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Old 01-17-2018, 10:20 AM
 
62,457 posts, read 27,779,745 times
Reputation: 7876

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Just post a case where someone has been charged for "encouragement" for being an official in a "sanctuary city".
The charges are coming. A violation of Federal Law is a violation of Federal Law. No getting around it.

Quote:
Encouraging to crime (illegal immigration is actually a civil infraction)
Since when do civil infractions carry a 5-10 year prison term per violation, as the following crimes do?

Title 8, U.S.C. 1324, from the US Attorneys' Criminal Resource Manual:

Encouraging/Inducing -- Subsection 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv) makes it an offense for any person who -- encourages or induces an alien to come to, enter, or reside in the United States, knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such coming to, entry, or residence is or will be in violation of law.

Conspiracy/Aiding or Abetting -- Subsection 1324(a)(1)(A)(v) expressly makes it an offense to engage in a conspiracy to commit or aid or abet the commission of the foregoing offenses.

...With regard to violations of 8 U.S.C. 1324(a)(1)(ii)-(iv) and (v)(ii), domestic transportation, harboring, encouraging/inducing, or aiding/abetting, the basic statutory maximum term of imprisonment is 5 years, unless the offense was committed for commercial advantage or private financial gain, in which case the maximum term of imprisonment is 10 years.


https://www.justice.gov/usam/crimina...1324a-offenses
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:29 AM
 
3,460 posts, read 1,697,033 times
Reputation: 2201
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atalanta View Post
Yes, they do

Aiding and abetting is a legal doctrine related to the guilt of someone who aids or abets in the commission of a crime. It exists in a number of different countries and generally allows a court to pronounce someone guilty for aiding and abetting in a crime even if they are not the principal offender.
You don't know what aiding and abetting means. Nor do you realize that the status of being present in the United States without authorization is not a crime. One cannot aid or abet a civil offense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
It's not about enforcing. It's about encouraging/inducing when an authorized official declares their jurisdiction to be a "sanctuary" for illegal aliens:

Encouraging/Inducing -- Subsection 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv) makes it an offense for any person who -- encourages or induces an alien to come to, enter, or reside in the United States, knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such coming to, entry, or residence is or will be in violation of law.

Conspiracy/Aiding or Abetting -- Subsection 1324(a)(1)(A)(v) expressly makes it an offense to engage in a conspiracy to commit or aid or abet the commission of the foregoing offenses.

...With regard to violations of 8 U.S.C. 1324(a)(1)(ii)-(iv) and (v)(ii), domestic transportation, harboring, encouraging/inducing, or aiding/abetting, the basic statutory maximum term of imprisonment is 5 years, unless the offense was committed for commercial advantage or private financial gain, in which case the maximum term of imprisonment is 10 years.


https://www.justice.gov/usam/crimina...1324a-offenses

The prison term is 5-10 years PER each illegal alien. They can go to prison for life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Nope. Note that according to 8 U.S.C. 1324, all a local/city/state official has to do is declare their jurisdiction to be a "sanctuary" for illegal aliens, to be arrested and charged with encouraging/inducing. That violation of Federal Law carries a 5-10 year prison term PER illegal alien they've encouraged/induced.

https://www.justice.gov/usam/crimina...1324a-offenses
Did you flunk out of law school, or are you completely untrained and offering junk opinions with the aim of misleading?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale View Post
I like this. Number of agents should be N= 1/X^2 with X equal to the cooperation level rated from 1 low to 10 high.

Personally I would make sure to deport some high CA politicians illegal maid then prosecute for said same.
So for the least cooperative states, the number of agents should be 1? You might want to rethink your math.

Do you ask for work authorization papers from your local gas station attendant? Barrista? Taxi driver? Electrician? Plumber? Why would you demand a politician ask for the papers of a housekeeper?
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:29 AM
 
Location: la la land
27,205 posts, read 11,367,475 times
Reputation: 19285
Quote:
Originally Posted by bentlebee View Post
The federal agency will soon go to San Francisco to have a huge raid!
Maybe by announcing this some illegals will decide to go to LA or Beverly Hills!
Great job our President is doing and snow flakes and mental ill media....this is your President too!
Another day with a President who does as he says!

