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Old 03-02-2008, 10:22 AM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,694,322 times
Reputation: 3010

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Jihad Watch: Palestinian commander: Palestinians' war with the Jews is part of global jihad -

"Quoth Sheik Abu "The Enforcer" Saqer, "Let them send their children only to sharia Islamic nurseries where they will teach the principles of the Quran." (Like how to terrorize infidel swine Christians, or better yet, how to kill filthy Zionist apes!) Of course, the Christians brought this on themselves."

Talk To Action | Reclaiming Citizenship, History, and Faith -

"In "Jerusalem Countdown: A Prelude To war" Hagee has stated that Jews brought the Holocaust upon themselves by rebelling against God and that the Holocaust was God's way of forcing Jews to move to Israel where, Hagee predicts according to his interpretation of Biblical scripture, they will be mostly killed in the apocalyptic Mideast conflict Hagee's new lobbying group seems to be working to provoke and which John Hagee believes to be a necessary precondition for the "Rapture" that will lift Christians, but not Jews, bodily into Heaven to enjoy physical immortality amidst paradise."

Baptists to protest VT funerals, say they brought this on themselves - Southern Maryland Community Forums -

"The organization, founded and led by Fred Phelps, believes the United States has condemned itself to destruction by accepting homosexuality and other “sins of the flesh.” Phelps’ daughter, Shirley Phelps-Roper, said the Virginia Tech teachers and students who died on Monday brought their fate upon themselves by not being true Christians."

Gee, it's amazing how everyone seems to "bring it on themselves".

Ken
Your analogies do not work on any sort of level. Christians are not marching down Islamic streets by the millions demanding rights and priviledges reserved for Islamists.

Jews were not marching through Germany by the millions demanding that the Germans treat them better than their own citizens, while decimating the German social services.

In each stated "case" you make, groups of people were made targets based on religious dogma and fundamentalism--yet another reason I have no use for organized religion, but that is another topic entirely. And those who propagated the eradication of people based on dogma were evil, plain and simple. No one is advocating the desruction of the illegal immigrant population, but I'm sure you would like to see such a thing in order to validate your own racist beliefs that those of us opposing the illegal entry into our country by millions of lawbreakers are little more than little Hitlers.

Religious intolerance and the subsequent annihilation of entire populations cannot be compared to the current American attitude toward illegal immigrants. These people have come into our country illegally, overburdened our social systems and hospitals, lowered wages within entire economic sectors, killed thousands of Americans, refuse to assimilate while sending billions of American dollars back to the home country economies, and then, to add insult to injury, they march in American streets by the millions, insisting that their unlawful behavior entitles them to the rights and priviledges normally reserved for American citizens.

No one is advocating the round up and obliteration of illegal immigrants. We don't wish to gas them en masse and steal the gold from their teeth to fuel our extermination machine. On the contrary, we simply want them to go back to where they came from and if they truly wish to be a part of the American fabric, to get in line behind those wishing to legally emigrate to this country.

Last edited by Kele; 03-02-2008 at 10:36 AM..
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Old 03-02-2008, 10:32 AM
 
Location: southern california
55,237 posts, read 72,472,599 times
Reputation: 47456
we dont seem to be able to do much about it. seems like illegal immigration is going to win.
strange our government is in a partnership to break the laws it made. i guess if we stop spending
then they would listen? but then i wouldn't buy jr my lil 35 year old kidult on the couch a new lexus this year,
what am i thinking?
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Old 03-02-2008, 12:43 PM
 
9,742 posts, read 9,067,258 times
Reputation: 2049
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Jihad Watch: Palestinian commander: Palestinians' war with the Jews is part of global jihad -

"Quoth Sheik Abu "The Enforcer" Saqer, "Let them send their children only to sharia Islamic nurseries where they will teach the principles of the Quran." (Like how to terrorize infidel swine Christians, or better yet, how to kill filthy Zionist apes!) Of course, the Christians brought this on themselves."

Talk To Action | Reclaiming Citizenship, History, and Faith -

"In "Jerusalem Countdown: A Prelude To war" Hagee has stated that Jews brought the Holocaust upon themselves by rebelling against God and that the Holocaust was God's way of forcing Jews to move to Israel where, Hagee predicts according to his interpretation of Biblical scripture, they will be mostly killed in the apocalyptic Mideast conflict Hagee's new lobbying group seems to be working to provoke and which John Hagee believes to be a necessary precondition for the "Rapture" that will lift Christians, but not Jews, bodily into Heaven to enjoy physical immortality amidst paradise."

