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Old 05-16-2017, 07:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeinChina View Post
Yeah I would agree with Tiger Lily. Its going to be very hard for the IRS to find the Chinese with newly American passports (Citizens) esp with many of them now returning to live in China.


I've lived in China for 15 years as an American and always file, but I know at least 8 or 9 American expats who are buddies of mine that never file. They haven't filed in over 10 or 15 years and never receive a letter from the IRS. Most don't make over the 100K tax free mark, but still I'm sure they should pay something but never file.
If they can find Canadian high school girls, they can find US citizens in China.

The IRS's Attack on Accidental Americans
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Old 05-16-2017, 08:11 AM
 
Location: North Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeinChina View Post
Really? Living in Cuba? WOW what a story. The things people will do to avoid taxes.....lol. Its a pain in the arse to file, but still in took me like 3 hours to do so while I was in the office one day last week. I think you have lots of expats in Asia and Europe who are running away from something in the U.S. and the IRS falls under that umbrella of "The government" and the "Evil Empire" of the federal government in the U.S.
Yup...it's amazing how many American expats you meet in Europe who have some pretty serious civil, financial, or even criminal problems in the US. I guess it doesn't occur to them that first-world nations like France, Germany, the UK, etc. have no reservations whatsoever about deporting/extraditing them.

I'm pretty sure the one who went to Cuba did so because he assumed the Cuban government would never extradite him to the US. I don't know exactly what he did but it must have been pretty damn serious.
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Old 05-16-2017, 09:41 PM
 
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@InformedConsent........Going after someone in Canada is a completely different situation then trying to go after someone in China, esp on a tax matter.
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Old 05-17-2017, 06:08 AM
 
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Originally Posted by JakeinChina View Post
@InformedConsent........Going after someone in Canada is a completely different situation then trying to go after someone in China, esp on a tax matter.
No, it isn't. FATCA applies to financial institutions, worldwide.

Rich Chinese in Reach of New US Tax Law
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Old 05-17-2017, 06:38 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn
1,073 posts, read 494,969 times
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Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
No, it isn't. FATCA applies to financial institutions, worldwide.

Rich Chinese in Reach of New US Tax Law
CPA here with tax and auditing experience in public accounting. Do you understand the intricacies of FATCA and FBAR? For people with dual citizenship living overseas, it can be extremely difficult for the IRS to determine if they have any reportable and taxable income despite the pressure FATCA regs put on foreign banks and financial institution.

Let me give you a personal example. I hold dual citizenship and had a joint bank account opened for me when I was a child. (Account holders are me, my mom and brother). I didn't know anything about this account at the time, I was a child. Two years ago when I was doing a real estate transaction with my brother in this foreign country, I submitted my US docs (SSN, passport, credit report etc.) to the lender (bank).

A couple months later they sent me an email stating that by law they are required to report this bank account to the IRS as per compliance with FATCA. Basically, if I hadn't submitted any docs proving US indicia they and the IRS wouldn't know that I am a US citizen with foreign financial account overseas. There are many people like this overseas. Many smart people (or dishonest, depending on how you view the US global taxation rules) with another passport living overseas NEVER use their US docs because that's how the banks and other institutions identify them to the IRS.

In my situation I didn't have to file a report under FATCA because I didn't meet the threshold. I did have to file a FBAR report though.

Even though Chinese banks agreed to comply with FATCA, I'm willing to bet that many don't.
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Old 05-17-2017, 07:16 AM
 
62,488 posts, read 27,792,836 times
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Originally Posted by bullandre View Post
CPA here with tax and auditing experience in public accounting. Do you understand the intricacies of FATCA and FBAR? For people with dual citizenship living overseas, it can be extremely difficult for the IRS to determine if they have any reportable and taxable income despite the pressure FATCA regs put on foreign banks and financial institution.
My spouse is a CPA. Deals with international financial institutions on exactly this issue all the time. Remember, we're dealing with the IRS. They garnish wages and wipe out accounts first, ask questions later.
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Old 05-17-2017, 08:36 PM
 
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Sorry InformedConsent.......Your not informed very much on the way financial institutions operate in Asia or China. Yes, there is FACTA, but so what. First off, there is no extradition treaty between the U.S. and China. Do you know how hard it is to extradite a person in China and send them to the U.S. to stand trial? Esp when its going to be on not paying a 50k or 100k USD IRS bill, which is peanuts to what's going on here in China in terms of corruption.


Its great that your wife is a CPA, and that your familiar with FACTA and some of the legal measures on taxation laws in the U.S. but written laws and how they are implemented in the U.S. vs globally are two very different things.


I'm an American, and I have no problem whatsoever in opening a local bank account in Bank of China, China Agricultural Bank or any of the main banks here in China as an American passport holder. If I was living in Western Europe, it would be a completely different situation and I wouldn't be able to open an account due to FATCA. Banks in China aren't implementing or following thru with this policy, nor do they have to. China has leverage on the U.S which Europe doesn't have obviously.


The world doesn't need to comply on every little policy or ruling the U.S. government introduces anymore. Things have changed, and with China as one of the big boys at the table now, they aren't going to be told how to manage their banks on their own soil. Chinese banks don't reply on the U.S. market like European banks do.
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Old 05-18-2017, 05:36 PM
 
62,488 posts, read 27,792,836 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JakeinChina View Post
Sorry InformedConsent.......Your not informed very much on the way financial institutions operate in Asia or China.
Actually, I am. My spouse is a CPA who has international clients, remember?

Rich Chinese in Reach of New US Tax Law
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Old 05-18-2017, 06:48 PM
 
Location: Kūkiʻo, HI & Manhattan Beach, CA
2,626 posts, read 6,003,927 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Actually, I am. My spouse is a CPA who has international clients, remember?

Rich Chinese in Reach of New US Tax Law
Are you a CPA or tax attorney that deals with China?
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Old 05-18-2017, 07:57 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn
1,073 posts, read 494,969 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
My spouse is a CPA. Deals with international financial institutions on exactly this issue all the time. Remember, we're dealing with the IRS. They garnish wages and wipe out accounts first, ask questions later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Actually, I am. My spouse is a CPA who has international clients, remember?

Rich Chinese in Reach of New US Tax Law
You realized that you haven't really addressed what I posted? You're just parroting something and posting links without realizing understanding the nuances. Again, for the most part, if you DO NOT inform these institutions abroad that you are a US resident/citizen, they would never know. Also, with China, we know they are famous for skirting and even ignoring US rules.

Chinese banks I think are all government owned, hence they will not succumb easily to US pressure. I know that plenty of people do not know this: China, like the US, taxes their citizens on worldwide income and it would be interesting to see what happens if China were to pass a FATCA type law. Would the American government agree to this and force US based banks to comply? I'm certain there was negotiation between both governments but I haven't seen or heard of any agreement on this issue.
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