Do you think illegal aliens should be denied health care? (ethics, Mexicans)

[Prinny]

Originally Posted by andreabeth

This site has alot of information about the EMTALA. It does not specifically address the issue of illegal aliens but gives a basic explanation of the law. It then becomes easier to see how illegal aliens use EMTALA to their advantage, similar to the way they abuse the 14th Amendment.

FAQ on EMTALA

I am so sorry to hear about your illness. A chronic illness like Alzheimer's is especially difficult for you and your family. I am so glad you are near a hospital with good neurologic care. US News ranked St. Joseph's 10th in the entire country for neurology and neurosurgery! You can't get much better than that.
So many people have been affected by this disease, we both know our country needs to be doing everything we can to find a cure. Alot of research is going on and I hope we do not have to wait too much longer until we find the 'magic bullet' to stop it.

St. Joseph's Hospital and Medical Center, Phoenix - Best Hospitals - US News and World Report

I just love my neuro! He is just fabulous! I did get blindsided when I was diagnosed at 44. It was very much the last thing we expected. Started w/ forgetting phone numbers like my own. Getting confused where I put things and falling down stuff like that. My internist referred me and I got a top Dr. for Phx. and within a month I was diagnosed. He tested me for absolutely every single disease under the sun. He ended up diagnosing me w/ a few other things in the process but this one was the kicker. I just do my best to keep my brain as alive as possible and learn as much as I can. You folks are very much a support!

St. Josephs' is a beautiful hospital. Not just astetically but the people who work there too! Seem to really take pride in their work and care they give their patients. I've been to my share of Er's and must say it really is a good place.

[wesside]

I love how 36% of voters said "no healthcare under any circumstance."
Great representation of how far our society has been flushed down the Mod Cut when the almighty dollar is more important than a human life all because that person is "an illegal alien." Threads like these are very depressing to see.

Bravo to you though. Maybe one day, when you're old and gray, laying on your deathbed, you might reflect on your personal treatment of your fellow human and realize that life isnt all about money. That the extra few dollars you may have saved in taxes is not going to get you any closer to heaven.

And when your dead, standing in front of your maker you may be asked how you have treated your fellow human being. You may be able to snag some points by saying how you worked for the American Cross for three months.
But unfortunately for you, your maker will be able to look through the Mod Cut in your eyes and see that you would much rather have a human being lying dead in the gutter with his head cracked open, than to provide him with any type of healthcare that would save his life as well as his family's well being.

Congratulations to you. Another American without a heart.

[ArizonaBear]

Originally Posted by wesside

I love how 36% of voters said "no healthcare under any circumstance."
Great representation of how far our society has been flushed down the Mod Cut when the almighty dollar is more important than a human life all because that person is "an illegal alien." Threads like these are very depressing to see.

Bravo to you though. Maybe one day, when you're old and gray, laying on your deathbed, you might reflect on your personal treatment of your fellow human and realize that life isnt all about money. That the extra few dollars you may have saved in taxes is not going to get you any closer to heaven.

And when your dead, standing in front of your maker you may be asked how you have treated your fellow human being. You may be able to snag some points by saying how you worked for the American Cross for three months.
But unfortunately for you, your maker will be able to look through the Mod Cut in your eyes and see that you would much rather have a human being lying dead in the gutter with his head cracked open, than to provide him with any type of healthcare that would save his life as well as his family's well being.

Congratulations to you. Another American without a heart.

Quit twisting the truth there; wesside, most of us here have no issue in offering emergency care till the patient is stabilized prior to deportation (if here illegally). We are referring to 'elective' medical procedures that us Americans wind up footing the bill for.

[The Dissenter]

Originally Posted by wesside

I love how 36% of voters said "no healthcare under any circumstance."
Great representation of how far our society has been flushed down the Mod Cut when the almighty dollar is more important than a human life all because that person is "an illegal alien." Threads like these are very depressing to see.

Bravo to you though. Maybe one day, when you're old and gray, laying on your deathbed, you might reflect on your personal treatment of your fellow human and realize that life isnt all about money. That the extra few dollars you may have saved in taxes is not going to get you any closer to heaven.