Baptists to protest VT funerals, say they brought this on themselves - Southern Maryland Community Forums -

"The organization, founded and led by Fred Phelps, believes the United States has condemned itself to destruction by accepting homosexuality and other “sins of the flesh.” Phelps’ daughter, Shirley Phelps-Roper, said the Virginia Tech teachers and students who died on Monday brought their fate upon themselves by not being true Christians."

Gee, it's amazing how everyone seems to "bring it on themselves".

Ken
Comparing anger at lawbreakers to the nutjob Phelps, the holocaust and Islamic jihad is beyond ridiculous.

We're not going to turn the other cheek. They enter illegally. We get mad. Simple as that. They brought this on themselves by their actions. Capiche?
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Old 03-02-2008, 12:47 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
18,983 posts, read 21,957,844 times
Reputation: 6553
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
Your analogies do not work on any sort of level. Christians are not marching down Islamic streets by the millions demanding rights and priviledges reserved for Islamists.

Jews were not marching through Germany by the millions demanding that the Germans treat them better than their own citizens, while decimating the German social services.

In each stated "case" you make, groups of people were made targets based on religious dogma and fundamentalism--yet another reason I have no use for organized religion, but that is another topic entirely. And those who propagated the eradication of people based on dogma were evil, plain and simple. No one is advocating the desruction of the illegal immigrant population, but I'm sure you would like to see such a thing in order to validate your own racist beliefs that those of us opposing the illegal entry into our country by millions of lawbreakers are little more than little Hitlers.

Religious intolerance and the subsequent annihilation of entire populations cannot be compared to the current American attitude toward illegal immigrants. These people have come into our country illegally, overburdened our social systems and hospitals, lowered wages within entire economic sectors, killed thousands of Americans, refuse to assimilate while sending billions of American dollars back to the home country economies, and then, to add insult to injury, they march in American streets by the millions, insisting that their unlawful behavior entitles them to the rights and priviledges normally reserved for American citizens.

No one is advocating the round up and obliteration of illegal immigrants. We don't wish to gas them en masse and steal the gold from their teeth to fuel our extermination machine. On the contrary, we simply want them to go back to where they came from and if they truly wish to be a part of the American fabric, to get in line behind those wishing to legally emigrate to this country.
Think again. Take a look at the home page of the American NAZI party:

American Nazi Party

The main topic on the home page is illegal immigration.
MOST Germans in 1939 didn't want to exterminate the Jews - in fact MOST Germans didn't want to do it at ANY time - but you know what? It happened in spite of what MOST Germans wanted. It happened because their distaste for the Jews partnered up with their refusal to see the true agenda of the people they'd allied themselves with (the NAZI party). Germany did not start with the idea the Jews should be rounded up and gassed - they just wanted the Jews (whom they considered to not be REAL Germans) to go someplace else. They didn't like the fact that they dressed different, they spoke another language, they listened to different music, etc, etc etc.

That was the point of the original post - that many of the same people fueling anti-immigration indignation, simply don't like people of any other culture or race. Personally I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to understand that. I mean, after all, what point of view would you expect groups like the American NAZI party, the KKK etc, to take - "Come on in to America all you foreigners and folks of different races"? Or course not. They are going to be anti-illegal immigration. In fact, they are going to be anti-legal immigration for that matter (or at the very least, severely limiting it). They are going to be anti-multicuturalism. They are going to avocate violence to meet these ends. I've seen posts advocating all 3 of these positions right here on this board.

I agree that illegal immigration is a serious problem and needs to be properly addressed - but I also think that many people - uncluding some on this board - would like nothing more than to use the issue as an excuse for a more extreme agenda. Lots of folks continue to start threads here pointing out crimes committed by illegal aliens - and those crimes do occur - but they fail to mention the fact that hate crime directed against Hispanics (not just illegals, but legal immigrants and even American Hispanics) are on the rise - no doubt fueled by this same anti-illegal immigration furvor.

Illegal Immigration is one of those topics that can easily lead people down the slippery slope towards extremism and violent racism - and hate groups like the American NAZI Party know that. It is fertile ground for recruitment to their cause.