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfg...a-12502689.php
I hate to break up the party, but honestly 1500 is not "massive" given that there are 7.15 million people living in the SF Bay Area, and they fail to mention over what period of time this will occur (real typical for DHS hyperbole) I'm wondering what they will do with these people they arrest when local jails refuse to hold them...maybe they can rent a floor of Trump Tower to keep them in pending deportation hearings

By the way, if they have committed serious criminal offenses I'm all in favor of deporting them, as are most "liberals"
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:31 AM
 
Location: la la land
27,205 posts, read 11,367,475 times
Reputation: 19285
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
The charges are coming. A violation of Federal Law is a violation of Federal Law. No getting around it.

Since when do civil infractions carry a 5-10 year prison term per violation, as the following crimes do?

Title 8, U.S.C. 1324, from the US Attorneys' Criminal Resource Manual:

Encouraging/Inducing -- Subsection 1324(a)(1)(A)(iv) makes it an offense for any person who -- encourages or induces an alien to come to, enter, or reside in the United States, knowing or in reckless disregard of the fact that such coming to, entry, or residence is or will be in violation of law.

Conspiracy/Aiding or Abetting -- Subsection 1324(a)(1)(A)(v) expressly makes it an offense to engage in a conspiracy to commit or aid or abet the commission of the foregoing offenses.

...With regard to violations of 8 U.S.C. 1324(a)(1)(ii)-(iv) and (v)(ii), domestic transportation, harboring, encouraging/inducing, or aiding/abetting, the basic statutory maximum term of imprisonment is 5 years, unless the offense was committed for commercial advantage or private financial gain, in which case the maximum term of imprisonment is 10 years.


https://www.justice.gov/usam/crimina...1324a-offenses
You don't understand the laws that you are citing so please quit digging yourself a hole
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:36 AM
 
62,457 posts, read 27,779,745 times
Reputation: 7876
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCityTheBridge View Post
Did you flunk out of law school, or are you completely untrained and offering junk opinions with the aim of misleading?
Seems odd that you'd somehow believe that the US Attorneys' Criminal Resource Manual is misleading.
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:36 AM
 
21,456 posts, read 7,155,015 times
Reputation: 7530
Quote:
Originally Posted by bentlebee View Post
The federal agency will soon go to San Francisco to have a huge raid!

Maybe by announcing this some illegals will decide to go to LA or Beverly Hills!

Great job our President is doing and snow flakes and mental ill media....this is your President too!

Another day with a President who does as he says!

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sfg...a-12502689.php
This is a good idea by ICE. These Ca. cities and the state itself has drawn attention to itself and will be rewarded with more attention than they expected.
It should lead to a much needed conflict of ideas and law in public view. I support arresting state and city officials harboring, aiding and abetting illegals from any country.
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
6,418 posts, read 2,262,209 times
Reputation: 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Thanks for sharing your personal take on the matter. Local governments are NOT required to enforce federal laws. If that somehow translates to criminal encouragement, then so be it.
You do know that there is a difference between declining to enforce federal laws and actively attempting to prevent them from being enforced.....

Right?

Refusing to cooperate with federal enforcement is not the same as declining to enforce.

Some months ago, I watched a discussion on the matter featuring Charles Krauthammer.

He laid out a scenario where a Mayor or other "sanctuary" city or state officials could be charged with obstruction.

Feds issue a warrant for a specific criminal illegal alien who is known to be in a sanctuary city, if the local officials know his whereabouts and refuse to cooperate with feds on the execution of the warrant, then they can be arrested and charged with obstruction.
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,493 posts, read 31,880,770 times
Reputation: 9411
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
The charges are coming. A violation of Federal Law is a violation of Federal Law. No getting around it.
Nothing? That's what I thought. We'll see what the future brings.
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:52 AM
 
Location: Miami, FL
58,493 posts, read 31,880,770 times
Reputation: 9411
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatBob96 View Post
You do know that there is a difference between declining to enforce federal laws and actively attempting to prevent them from being enforced.....

Right?
Are they preventing Feds from working in the State? No, they are not. The Feds can do whatever they wish.
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Old 01-17-2018, 10:55 AM
 
1,591 posts, read 746,655 times
Reputation: 1401
My issue with rounding up illegals is that they only pick up POC. There are students and others from European countries who overstay are heir visas and no one bothers them. If you are going to do it, pick up all the rule breakers.

Illegal is illegal, so be consistent
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