And when your dead, standing in front of your maker you may be asked how you have treated your fellow human being. You may be able to snag some points by saying how you worked for the American Cross for three months.
But unfortunately for you, your maker will be able to look through the Mod Cut in your eyes and see that you would much rather have a human being lying dead in the gutter with his head cracked open, than to provide him with any type of healthcare that would save his life as well as his family's well being.

Congratulations to you. Another American without a heart.

I think everybody (no respect to legal status) that comes in with 7 gunshot wounds or in labor should be given care. I'm sure even the staunchest anti-illegal would agree with me.

The healthcare we're more focusing on denying illegals is the care for non life-threatening conditions. We may be mostly hardline anti-illegal but i can safely say no one on this forum wants to see an illegal alien die b/c a US ER denied them care when they had gunshots or massive bleeding b/c of their status.

[wesside]

Originally Posted by ArizonaBear

Quit twisting the truth there; wesside, most of us here have no issue in offering emergency care till the patient is stabilized prior to deportation (if here illegally). We are referring to 'elective' medical procedures that us Americans wind up footing the bill for.

Originally Posted by Alanboy395

The healthcare we're more focusing on denying illegals is the care for non life-threatening conditions. We may be mostly hardline anti-illegal but i can safely say no one on this forum wants to see an illegal alien die b/c a US ER denied them care when they had gunshots or massive bleeding b/c of their status.

What twisting is going on? Please elaborate on this. I would like to know!
The poll gave, amongst other options, 1)No healthcare under any circumstances, and 2) No healthcare, unless its an emergency.
Pretty much spelled out. About 36% said, "No healthcare under any circumstances."
Those 36% are the people that I was talking about. And everything I said is true. Those people would much rather see an illegal dying in the gutter than to give em healthcare because they are so set in their "ways."
And this is not an incorrect inferrential leap. Because if a person is given the choice to chose, "Healthcare only in emergencies" and "Not under any circumstances," they are saying that under no circumstances should an illegal be given healthcare. Unfortunately, it didnt surprise me at all that 36% of all chose the later option.

I can understand people that say "healthcare only in emergencies." I was not talking about those people.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by wesside

What twisting is going on? Please elaborate on this. I would like to know!
The poll gave, amongst other options, 1)No healthcare under any circumstances, and 2) No healthcare, unless its an emergency.
Pretty much spelled out. About 36% said, "No healthcare under any circumstances."
Those 36% are the people that I was talking about. And everything I said is true. Those people would much rather see an illegal dying in the gutter than to give em healthcare because they are so set in their "ways."
And this is not an incorrect inferrential leap. Because if a person is given the choice to chose, "Healthcare only in emergencies" and "Not under any circumstances," they are saying that under no circumstances should an illegal be given healthcare. Unfortunately, it didnt surprise me at all that 36% of all chose the later option.

I can understand people that say "healthcare only in emergencies." I was not talking about those people.

The only option I'm really for wasn't listed --- illegals should be given any health care they themselves pay for or they have the option of going home.

No American taxpayer should have to pay a dime to entice foreigners to come here and access our hospitals free of charge. If an illegal wishes to see a doctor however and will pay for it -- fine with me.

Illegals should not be allowed to drive without licenses and insurance and so should not expect a free ride if involved in accidents. They should not be coming here to give birth to produce anchor babies, and so should have no free maternity and pediatric care.

Immigration in the past was not a guarantee. One thing people forget is when the immigrants from Europe arrived, there were no big handout programs, they did not come here expecting free medical care. If they couldn't make it in this country on their own, they headed back to Europe. Many immigrants in the past did return home, often within months.

If an illegal must be given medical emergency care, Mexico or whatever other country should be expected to pay for it.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by Alanboy395

I think everybody (no respect to legal status) that comes in with 7 gunshot wounds or in labor should be given care. I'm sure even the staunchest anti-illegal would agree with me.

The healthcare we're more focusing on denying illegals is the care for non life-threatening conditions. We may be mostly hardline anti-illegal but i can safely say no one on this forum wants to see an illegal alien die b/c a US ER denied them care when they had gunshots or massive bleeding b/c of their status.