Again, that was the WHOLE point to the original post - and I agree with the assessment of that original poster. I've studied WW II extensively, and at one time intended to teach it. My father lived in Germany under Hitler (even though he was an American citizen (a child living with his grandparents)) - and his Grandmother's brother was a high ranking Wehrmacht officer (later sent to prison for war-crimes) so I have a strong personal interest in (and connection to) what can happen to otherwise decent people who get caught up with racism and extreme nationalism.

Don't think it can happen here?
Think again.
It can happen anywhere - and it begins when you make an unholy alliance with people espousing hate.

Ken
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Old 03-02-2008, 12:48 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
Your analogies do not work on any sort of level. Christians are not marching down Islamic streets by the millions demanding rights and priviledges reserved for Islamists.

Jews were not marching through Germany by the millions demanding that the Germans treat them better than their own citizens, while decimating the German social services.

In each stated "case" you make, groups of people were made targets based on religious dogma and fundamentalism--yet another reason I have no use for organized religion, but that is another topic entirely. And those who propagated the eradication of people based on dogma were evil, plain and simple. No one is advocating the desruction of the illegal immigrant population, but I'm sure you would like to see such a thing in order to validate your own racist beliefs that those of us opposing the illegal entry into our country by millions of lawbreakers are little more than little Hitlers.

Religious intolerance and the subsequent annihilation of entire populations cannot be compared to the current American attitude toward illegal immigrants. These people have come into our country illegally, overburdened our social systems and hospitals, lowered wages within entire economic sectors, killed thousands of Americans, refuse to assimilate while sending billions of American dollars back to the home country economies, and then, to add insult to injury, they march in American streets by the millions, insisting that their unlawful behavior entitles them to the rights and priviledges normally reserved for American citizens.

No one is advocating the round up and obliteration of illegal immigrants. We don't wish to gas them en masse and steal the gold from their teeth to fuel our extermination machine. On the contrary, we simply want them to go back to where they came from and if they truly wish to be a part of the American fabric, to get in line behind those wishing to legally emigrate to this country.
Kudos! If it were possible to give you reps, I certainly would.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:00 PM
 
9,742 posts, read 9,067,258 times
Reputation: 2049
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Think again. Take a look at the home page of the American NAZI party:

American Nazi Party

The main topic on the home page is illegal immigration.
MOST Germans in 1939 didn't want to exterminate the Jews - in fact MOST Germans didn't want to do it at ANY time - but you know what? It happened in spite of what MOST Germans wanted. It happened because their distaste for the Jews partnered up with their refusal to see the true agenda of the people they'd allied themselves with (the NAZI party). Germany did not start with the idea the Jews should be rounded up and gassed - they just wanted the Jews (whom they considered to not be REAL Germans) to go someplace else. They didn't like the fact that they dressed different, they spoke another language, they listened to different music, etc, etc etc.

That was the point of the original post - that many of the same people fueling anti-immigration indignation, simply don't like people of any other culture or race. Personally I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to understand that. I mean, after all, what point of view would you expect groups like the American NAZI party, the KKK etc, to take - "Come on in to America all you foreigners and folks of different races"? Or course not. They are going to be anti-illegal immigration. In fact, they are going to be anti-legal immigration for that matter (or at the very least, severely limiting it). They are going to be anti-multicuturalism. They are going to avocate violence to meet these ends. I've seen posts advocating all 3 of these positions right here on this board.

I agree that illegal immigration is a serious problem and needs to be properly addressed - but I also think that many people - uncluding some on this board - would like nothing more than to use the issue as an excuse for a more extreme agenda. Lots of folks continue to start threads here pointing out crimes committed by illegal aliens - and those crimes do occur - but they fail to mention the fact that hate crime directed against Hispanics (not just illegals, but legal immigrants and even American Hispanics) are on the rise - no doubt fueled by this same anti-illegal immigration furvor.

Illegal Immigration is one of those topics that can easily lead people down the slippery slope towards extremism and violent racism - and hate groups like the American NAZI Party know that. It is fertile ground for recruitment to their cause.

