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Chavez also hated illegals, and supported a closed border.
Does everyone feel so free to make comments without even a link or source to substantiate their opinion?
"We just want to address one “fact” that the mostly conservative crowd is bringing up again, as if it were some breaking news that suddenly discredits the legacy of Chávez..."
Was César Chávez consistently opposing illegal immigration and was he one of the country’s most anti-immigrant voices of his time?
Answer: Yes. And no. Mostly no. He changed his positions and at one point even wrote this in a 1974 open letter in The San Francisco Examiner: “the illegals [are] our brothers and sisters.”(ahh, the 70s, when PC language was not in vogue) History and scholarship would suggest that his positions were to protect the UFW, but in the end, he realized that the political winds were shifting, meaning that people should know their history and what actually happened before jumping to conclusions. Chávez’s views had more to do with how the government and businesses viewed immigration and why the system was broken. In fact, if people actually read the sources, Chávez’s views were not so either/or. What follows is what we found to prove this.
Well perhaps if we send the illegal immigrants home until they can respect our laws enough to enter the country LEGALLY, we can get a few snowflakes off the couch in mom's basement. If we can get them to work, that is.
And do not give me crap about how tough it is to get in here legally. My ex-wife is Peruvian. She gained her citizenship BEFORE we were married. It did take a little time, but it wasn't that hard for her to do. And no, she is not a nuclear physicist or brain surgeon.
My wife is a redhead. Don't give her any crap either...
The big myth on undocumented workers picking our food is that if Farm Workers were paid double for a head of lettuce a head of lettuce in the store will go up from $1 to $2.
The big myth on undocumented workers picking our food is that if Farm Workers were paid double for a head of lettuce a head of lettuce in the store will go up from $1 to $2.
This is a complete myth.
So what happens do food prices if lettuce Pickers are paid more?
If a 40% increase and wages cost two and a half cents per day then I think it's safe to say a hundred percent increase or dubling would cost maybe somewhere around $0.06 per day i'm all for that I gladly pay an extra $0.06 and for an American to have a job where they can earn enough money to live on. In fact if you tripled it or little more than tripled to say $0.10 a day you could pay a farm worker $60,000 to $70,000 per year.
Even if it's part time work let's say is just four months out of the year if somebody can make 20 to 25 thousand for four months worth of work in my opinion that your meat working from Walmart all year long.
And then there's the part about Americans won't work that hard well I'll tell you I've been a picker I used to pick string beans in a bean field just off the San Jose Airport and the early 1960s and it was hard work but I was very young . I liked the money a lot because I can make more money doing that than working in a McDonald's at the time.
Americans won't do the work because it's too hard they say but if salaries are raised high enough I think they would find the workers. Would you go out and pick lettuce for $2 an hour and a hot field? No, of course you wouldn't I wouldn't either but then that question comes up would you pick lettuce in a hot field for $1,000? I think most members of this form he would do exactly that yes, would pick lettuce for $1,000 per hour.
So the real wage is somewhere between $2 an hour and $1,000, isn't it?
A simple question to you, would you pick lettuce at a hot field all day long for $1,000 per hour?
Good bit of analysis, but you've got to start with the facts first, including the fact (and/or problem) that we're talking about seasonal work. People, typical Americans, especially with families, want full-time work.
How much do farm workers earn?
Based on the most recent National Agricultural Workers Survey (NAWS)– a report published by the U.S. Department of Labor– farm workers work 42 hours per week and earn $7.25 per hour on average, but this “average” varies greatly. For example, workers who have worked for the same employer for multiple years earn more than other workers. Those who have been with an employer for a year or less earn an average of $6.76 per hour, and those who have been with the same employer for at least 6 years earn an average of $8.05 per hour.
Annually, the average income of crop workers is between $10,000 to $12,499 for individuals and $15,000 to $17,499 for a family. To give you an idea, the federal poverty line is $10,830 for an individual or $22,050 for a family of four (in 2009).
The Piece Rate: Payment Based on Productivity
Most farm workers are paid based how many buckets or bags they pick of whatever crop they harvest—this is known as the “piece rate.” Payment in this format has some drawbacks.
First of all, if workers are being paid by how much they pick, this acts as a disincentive to take breaks for water or shade, as taking breaks would cut into their productivity and thus cut into their pay.
So you don't do your homework? You don't look at yelp or Angie's List to see if people are praising the work of Paul or Pedro?
You don't look at Yellow Page ads or at company websites to look at 'About Us' or to seek out companies that brag about serving the community for forty years?
When you call places to ask that someone come out to do an estimate - you can't tell if they sound like they've been here for thirty years or thirty months?
You just call Acme and a Hispanic shows up - and you don't have the cajones to say, 'I don't want to do anything illegal, and I mean no offense, but I just have to ask. Are you here legally? Are you able to show me something to prove that?'
I'm assuming you also don't care if they're licensed, bonded, insured?
Something doesn't quite add up here.
You assume much and apparently can't add too well...
I won't bother defending myself against your accusations, but just what do you think I do to get ANYONE to come to the house to do work? Stop people walking by on the sidewalk? You think you are the only one who knows about Angie's List, the value in references?