Give them the care but with the bill. Americans without insurance are often having to take out 2nd mortgages, be in debt the rest of their lives etc for it. There is no reason for illegals to get off scot-free.

They should suffer the same damage to their credit and have the same kind of debt problems as Americans face.

[wesside]

Originally Posted by malamute

The only option I'm really for wasn't listed --- illegals should be given any health care they themselves pay for or they have the option of going home.
If an illegal must be given medical emergency care, Mexico or whatever other country should be expected to pay for it.

But the pressing issue is....
1) whether they should be given healthcare in emergencies only, or
2) no healthcare under any circumstances

My stance was stated and I stand by it.
You seem to be under the stance that they shouldnt be given healthcare, even in life or death emergencies, unless they can pay for it. If so I hope your stance stands for legal Americans, as well, who simply cannot afford emergency healthcare.
If not then you really fall as what Ive described as heartless Americans who cant see people for being fellow human beings but rather based on their legal status.

[Kele]

Originally Posted by wesside

But the pressing issue is....
1) whether they should be given healthcare in emergencies only, or
2) no healthcare under any circumstances

My stance was stated and I stand by it.
You seem to be under the stance that they shouldnt be given healthcare, even in life or death emergencies, unless they can pay for it. If so I hope your stance stands for legal Americans, as well, who simply cannot afford emergency healthcare.
If not then you really fall as what Ive described as heartless Americans who cant see people for being fellow human beings but rather based on their legal status.

It seems to me that Malmute was simply stating that the country of origin, rather than the American taxpayer, should be the one responsible for the medical bills that illegal aliens more often than not, do not pay.

As an American citizen who had to hospitalize my then two year old son at a time in my life when I had two jobs, no child support, and no insurance (and nothing to spare) I can assure you that American hospitals are extremely proficient at squeezing blood out of an American turnip.

Illegal aliens walk away from their hospital bills while taxpaying Americans who have fallen on hard times (as I had) are hounded to the ends of the earth for whatever minute amounts of doss we can manage to divert from the grocery and rent budget to pay off the hospital bill, no matter how long it takes. There are no advocates screaming leniency for us, only debt collectors promising to ruin our credit and attach whatever meager resources we may have well into our grandchildren's generation if we don't pay up.

I for one, am furious that at a time in my life where I hovered one paycheck away from homelessness at all times, there was no one fighting to ensure that my sick son received treatment for his illness regardless of my ability to pay.

Oh wait, that's a right reserved only for those in this country in flagrant and blatant violation of sovereign law.

Silly me.

[macmeal]

Originally Posted by Kele

It seems to me that Malmute was simply stating that the country of origin, rather than the American taxpayer, should be the one responsible for the medical bills that illegal aliens more often than not, do not pay.

As an American citizen who had to hospitalize my then two year old son at a time in my life when I had two jobs, no child support, and no insurance (and nothing to spare) I can assure you that American hospitals are extremely proficient at squeezing blood out of an American turnip.

Illegal aliens walk away from their hospital bills while taxpaying Americans who have fallen on hard times (as I had) are hounded to the ends of the earth for whatever minute amounts of doss we can manage to divert from the grocery and rent budget to pay off the hospital bill, no matter how long it takes. There are no advocates screaming leniency for us, only debt collectors promising to ruin our credit and attach whatever meager resources we may have well into our grandchildren's generation if we don't pay up.

I for one, am furious that at a time in my life where I hovered one paycheck away from homelessness at all times, there was no one fighting to ensure that my sick son received treatment for his illness regardless of my ability to pay.

Oh wait, that's a right reserved only for those in this country in flagrant and blatant violation of sovereign law.

Silly me.

True. I've had disputed medical bills 5 or 6 years old, some of which have been settled LONG ago, and still get nasty phone calls regarding same. Also had PLENTY of bills charged to me, for which my insurance has paid, but the doctor's staff "lost the records"....Those "medical people" just don't give up.... "Blood from a turnip"..indeed.