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Old 02-07-2008, 06:49 PM
 
83 posts, read 248,668 times
Reputation: 59

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Unlike say the Jews after WW II would suffered ghastly losses courtesy of the Nazi's causing 'Third World' conditions for most of the Holocaust survivors-------but had the 'human capital' to bounce back (with a relatively small infusion of money and moral support)----------most, if not all Third World countries are dysfunctional to start with.

Take Mexico: that country has tremendous natural resources yet is a screwed up mess.

Yet; even the WW II 'Gentile' Germans and Japanese rebuilt their shattered, burned out truncated countries back into powerhouses within one generation.

If the Germans, Japanese and Jews can do so: what is Mexico's, etc. problem?
Well, the main problem is the extreme economic gap in Mexico, which is widening every day. Mexico's rich are being made richer, while many of its lower class citizens simply cannot elevate their financial or social status.
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Old 02-07-2008, 06:51 PM
 
83 posts, read 248,668 times
Reputation: 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
We have a culture------where the rule of law applies, etc.

Unlike a Third World country.

Face it: if said Third World countries have such great cultures; why are there quite a few of their citizens here (including their spouses and children) breaking our laws by their physical presence?

If the illegal Latinos, etc. do not like the way we do things here.......they can self deport.
I think you're blurring the line between culture and the immigrants' financial and social situations. Besides, who are we to say whose culture is the best?
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Old 02-07-2008, 06:53 PM
 
1,252 posts, read 725,461 times
Reputation: 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Unlike say the Jews after WW II would suffered ghastly losses courtesy of the Nazi's causing 'Third World' conditions for most of the Holocaust survivors-------but had the 'human capital' to bounce back (with a relatively small infusion of money and moral support)----------most, if not all Third World countries are dysfunctional to start with.

Take Mexico: that country has tremendous natural resources yet is a screwed up mess.

Yet; even the WW II 'Gentile' Germans and Japanese rebuilt their shattered, burned out truncated countries back into powerhouses within one generation.

If the Germans, Japanese and Jews can do so: what is Mexico's, etc. problem?
That doesn't address the question I asked,

......then again, nor does it sufficiently represent all that conditioned the changes in those countries you're talking about.

.
..
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Old 02-07-2008, 07:31 PM
 
337 posts, read 727,999 times
Reputation: 157
I don't think anyone here is saying that immigrants can't keep their native culture in their private lives. What is being said is this is America, English is the language and if you want to communicate with Americans, speak English. Speak whatever you choose at home, with friends, family, ect.
Oh and by the way, lots of people speak German-I guess you are missing that because they also LEARNED English when they came to this country....Fancy that.
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Old 02-07-2008, 07:36 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,610,630 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Kweens View Post
Well, I still think that many of you are being incredibly near-sighted and closed-minded. Disagreeing with illegal immigration is one thing; but discouraging the continuation of a culture is in another class entirely.
Discouraging the continuation of a CULTURE? Who wants to do THAT? Cultures are WONDERFUL....Cooking..music....dancing.....female genital mutilation...forced marriages of 12-year olds....honor killings....suicide bombings....forced prostitution.....dogs for dinner....religiously-sanctioned gang-rapes....maybe an occasional blood feud....BRING 'EM ON !......WHAT EVER gave you the idea that people shouldn't celebrate their native culture, just because they chose to come here? Far be it from US to ask anyone to abandon that which is dear to them.....

I think you've got us all WRONG...
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Old 02-07-2008, 07:40 PM
 
307 posts, read 458,111 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Kweens View Post
Let's say you, for whatever reason, decide to immigrate to another first-world country with a vastly different culture--how about Japan, for example. You are far more successful in Japan than you were in America, and assimilate into the Japanese culture after a while. However, you are concerned that you may be losing touch with the American culture you left behind. To show that, though you are now Japanese, you are still an American at heart, you fly the American flag, along with the Japanese flag, above your home or business. Suddenly you are confronted with hatred from the local Japanese community, escalating into hatred from the nation as a whole.

Of course, this could never happen in another first world country,

Your analogy is quite poor. You picked what most everyone who has traveled would agree is, on the surface, one of the most polite, non confrontational countries around. Additionally the Japanese pride themselves on not loosing their anger or cool. Second Japan has no real problem with ILLEGAL Americans in their country.