Again, that was the WHOLE point to the original post - and I agree with the assessment of that original poster. I've studied WW II extensively, and at one time intended to teach it. My father lived in German under Hitler (even though he was an American citizen (a child living with his grandparents)) - and his Grandmother's brother was a high ranking Wehrmacht officer (later sent to prison for war-crimes) so I have a strong personal interest in (and connection to) what can happen to otherwise decent people who get caught up with racism and extreme nationalism.

Don't think it can happen here?
Think again.
It can happen anywhere - and it begins when you make an unholy alliance with people espousing hate.

Ken
You just don't get it.

Poll after poll shows that the US population is fervently against illegal immigration. We don't care about nazis. We care about the problem. We care about our culture. We care about our country. We're tired of being spat upon. WE'RE SICK OF BEING CALLED NAZIS.

Stop the illegal border crossing. Stop the racial supremacy, hatred, disrespect, lying, lawlessness, and fear-mongering from the PRO-ILLEGAL SIDE, and then we'll calm down. Not before.

We're angry, rightfully, and every day that goes by when nothing is done only fuels this anger. Posting nonsense like this will not change our minds.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:19 PM
 
1,818 posts, read 2,736,258 times
Reputation: 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Think again. Take a look at the home page of the American NAZI party:

American Nazi Party

The main topic on the home page is illegal immigration.
MOST Germans in 1939 didn't want to exterminate the Jews - in fact MOST Germans didn't want to do it at ANY time - but you know what? It happened in spite of what MOST Germans wanted. It happened because their distaste for the Jews partnered up with their refusal to see the true agenda of the people they'd allied themselves with (the NAZI party). Germany did not start with the idea the Jews should be rounded up and gassed - they just wanted the Jews (whom they considered to not be REAL Germans) to go someplace else. They didn't like the fact that they dressed different, they spoke another language, they listened to different music, etc, etc etc.

That was the point of the original post - that many of the same people fueling anti-immigration indignation, simply don't like people of any other culture or race. Personally I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to understand that. I mean, after all, what point of view would you expect groups like the American NAZI party, the KKK etc, to take - "Come on in to America all you foreigners and folks of different races"? Or course not. They are going to be anti-illegal immigration. In fact, they are going to be anti-legal immigration for that matter (or at the very least, severely limiting it). They are going to be anti-multicuturalism. They are going to avocate violence to meet these ends. I've seen posts advocating all 3 of these positions right here on this board.

I agree that illegal immigration is a serious problem and needs to be properly addressed - but I also think that many people - uncluding some on this board - would like nothing more than to use the issue as an excuse for a more extreme agenda. Lots of folks continue to start threads here pointing out crimes committed by illegal aliens - and those crimes do occur - but they fail to mention the fact that hate crime directed against Hispanics (not just illegals, but legal immigrants and even American Hispanics) are on the rise - no doubt fueled by this same anti-illegal immigration furvor.

Illegal Immigration is one of those topics that can easily lead people down the slippery slope towards extremism and violent racism - and hate groups like the American NAZI Party know that. It is fertile ground for recruitment to their cause.

Again, that was the WHOLE point to the original post - and I agree with the assessment of that original poster. I've studied WW II extensively, and at one time intended to teach it. My father lived in Germany under Hitler (even though he was an American citizen (a child living with his grandparents)) - and his Grandmother's brother was a high ranking Wehrmacht officer (later sent to prison for war-crimes) so I have a strong personal interest in (and connection to) what can happen to otherwise decent people who get caught up with racism and extreme nationalism.

Don't think it can happen here?
Think again.
It can happen anywhere - and it begins when you make an unholy alliance with people espousing hate.
a
Ken
Great post and that is why more and more Illegal Aliens are getting more and more support. It is when p.eople of any race, religion or color are treated LESS or thought to be LESS than themselves. In this case it is the "we hate illegal group. For those who don't like to be called a Nazi, stop acting like a Nazi.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Missouri of course
407 posts, read 715,261 times
Reputation: 142
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post

Gee, it's amazing how everyone seems to "bring it on themselves".

Ken
Yes, it most certainly is and it is amazing at how some like to make excuses for them. Know anyone like that? I, and others in here do.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:49 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,694,322 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Think again. Take a look at the home page of the American NAZI party:

American Nazi Party

The main topic on the home page is illegal immigration.
MOST Germans in 1939 didn't want to exterminate the Jews - in fact MOST Germans didn't want to do it at ANY time - but you know what? It happened in spite of what MOST Germans wanted. It happened because their distaste for the Jews partnered up with their refusal to see the true agenda of the people they'd allied themselves with (the NAZI party). Germany did not start with the idea the Jews should be rounded up and gassed - they just wanted the Jews (whom they considered to not be REAL Germans) to go someplace else. They didn't like the fact that they dressed different, they spoke another language, they listened to different music, etc, etc etc.