I've got a great electrician that was an employee of an Electric Company not too far from here. He since left that company but still comes here to help with electrical issues when they arise. The guy is fantastic, honest, reasonable, and Hispanic. He has been one who has provided me names of others who have come to our home to do other kinds of work, because I trust his judgement. Other times, I use Google to pull up contractors, check their ratings and generally get about three bids before I decide who to work with.
Most recent story I have was a disaster involving a custom-order shower pan for our bathroom. We had to reject the damn thing two times before they got the third one right, at $1,200 a pop! Guess who? Lowes!
If any interest in more about this, please see my comment #139...
They can't be Americans. Americans won't do those jobs according to the liberal leaders.
To read many of the comments in many of the threads about "our kids today," you would think the issue is more about getting them to work in the first place!
Fortunately, my two kids both started working when they were teenagers, during the Summer, sometimes while in school too...
Although they were never really faced with the choice of working at the crack of dawn in the dirt in the fields as compared to the more comfortable air-conditioned stores of Safeway and Longs Drugs, my guess is that they would not be too inclined to fill out an application to pick lettuce. Not sure I can blame them...
Hey, but I'm sure that's just me and my family. Yours are no doubt different!
All duly noted, but I've had very good luck and/or little-to-no problems hiring thousands of Hispanics through my company and/or for personal help at home...
One of my favorite stories is when a few Hispanics who helped me move from one home to a new one scooped up handfuls of my wife's gold jewelry from the floor of the moving van and handed it to me as they continued to move the furniture. First one handful from one helper, then another handful from the next helper behind him, while not slowing down to continue to move the furniture.
On the other hand, I've got stories of a different sort, like the contractors I hired through Home Depot to help with our kitchen remodel (all caucasian). Licensed and bonded. That story ended in small claims court where I was awarded $8,000 in damages...
I am not Hispanic, but I was raised in a Spanish speaking household, so I am able to speak Spanish to Hispanics, and by doing so, I really don't need the lesson in who is Hispanic and who is not. I also don't need much lesson in who is trying to rip me off and who is not. Believe me when I tell you that just because someone wants to charge me some ridiculous amount for a job, it is not because they "run legitimate companies." Many contractors, in fact, take responsibility for the workers they use who are NOT necessarily certified, but you don't know this, because you are doing business with the GC.
I've got lots of stories like these over many years of being in business, also over the course of owning more than a few homes, and I am glad to say I have done plenty okay by abiding by the law, having appropriate insurance and applying judge of character as best I've been able, regardless where people may call home.
Legal aliens ain't the problem. Anybody who hires KNOWN illegal aliens NEEDS to be arrested and thrown in jail. Period.
You assume much and apparently can't add too well...
I won't bother defending myself against your accusations, but just what do you think I do to get ANYONE to come to the house to do work? Stop people walking by on the sidewalk? You think you are the only one who knows about Angie's List, the value in references?
I've got a great electrician that was an employee of an Electric Company not too far from here. He since left that company but still comes here to help with electrical issues when they arise. The guy is fantastic, honest, reasonable, and Hispanic. He has been one who has provided me names of others who have come to our home to do other kinds of work, because I trust his judgement. Other times, I use Google to pull up contractors, check their ratings and generally get about three bids before I decide who to work with.
Most recent story I have was a disaster involving a custom-order shower pan for our bathroom. We had to reject the damn thing two times before they got the third one right, at $1,200 a pop! Guess who? Lowes!
If any interest in more about this, please see my comment #139...
You're the one who wrote:
Quote:
I've been in the process of remodeling a home for a few years now, and it seems I cannot request a job done around here without someone of hispanic descent coming to offer me a quote. Plumbing, sheet rock work, electrical, roofing, gardening...
It still doesn't add up, but that's fine.
Thanks for pointing me to post 139, but after reading the following, I'm pretty much done.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe
One of my favorite stories is when a few Hispanics who helped me move from one home to a new one scooped up handfuls of my wife's gold jewelry from the floor of the moving van and handed it to me as they continued to move the furniture. First one handful from one helper, then another handful from the next helper behind him, while not slowing down to continue to move the furniture.
Yeah sure, Americans have never done construction, landscaping and host of other blue-collared jobs. I wonder how they got done before millions of cheap illegals flooded our border? Liberals will never answer that question though.
Maybe you're not listening!
The issue of immigrant labor is not necessarily that the work would not get done if not for their labor, though in some cases employers do need to tap immigrants to fill their labor needs. The issue has more to do with what employers and private American citizens have done to satisfy their labor needs. If/when an American employer or private citizen is willing to employ/pay an illegal immigrant who values that money over the fear of deportation, doesn't take a brain surgeon to figure out what's going to happen.
Hard to blame someone here to make that cash when they are essentially being invited with employment by Americans. Right? Who are they to judge otherwise (to their way of thinking) if Americans are more than glad to pay them for the work they are willing to do for them; to nanny their kids, clean their houses and motel rooms, wash the dishes, mop the floors and pull the weeds...
In any case, it isn't the immigrants, legal or illegal, who are setting the wages or making the rules. They're just doing what it seems Americans want them to do for little pay. Anyone who knows about the human hierarchy of needs, especially when it comes to food, shelter and family, has to know they would do hardly any different as a general rule if they were in a country where work and money was scarce, next to the richest country in the world.
Not to blame them is not to defend illegal immigration however!
Trumpster types just can't seem to get that...
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