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Old 08-29-2017, 01:10 PM
 
849 posts, read 364,240 times
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You want to stop all these illegal aliens from jumping the border? Building a wall isn't going to do a damn thing, just ask the Chinese how well it worked for them. The real way to stop illegals from coming over and "taking our jobs" is to punish the people that are hiring them. Make it to where every undocumented worker found in a person's employ is a 100k fine. Any cost savings they made by hiring them will be offset by the fines, so they will have no motivation to do so. And the illegals will stop coming over because nobody will hire them, as it's too big of a risk, so the demand for them will go down.

Can someone out there offer a cogent argument as to why my solution won't work? I'd really love to hear from these "Build a wall" idiots too and get their two cents on the matter.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Downtown Phoenix, AZ
15,832 posts, read 5,411,672 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy12345678 View Post
You want to stop all these illegal aliens from jumping the border? Building a wall isn't going to do a damn thing, just ask the Chinese how well it worked for them. The real way to stop illegals from coming over and "taking our jobs" is to punish the people that are hiring them. Make it to where every undocumented worker found in a person's employ is a 100k fine. Any cost savings they made by hiring them will be offset by the fines, so they will have no motivation to do so. And the illegals will stop coming over because nobody will hire them, as it's too big of a risk, so the demand for them will go down.

Can someone out there offer a cogent argument as to why my solution won't work? I'd really love to hear from these "Build a wall" idiots too and get their two cents on the matter.
Fines won't do anything, unless they were punitive enough that they would make the business insolvent.

I think prison time in general population in a medium security prison would be a better deterrent. I think the possibility of being assaulted and raped in prison is more of a deterrent than a monetary fine
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:36 PM
 
849 posts, read 364,240 times
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Originally Posted by FirebirdCamaro1220 View Post
Fines won't do anything, unless they were punitive enough that they would make the business insolvent.

I think prison time in general population in a medium security prison would be a better deterrent. I think the possibility of being assaulted and raped in prison is more of a deterrent than a monetary fine

Unless they are a multi-million/billion dollar company, I doubt if most places employing more than a couple illegals could withstand these fines and still stay afloat. Catching them in the act might be more difficult, but I think that the risk vs. reward scale would tip heavily in the other direction if heavy fines were put in place. Is it really worth saving a few bucks when there's the possibility of being fined hundreds of thousands of dollars if you are caught? I think most people would say "no". And the people that wouldn't are the type of people who would spend a dollar to save a dime, or step over a hundred dollar bill to pick up a penny.

Lots of people are so shortsighted that they can't see past a dollar amount. They want the cheapest whatever, even if spending a little more money would get them something of better quality. I'd rather buy something for $50 and have it last 5 years than spend $10 and have it crap out in 6 months, for example. Some people are too dumb to see this, tho.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:37 PM
 
Location: Clown School
9,999 posts, read 4,229,203 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirebirdCamaro1220 View Post
Fines won't do anything, unless they were punitive enough that they would make the business insolvent.

I think prison time in general population in a medium security prison would be a better deterrent. I think the possibility of being assaulted and raped in prison is more of a deterrent than a monetary fine
I don't think we can really call ourselves a civilized country if we're so far from eradicating these issues within the prison system that we freely wag them around as punishment.

I would go with the extremely heavy fines as well as sentencing them to several years of community service full-time.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:40 PM
 
Location: Clown School
9,999 posts, read 4,229,203 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy12345678 View Post
Unless they are a multi-million/billion dollar company, I doubt if most places employing more than a couple illegals could withstand these fines and still stay afloat. Catching them in the act might be more difficult, but I think that the risk vs. reward scale would tip heavily in the other direction if heavy fines were put in place. Is it really worth saving a few bucks when there's the possibility of being fined hundreds of thousands of dollars if you are caught? I think most people would say "no". And the people that wouldn't are the type of people who would spend a dollar to save a dime, or step over a hundred dollar bill to pick up a penny.
The fine should be double what an American would be paid for the job for 10 years or double the tenure of the illegal in question, whichever is more.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:44 PM
 
