,494 times
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BOS2IAD"2. How, exactly, do republicans "demonize" Hispanics? Being an independent, I've supported candidates on both sides of the aisle. Thus, I have been to fundraisers for republican candidates. Never once did I see or sense anyone "demonizing" Hispanics. In fact, I've met some interesting people at these fundraisers. Once, for example, we sat with a young woman from El Salvador, who was a naturalized US citizen. If she felt she was being "demonized", do you seriously think she would support a republican? What about the Hispanic republicans out there? Would they join a party that "demonizes" them? Would the RNC even offer help and support if they "demonized" Hispanics?"

Latinos went 73-27% for the Dems in 2012, so for every one of those women from El Salvador, there are almost 3 others offsetting her vote..in triplicate.

I guess those 3 felt differently about Mittens self-deportation rhetoric.

The reality is we're not going to see 11 million leave, or force them to leave, so all the base-pandering rhetoric does is it costs massive amounts of votes, and ushers Hillary Rodham Clinton in as the next POTUS. Is that the goal of the base?
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Old 02-01-2015, 06:18 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,559,147 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOS2IAD View Post
^Excellent post, Oldglory! Thank you! If I could rep you again, I would.
You're welcome. Constantly making a joke out of this very serious issue is not only irritating but it is a tell all about those who do it. Some use this forum to attack the party they don't like either. Both parties are guilty of ignoring our immigration laws.
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Old 02-01-2015, 06:47 PM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,367 posts, read 8,269,291 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
OldGlory"The GOP is not the party of white folks either. "

Its voters are overwhelmingly white, and male. The dropout in support amongst all other demographics is startling.
Ain't that the truth!

Salon: How the GOP became the “White Man’s Party”
From Nixon to Rand, Republicans have banked on the unerring support of Southern white men. Here's how it came to be.
Excerpted from “Dog Whistle Politics: How Coded Racial Appeals Have Reinvented Racism and Wrecked the Middle Class”
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Old 02-01-2015, 06:57 PM
 
31,471 posts, read 14,559,147 times
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Then I guess the Democrats are the party of blacks? Could we get back on topic now? You know, illegal immigration.
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Old 02-01-2015, 08:08 PM
 
13 posts, read 7,393 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
OldGlory"The GOP is not the party of white folks either. "

Its voters are overwhelmingly white, and male. The dropout in support amongst all other demographics is startling.

[SIZE=2]And that to me is the dilemma America faces, that of white conservative Americans trying to
hold the line against the law-breaking immigration ethic of races that want to displace
them. There seems to be this undeniable racial divide --one people should make no bones about---between whites who want rule of law and non-whites who seem
to be saying "Hey, there's so many of us, either support our immigration criminality
or you'll never hold office." Whites should not be apologetic of being a majority of the party of
of those favoring a law-abiding ethic. We will soon have an unworkable, Balkanized America if
changing demographics inclines toady white polticians to cave in to non-white criminality of any sort .
You can't have criminals and their supporters determining the political ethics of a country.
[/SIZE]
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Old 02-01-2015, 08:14 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 16,438,494 times
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Wrong, BunkieBoy. The voting Latinos are citizens of the US. Their median age is also more than 10 years less than the nation overall. They will go from 10% of voters (POTUS) today to most likely 15+% without any additional immigrants becoming citizens. Now, at the same time as they increased their %, Caucasian Americans had FEWER children. In many regions, their replacement rate is less than their death rate. A major reason, I have little doubt, is women are no longer beholden on men to have meaningful incomes. That means, when they opt to have kids, they are not leaving a McJob, easily replaceable, they are leaving a career-level position, so they must decide how many kids to have and when, in objective terms, to not disrupt the career.

This is NOT about demographics changing via unnatural causes, or using numbers to enact change. It occurred naturally.
None-the-less, it will change the political landscape.
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Old 02-01-2015, 08:37 PM
 
13 posts, read 7,393 times
Reputation: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
Wrong, BunkieBoy. The voting Latinos are citizens of the US. Their median age is also more than 10 years less than the nation overall. They will go from 10% of voters (POTUS) today to most likely 15+% without any additional immigrants becoming citizens. Now, at the same time as they increased their %, Caucasian Americans had FEWER children. In many regions, their replacement rate is less than their death rate. A major reason, I have little doubt, is women are no longer beholden on men to have meaningful incomes. That means, when they opt to have kids, they are not leaving a McJob, easily replaceable, they are leaving a career-level position, so they must decide how many kids to have and when, in objective terms, to not disrupt the career.

This is NOT about demographics changing via unnatural causes, or using numbers to enact change. It occurred naturally.
None-the-less, it will change the political landscape.

Right, bobtn. You wrote regarding the GOP that "Its voters are
overwhelmingly white and male. The dropout in support amongst
all other demographics is startling."

Sounds as if you're saying the Grand old party can't attract
non-whites and females.

But your second post seems to indicate the GOP can't attract
non-whites and females because white men aren't making
enough bucks and therefore the white birth rate is falling.

Which one do you mean?
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Old 02-01-2015, 08:44 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 16,438,494 times
Reputation: 7274
It is a dramatic drop to all other groups. That is correct. But what I did not get into is the declining birthrate amongst Americans who are now several generations away from the immigrants in their family. That is exponentially increasing the power of the Latino vote, and it is a natural cause.

PS: It isn't white men can't make enough money. It is simple, and I don't know you're age, so if you are under 40, you would not have experienced the America that was (workplace) which I did. It was unfair, but 30 or more years ago, the few women who went to college would be low-paid secretaries upon graduation. They would bear many children, as they become SAHM's dependent on his income. Today, Thank God, not only has the female college grad population exploded, but they can compete and get positions at all levels. That means, when they want kids, they are taking a bigger economic hit, and they have pride as they should, in their careers, and the trajectory would nosedive. So they have fewer kids, but develop outstanding careers, which is fair given their impressive credentials.

Their economic gain is not their white hubby's loss. It is merited and finally we've reached a place in time when corporate America does NOT discriminate against women.

PS: I love it, and I happen to be a white male. It was sad watching gender discrimination just a few decades ago.
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