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Old 01-22-2008, 11:22 AM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,051 posts, read 21,178,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Rhino View Post
1. I didn't even see "Hummer".

2. What does it matter why he was here? The guy was either coming here to mow yards or maybe he was here to smuggle drugs. Either way it's completely selfish to take someone's life over a very petty gain like that. The issue is that the guy killed someone.
You seem to assume that the driver of the Hummer (interesting, I never knew you could afford a Hummer on $7/hour) has the same set of values as you and the rest of law-abiding America has. His opinion of the BP agent's life getting mowed down is what is "very petty" to him - he's got an urgent load of drugs to deliver, ya know? These are cold-blooded killers who put no value whatsoever on following the law or human life.
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:33 AM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,051 posts, read 21,178,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madicarus2000 View Post
The article in the OP didn’t have that information as it was developing. I found it in another article that had a little more to the report and identified the type of vehicle that struck the agent.



It matters a lot. You need to know who the person was and why they were coming over to know who to go after. Do you assume it was some illegal looking for a $7 hour job or some drug smuggler running drugs in a high priced off-road vehicle? Where do you want to spend the resources to go after the killer of the agent?

That’s the problem with these immigration threads. When a crime is committed and there is a remote possiblity it was an illegal, then it is assumed it was an illegal immigrant and related to the immigration problem. The fact is a lot of crimes are not related to immigrants and anti-illegal-immigrant posters are too quick to point fingers without actually asking some rational questions.



No one is arguing that the agent should not have been killed doing their job. The fact is we don’t know who killed the agent and without calmer heads asking the question “who drives a hummer in an area known for drug smuggling” you’ll never find the killer if you only focus on illegal immigrants.
So drug smuggler and illegal alien are mutually exclusive terms now?

Incidentally, the reason they were trying to stop the Hummer (which swerved toward the officer in a deliberate attempt to strike him down) is because they had observed it entering the US from Mexico - read on:

SignOnSanDiego.com > News > State -- Fleeing vehicle strikes, kills border agent

"The incident began about half an hour earlier when agents saw a brown Hummer and a red Ford F-250 pickup crossing from Mexico into the United States about 20 miles west of Yuma."
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,640,026 times
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Yuma Border Patrol agent killed by smugglers

More info concerning the Yuma murder of the BP agent
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:35 AM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,713,551 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madicarus2000 View Post
The article in the OP didn’t have that information as it was developing. I found it in another article that had a little more to the report and identified the type of vehicle that struck the agent.



It matters a lot. You need to know who the person was and why they were coming over to know who to go after. Do you assume it was some illegal looking for a $7 hour job or some drug smuggler running drugs in a high priced off-road vehicle? Where do you want to spend the resources to go after the killer of the agent?

That’s the problem with these immigration threads. When a crime is committed and there is a remote possiblity it was an illegal, then it is assumed it was an illegal immigrant and related to the immigration problem. The fact is a lot of crimes are not related to immigrants and anti-illegal-immigrant posters are too quick to point fingers without actually asking some rational questions.



No one is arguing that the agent should not have been killed doing their job. The fact is we don’t know who killed the agent and without calmer heads asking the question “who drives a hummer in an area known for drug smuggling” you’ll never find the killer if you only focus on illegal immigrants.
I want to make sure I am reading this correctly. Are you saying people are wrong to assume the killer was an illegal alien?........ This flies in the face of the most rudimentary level of common sense. The Hummer entered the country at an unauthorized area, killed a BP agent in cold blood and fled back to Mexico. "Who drives a Hummer in an area known for drug smuggling?" Who do you think? This was not some elderly American who took a wrong turn on the way home from Tijuana. IMO, the chances that anyone other than an illegal alien involved in drug smuggling was at the wheel are just about zero.
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:47 AM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 2,124,906 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DontH8Me View Post
So drug smuggler and illegal alien are mutually exclusive terms now?
Yes, because smugglers of all types (human or drugs) are people without a conscious and wouldn’t hesitate to kill to get away whereas many illegals coming over for work prefer to run and hide. Please note the word “many” in which is different from “all” before people post about illegals committing other crimes.

Also, not all drug smugglers are illegal aliens, US Citizens have been convicted for drug smuggling.

Last edited by madicarus2000; 01-22-2008 at 12:19 PM.. Reason: grammar
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Small patch of terra firma
1,275 posts, read 2,124,906 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
I want to make sure I am reading this correctly. Are you saying people are wrong to assume the killer was an illegal alien?
No, they are not wrong to assume the person is an illegal alien, but that just loses focus on the actual problem. The thread started talking about the illegal alien coming over for the $7 an hour job and the implication is they are involved. However how many coyotes running people over use a hummer? Sounds more like a drug running vehicle. So I don’t think this death may be related to the immigration issue as much as it is on the “war on drugs” issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
........ This flies in the face of the most rudimentary level of common sense. The Hummer entered the country at an unauthorized area, killed a BP agent in cold blood and fled back to Mexico. "Who drives a Hummer in an area known for drug smuggling?" Who do you think? This was not some elderly American who took a wrong turn on the way home from Tijuana. IMO, the chances that anyone other than an illegal alien involved in drug smuggling was at the wheel are just about zero.
\
Drug smuggler, that is who I think more than likely is responsible. The citizenship status doesn’t concern me at this point and I wont focus on their status. I don’t look at this as the person crossed the border illegally and therefore they are an illegal immigrant and here is another example of the immigration problem, I look at this as the dangers of drug smugglers at the border areas.

Last edited by madicarus2000; 01-22-2008 at 12:12 PM.. Reason: meant problem not people.
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Old 01-22-2008, 12:21 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,051 posts, read 21,178,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madicarus2000 View Post
Yes, because smugglers of all types (human or drugs) are people without a conscious and wouldn’t hesitate to kill to get away whereas many illegals coming over for work prefer to run and hide. Please note the word “many” in which is different from “all” before people post about illegals committing other crimes.

Also, not all drug smugglers are illegal aliens. US Citizens have been convicted for drug smuggling also.
Sorry, but you are WRONG. The fact that people other than illegals can be smugglers does not make the terms mutually exclusive. Sorry that the view of the forest is obscured by the trees.
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Old 01-22-2008, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Des Moines, IA
1,744 posts, read 6,488,871 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Rhino View Post
1. I didn't even see "Hummer".
.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontH8Me View Post
You seem to assume that the driver of the Hummer (interesting, I never knew you could afford a Hummer on $7/hour) has the same set of values as you and the rest of law-abiding America has.

Once again, "I didn't even see "Hummer".


When did I say that this guy has the same set of values as law-abiding America? Is there something wrong me or is there something wrong with the rest of you today?
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Old 01-22-2008, 12:59 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,713,551 times
Reputation: 1285
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Rhino View Post
Once again, "I didn't even see "Hummer".


When did I say that this guy has the same set of values as law-abiding America? Is there something wrong me or is there something wrong with the rest of you today?
The problem is not that the exemplary individual driving the hummer does not have the same set of values as law abiding Americans. The problem is that he has no values at all.
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Old 01-22-2008, 01:23 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,051 posts, read 21,178,051 times
Reputation: 22525
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
The problem is not that the exemplary individual driving the hummer does not have the same set of values as law abiding Americans. The problem is that he has no values at all.
What she said.
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