849 posts, read 364,240 times
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Originally Posted by ohhwanderlust View Post
I don't think we can really call ourselves a civilized country if we're so far from eradicating these issues within the prison system that we freely wag them around as punishment.
Agreed 100%. Why is prison rape accepted? Because they are in prison they deserve it? Doesn't matter whether you're a rapist, murder, child molester, or just someone who didn't pay their taxes or was caught with drugs. In some people's minds all prisoners are the same and deserve constant pain and punishment regardless of the severity of the crime. Some people have such blind respect for the law that they see anyone who breaks any law, regardless of how stupid/unnecessary it is, is a POS that deserves to rot in jail forever, fry em'. But that's a whole other discussion.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:44 PM
 
Location: Self explanatory
10,274 posts, read 4,129,292 times
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That's the hypocrisy of it all, if people weren't hiring illegals, they wouldn't be coming here, BUT, those folks LOVE cheap labor, hence hire illegals and then it's "they took our jerbs". It's cyclical, but of course it's all the illegals fault and not the ones doing the hiring.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,031 posts, read 20,528,200 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy12345678 View Post
You want to stop all these illegal aliens from jumping the border? Building a wall isn't going to do a damn thing, just ask the Chinese how well it worked for them. The real way to stop illegals from coming over and "taking our jobs" is to punish the people that are hiring them. Make it to where every undocumented worker found in a person's employ is a 100k fine. Any cost savings they made by hiring them will be offset by the fines, so they will have no motivation to do so. And the illegals will stop coming over because nobody will hire them, as it's too big of a risk, so the demand for them will go down.

Can someone out there offer a cogent argument as to why my solution won't work? I'd really love to hear from these "Build a wall" idiots too and get their two cents on the matter.
What makes you believe that the Great wall did not serve China in regulating trade and immigration as well as helping to protect its border against raids and invasions. It was not 100% long term protection against invading MILITARY attacks but it served to regulate immigration.
I agree we need to make it more difficult for employers, mandatory national e-verify and stiff fines.
The problem with relying only on fines is who is going to enforce this. Have you been aware that ICE was basically neutered and now they are regaining authority there is much resistance to ICE raids. I think we need a combination of making it difficult to get here in the first place then making it difficult to work here.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:47 PM
 
849 posts, read 364,240 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Town FFX View Post
That's the hypocrisy of it all, if people weren't hiring illegals, they wouldn't be coming here, BUT, those folks LOVE cheap labor, hence hire illegals and then it's "they took our jerbs". It's cyclical, but of course it's all the illegals fault and not the ones doing the hiring.
Yup, some people are willing to cut their own throat to save a nickel. Luckily some can see past a dollar amount and look at the long term consequences of their actions, others have their heads too far up their own asses.
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Old 08-29-2017, 01:49 PM
 
2,634 posts, read 1,031,741 times
Reputation: 3592
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmy12345678 View Post
You want to stop all these illegal aliens from jumping the border? Building a wall isn't going to do a damn thing, just ask the Chinese how well it worked for them. The real way to stop illegals from coming over and "taking our jobs" is to punish the people that are hiring them. Make it to where every undocumented worker found in a person's employ is a 100k fine. Any cost savings they made by hiring them will be offset by the fines, so they will have no motivation to do so. And the illegals will stop coming over because nobody will hire them, as it's too big of a risk, so the demand for them will go down.

Can someone out there offer a cogent argument as to why my solution won't work? I'd really love to hear from these "Build a wall" idiots too and get their two cents on the matter.
Some companies got enough cash to pay those penalties and maybe even write it off at tax time (depending on the tax loopholes). A law with teeth making it a felony and holding the CEO, Manager and Director of Human Resources and/or owner responsible, would make it work.
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