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Old 01-24-2018, 11:16 AM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,125 posts, read 15,685,319 times
Reputation: 8800

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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantompilot View Post
Yep I agree with that, we bought a house back in 1999, and when it was being built, I went by the site every week to check up on the progress. I was surprised, but not shocked, to find the drywallers were illegals. And I'm sure some of the other subs were too - the contractor doesn't have a lot of options. They have to get the structure completed on a schedule - they take whoever is available. And that means you might have illegals working on your project. You're lucky if you can get a foreman that speaks fluent English sometimes.

I just had a fence built a few months ago. I'd put money on most of the crew being illegal. Foreman was questionable, too. Top dollar company too. No cost savings to the consumer from using illegal labor. All the fence companies price by the linear foot. You can divide them into three tiers of expense and quality. But you get illegals no matter which one you choose.
I'm not surprised that's the case today. California has been far to forgiving and willing to turn a blind eye to the problem.
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Old 01-24-2018, 11:37 AM
 
Location: California
4,445 posts, read 5,178,671 times
Reputation: 9180
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnywhereElse View Post
We are in our 60s and cut our own grass. My friend is 74 and cuts her 3 acres with a riding lawn mower! Of course, we aren't those "lazy Americans" that illegal alien sympathizers talk about, and since they are the ones needing their grass mowed, well, do the "math" on that one!

I don't want illegal aliens putting a roof on my house. I have seen them working and the results. When it comes to your roof, cutting corners will really cost you in the end.

But, I gather that US taxpayers should not complain about the $117 billion that illegal aliens cost us, because some people aren't willing to pay the cost of the services that they need and want us to subsidize them.
I wonder what the true cost of "low wages" are when the tax payer hand outs for housing, food, health care and clothing are factored in. But, some will only look at the very narrow view of only low wages instead of how much we spend to support the aliens. The pot growers bring the aliens in to protect the crop, pay them a low wage, and then they supplement their income by breaking into nearby homes for more tax free dollars.

Mexico has an interest in keeping them in the U.S. because the money they send back is supports many Mexicans and others in S. America which is why they are resisting the wall or enforcing our laws. With so many U.S. dollars leaving, what is the benefit to American tax payers to support them? L.A. and the Bay area have huge problems because of their lack of investment or contribution in our communities resulting in more tax payer expense. How many of them are actually in the housing market when they send their money out of the U.S., and have no vested interest in contributing to American society?
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Old 01-26-2018, 09:09 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,823 posts, read 30,091,418 times
Reputation: 17698
I trim my own trees and cut my own lawn. It's not even difficult. I sweat more in the gym.
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Old 01-28-2018, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Lewes, Delaware
3,464 posts, read 3,012,002 times
Reputation: 1870
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantompilot View Post
You think its baseless speculation to postulate that when people occupying housing leave, that demand will drop?

Um....okay.

See, this is kinda what I expected to see on this thread, but was secretly hoping I wouldn't.

Liberals that defy basic economic principles so their world-view doesn't crumble.



Unbelievable...you just called consumers supply, of demand. OMG. There is no such thing.

This seems about on par with what I expected as well. Inversion of reality in order to avoid the world-view crumbling.

Hint: consumers represent DEMAND.





Well if 10 million illegals can't fill the need for skilled labor, then no amount of them will. Clearly that population lacks the skills needed. The fact of the matter is most of these skilled positions in the trades are filled with Americans. Masonry, millwork, Plumbing, electrical...first of all, most of these require licensing or apprenticeship to even be hired on a commercial project (that's what this article was about - labor shortages in the Commercial Construction space)

So getting rid of the illegals isn't going to affect this aspect of skilled construction labor, because for the most part they are not doing this work even right now. Despite many of them having been in the country for decades.
Thatís more dependent on where you live, here in slower lower Delaware the housing market is cranking, illegals do most of the drywall, framing, siding, roofing, and just some of the plumbing. They actually make what I was making in the mid Ď90ís to frame houses, about 12.50-$13.00 an hour.

Considering the homes now cost twice as much, but the wages havenít increased significantly in over 20 years, itís really a shame. Itís not that American kids wonít do the work, they will, for just a summer or until they figure out itís a dead end industry.

Anyone can be a builder, no tests, no licensing, basically get a contractors license and youíre a builder. Plumbing and electrical take a minimum 5 years of schooling plus 12,000 hours of documented work just to sit for a Masters license test. So because sub contractors take such a beating doing new construction down here ( Plumbing and electrical contractors are lucky to make $500 bucks a home) they hire at really low wages and the cycle continues.

So instead of everyone benefitting from the building of numerous homes, itís really just the builder, if the majority of the illegals were deported, wages in this industry would rise and that benefits everyone.
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Old 01-29-2018, 08:32 AM
 
Location: North Texas
23,618 posts, read 31,198,912 times
Reputation: 26690
Quote:
Originally Posted by James420 View Post
Thatís more dependent on where you live, here in slower lower Delaware the housing market is cranking, illegals do most of the drywall, framing, siding, roofing, and just some of the plumbing. They actually make what I was making in the mid Ď90ís to frame houses, about 12.50-$13.00 an hour.

Considering the homes now cost twice as much, but the wages havenít increased significantly in over 20 years, itís really a shame. Itís not that American kids wonít do the work, they will, for just a summer or until they figure out itís a dead end industry.