That was the point of the original post - that many of the same people fueling anti-immigration indignation, simply don't like people of any other culture or race. Personally I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to understand that. I mean, after all, what point of view would you expect groups like the American NAZI party, the KKK etc, to take - "Come on in to America all you foreigners and folks of different races"? Or course not. They are going to be anti-illegal immigration. In fact, they are going to be anti-legal immigration for that matter (or at the very least, severely limiting it). They are going to be anti-multicuturalism. They are going to avocate violence to meet these ends. I've seen posts advocating all 3 of these positions right here on this board.

I agree that illegal immigration is a serious problem and needs to be properly addressed - but I also think that many people - uncluding some on this board - would like nothing more than to use the issue as an excuse for a more extreme agenda. Lots of folks continue to start threads here pointing out crimes committed by illegal aliens - and those crimes do occur - but they fail to mention the fact that hate crime directed against Hispanics (not just illegals, but legal immigrants and even American Hispanics) are on the rise - no doubt fueled by this same anti-illegal immigration furvor.

Illegal Immigration is one of those topics that can easily lead people down the slippery slope towards extremism and violent racism - and hate groups like the American NAZI Party know that. It is fertile ground for recruitment to their cause.

Again, that was the WHOLE point to the original post - and I agree with the assessment of that original poster. I've studied WW II extensively, and at one time intended to teach it. My father lived in Germany under Hitler (even though he was an American citizen (a child living with his grandparents)) - and his Grandmother's brother was a high ranking Wehrmacht officer (later sent to prison for war-crimes) so I have a strong personal interest in (and connection to) what can happen to otherwise decent people who get caught up with racism and extreme nationalism.

Don't think it can happen here?
Think again.
It can happen anywhere - and it begins when you make an unholy alliance with people espousing hate.

Ken
Oh please.

You're comparing apples to oranges--while continuing to insist that those who are against the illegal breaching of our borders are vile racists all and that our opposition to this unlawful breaking and entering is some slippery slope to a 21st century holocaust.

Your American Nazi party aligned with the KKK make up less than 1/2 of 1/4 of 1% of the population of the U.S.--I think it highly unlikely that any "unholy alliances" with these types of individuals or groups will exist anywhere other than your mind and I'm sure you're probably reached the point in your career where you are spotting Nazi's under every rock.

You should really re-think your analogy strategy. I really doubt that there are too many folks on this forum that are taking these Nazi analogies of yours very seriously.

I know I'm not.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:54 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyone View Post
Great post and that is why more and more Illegal Aliens are getting more and more support. It is when p.eople of any race, religion or color are treated LESS or thought to be LESS than themselves. In this case it is the "we hate illegal group. For those who don't like to be called a Nazi, stop acting like a Nazi.
As I see it, the ‘real’ exploiters/haters of illegal aliens are the greedy corporations and special interest groups who rely on the cheap labor to amass great profits and further their selfish agendas.

How are they treated ‘less’ or thought to be ‘less’ than legal citizens? In spite of being here illegally -- they receive a ‘free’ K-12 education (including ‘free’ breakfast/lunch), ‘free’ prenatal care and delivery, ‘free’ emergency medical treatment, ‘free’ food stamps and subsidized housing, ‘free’ legal representation, ‘free’ imprisonment. All of these are ‘free’ for the illegals -- yet, the U.S. taxpayers foot the bill.

Go to Mexico illegally and see how many of these benefits are offered. Heck, they don’t even offer these benefits to their own people. Name one other country one can enter illegally and be treated to such freebies?

The illegals are being treated far better than the ‘legal’ blacks were treated for centuries in this country. Furthermore, they are treated better than many ‘legal’ citizens are treated today in this country.

Where is the gratitude? It would be a novel and welcomed change, if just ONCE, illegal aliens demonstrated some semblance of appreciation for the generosity of the taxpayers of this country –- rather than whining and demanding MORE, MORE, MORE!
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