To give a proper analogy imagine that 12 million Americans ILLEGALLY snuck into Germany (a first world country), created problems for the country, took jobs from German citizens, lowered the going wages and held demonstrations in the country with some claiming that part of Germany actually belonged to the ILLEGAL Americans.

Do you want to take a guess as to the backlash?

If you have any doubt please look at the level of hate in Germany towards LEGAL and ILLEGAL immigrants. In Germany in 1999 the government, recorded 10,037 criminal offenses with racist or xenophobic motives. Radicals in Germany have burned down apartments with LEGAL immigrants in them resulting in dozens of deaths, one occurring just this week. That’s with an illegal immgrant population 1/10th of ours.

You want to honestly try to portray America as an insane hate filled country because a veteran removed a display that many in most countries in the world would find insulting? Nevermind flying a countries flag above another across the pond, Just try flying opposing soccer colors over another at a German or British soccer match. I’ll talk to you when you get out of the hospital.

Lets not even get started on how most other countries in the world tolerate and deal with ILLEGAL immigrants. We treat ours wonderfully by comparison to most countries.

RandomU

Last edited by RandomU; 02-07-2008 at 07:54 PM..
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Old 02-07-2008, 07:47 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,610,630 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomU View Post
Your analogy is quite poor. You picked what most everyone who has traveled would agree is, on the surface, one of the most polite, non confrontational countries around. Additionally the Japanese pride themselves on not loosing their anger or cool. Second Japan has no real problem with ILLEGAL Americans in their country.

To give a proper analogy imagine that 12 million Americans ILLEGALLY snuck into Germany (a first world country), created problems for the country, took jobs from German citizens, lowered the going wages and held demonstrations in the country with some claiming that part of Germany actually belonged to the ILLEGAL Americans.

Do you want to take a guess as to the backlash?

If you have any doubt please look at the level of hate in Germany towards LEGAL immigrants. Yes that’s right LEGAL. In Germany in 1999 the government, recorded 10,037 criminal offenses with racist or xenophobic motives. Radicals in Germany have burned down apartment with LEGAL immigrants in them resulting in dozens of deths, one occurring just this week.

You want to honestly try to portray America as an insane hate filled country because a veteran removed a display that many in most countries in the world would find insulting? Nevermind flying a countries flag above another across the pond, Just try flying opposing soccer colors over another at a German or British soccer match. I’ll talk to you when you get out of the hospital.

Lets not even get started on how most other countries in the world tolerate and deal with ILLEGAL immigrants. We treat ours wonderfully by comparison to most countries.

RandomU
Absolutely on target. GREAT analogy, in contrast to the silliness of the previous example. Well-crafted...."America is an AWFUL place, mean, xenophobic, and racist" is a charge made with montonous frequency. But we never get to hear, "meaner than 'who'?.....more xenophobic than 'where'?......racist, in comparison to what OTHER society?".....the answer is usually dead silence... As I've said many times, America may be tough on illegal Mexicans, but it treats them a lot better than Mexico does....
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Old 02-07-2008, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,173,411 times
Reputation: 391
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Kweens View Post
Well, the main problem is the extreme economic gap in Mexico, which is widening every day. Mexico's rich are being made richer, while many of its lower class citizens simply cannot elevate their financial or social status.
That description sounds like what's happening right here in America...
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:00 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Kweens View Post
Well, the main problem is the extreme economic gap in Mexico, which is widening every day. Mexico's rich are being made richer, while many of its lower class citizens simply cannot elevate their financial or social status.
Not our problem.

The 'peons' SOB are already taking responsibility for themselves as in limiting the sizes of their families (the birthrate per woman in Mexico has dropped from 7.3 children in 1962 down to under 2.4 kids today------replacement level is 2.1), improving their education, etc.

All the more reason to close/lock our border with Mexico-------to force the elite there to deal with their brethren instead of the USA being the former country's safety valve.
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:09 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Kweens View Post
I think you're blurring the line between culture and the immigrants' financial and social situations. Besides, who are we to say whose culture is the best?
We as a people are not 'perfect'------no culture is.

That stated: if a foreigner comes here; they need to abide by our ways of doing things.

If I went to Mexico and tried to pull that same crap; the Federales would hustle me out post haste------if I was lucky.
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