Anyone can be a builder, no tests, no licensing, basically get a contractors license and youíre a builder. Plumbing and electrical take a minimum 5 years of schooling plus 12,000 hours of documented work just to sit for a Masters license test. So because sub contractors take such a beating doing new construction down here ( Plumbing and electrical contractors are lucky to make $500 bucks a home) they hire at really low wages and the cycle continues.

So instead of everyone benefitting from the building of numerous homes, itís really just the builder, if the majority of the illegals were deported, wages in this industry would rise and that benefits everyone.
Here in Texas you don't even need a license to be a contractor. You have to be licensed to be an electrician or a plumber, but we don't have licenses for people who do drywall, framing, etc.


Our construction industry is packed with low-skilled illegals who cut corners. It shows when you look at their finished work. So shoddy.
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Old 01-29-2018, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Northwest Peninsula
2,632 posts, read 1,358,433 times
Reputation: 1385
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantompilot View Post
A lot of people seem to be incapable of applying basic economic principles.

So, taking into consideration the illegal population, if those people were not present in the US, what would the effect of their absence be on:

1. Housing availability
2. Housing affordability
3. Housing mobility
4. Housing development

I want to see if any of these liberal posters can get any of these right.
It would free up housing for the homeless. Free card board box for all!!!
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Old 01-29-2018, 01:56 PM
 
Location: Kansas
19,189 posts, read 14,096,440 times
Reputation: 18141
Quote:
Originally Posted by rantiquity View Post
It would free up housing for the homeless. Free card board box for all!!!
Actually, it would allow our homeless citizens the opportunity to move into Section 8 subsidized public housing.
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Old 01-30-2018, 04:49 AM
 
Location: California
29,633 posts, read 31,957,040 times
Reputation: 24761
I've fantasize about this happening just to imagine how LA would change, but also CA in general.


BTW I do have a lawn guy I've employed for 20+ years who is a legal Asian immigrant. It's not as if there won't be immigrants anymore or that only immigrants will do this type of work. .
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Old 02-01-2018, 12:13 AM
 
5,238 posts, read 1,573,835 times
Reputation: 5031
Quote:
Originally Posted by James420 View Post
That’s more dependent on where you live, here in slower lower Delaware the housing market is cranking, illegals do most of the drywall, framing, siding, roofing, and just some of the plumbing. They actually make what I was making in the mid ‘90’s to frame houses, about 12.50-$13.00 an hour.

Considering the homes now cost twice as much, but the wages haven’t increased significantly in over 20 years, it’s really a shame. It’s not that American kids won’t do the work, they will, for just a summer or until they figure out it’s a dead end industry.

Anyone can be a builder, no tests, no licensing, basically get a contractors license and you’re a builder. Plumbing and electrical take a minimum 5 years of schooling plus 12,000 hours of documented work just to sit for a Masters license test. So because sub contractors take such a beating doing new construction down here ( Plumbing and electrical contractors are lucky to make $500 bucks a home) they hire at really low wages and the cycle continues.

So instead of everyone benefitting from the building of numerous homes, it’s really just the builder, if the majority of the illegals were deported, wages in this industry would rise and that benefits everyone.
Yep, btw here in CA illegals can make $20/hour just doing lawn services. Mostly a low skill thing.
Painting - a bit more skill but less physical than lawn service - maybe $25. Union painters get $57/hour as journeymen.
Electrical and plumbing pay very well here. I can't get a plumber out for less than $100/hour. Same with electrician.

Also here you need licenses for all contractor activities. Doesn't matter if you're pouring a slab, framing, roofing, drywall, painting...if its over $500 you need a contractors license, and you have to show 2+ years of employment in the field, take the test, get a business license, get bonded/insured, and pay workmens comp.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceece View Post
I've fantasize about this happening just to imagine how LA would change, but also CA in general.


BTW I do have a lawn guy I've employed for 20+ years who is a legal Asian immigrant. It's not as if there won't be immigrants anymore or that only immigrants will do this type of work. .
I use a lawn guy too...I take the don't ask don't tell policy with him. He doesn't seem like an illegal but its hard to tell these days. He doesn't fly a Mexican flag on his truck or anything. I have never seen any white gardeners in this area, except the city workers (who are a bunch of lazy sh tbums) so I have no idea how much more one might charge. IF I ever see one I"ll ask.
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Old 02-01-2018, 12:40 AM
 
Location: Not in Quebec
244 posts, read 92,152 times
Reputation: 371
A big problem in some cities right now isn't illegals, but wealthy foreigners from countries like Russia, Saudi Arabia, and China who buy up homes or multiple buildings to basically 'store' their wealth outside their own country in case something goes awry. Just look at what happened in Vancouver, BC, you have small, run-down bungalows going for a million bucks because foreign investors flooded the market.

Lots of people are either unaware of this, or just think it's great because it brings more wealth into this country, but the end result are vacant homes that an American family COULD have lived in, and a unaffordable market for American buyers because the wealthy foreigners pay huge sums up-front.

The most recent occurrence of this has been in Seattle. Vancouver, BC finally started laying taxes on foreign investors and they all suddenly shifted their sights south into Seattle. House prices skyrocketed in a small frame of time. This is a very REAL issue, but it's not going to receive any attention and will likely be only dealt with by a few aware governors on the state level.

Illegals are nigh-irrelevant to the unaffordability of homes. Stop the wealthy foreigners from gobbling up our houses in our cities.
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