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Old 01-03-2007, 02:45 AM
 
597 posts, read 1,786,042 times
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Okay, this is such a hot issue that really brings up a lot of passionate opinions on both sides, for and against illegals being in this country. What I seem to be reading from a lot of the pro-illegal crowd is the argument that illegals are 'enriching our culture' with their language and customs, and many seem to argue that anyone who feels that illegal immigration is bad, that you are a bigot against Latinos (whom the largest percentage of illegal immigrants are).

Let us imagine a comparable situation. Twelve million Americans, to escape poverty and find work during the Great Depression, migrate from the Dust Bowl down to Mexico. Settled there, they demand that Mexico provide them cash payments, subsidize their food, provide them free medical care, educate their children in English, teach them U.S. history, and start celebrating U.S. holidays. Suppose the Americans then began to commit crimes of assault, rape, and murder at 3 to 4 times the rate of the Mexican people and that the American young started joining criminal gangs at 19 times the rate of Mexican children. Suppose then, that 10,000 Americans joined in the burning and looting of the second largest city in Mexico and millions marched under the Stars and Stripes to demand all the rights and priveleges of Mexican citizens... How do you think Mexico would react???

Now, this is not to say that all illegal immigrants are bad people. Many are only searching for a better life for their families and Americans respect and pity them for it. But, we cannot absorb this constant flow of uneducated and unskilled peoples for much longer. The scenario spelled out is the reality in America if you open your eyes and look at the facts. This is what is frustrating average Americans. This is what politicians are blatantly ignoring to the detriment of the people. Amazing, isn't it?
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Old 01-03-2007, 11:00 AM
 
Location: 78218
1,151 posts, read 3,060,856 times
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Maybe history is repeating itself, as it eventually will, and the coming decline and fall of the US Empire is starting to unfold giving way to a new one: China.

Last edited by PrettyHateMachine; 01-03-2007 at 11:10 AM.. Reason: sp
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Old 01-03-2007, 11:26 AM
 
Location: Maine
15,080 posts, read 19,718,275 times
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The thing is: This would be so easy to fix.

Why are illegal aliens coming to this country? Yes, I know that some are criminals coming to commit crime, but that is an extreme minority. Probably way less than 1%. Most are coming to find work. Why? Because businesses will hire them.

Go after the businesses. Start fining them. Start throwing some CEOs in jail.

Do that, and the "flood" of illegal aliens will slow to a trickle, because businesses will stop hiring them. A trickle we can control. A flood? Well, you might as well try to stop the tide from coming in.
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Old 01-03-2007, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Near Charlotte, NC
405 posts, read 1,130,360 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark S. View Post
Go after the businesses. Start fining them. Start throwing some CEOs in jail.
Can we vote on this? If so, you have my vote.

It would also be helpful if the Border Patrol was as large as it needs to be to secure our borders, and if we started putting the illegal immigrants in jail.
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Old 01-03-2007, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Central Kentucky
850 posts, read 2,848,267 times
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You are so on target with your thinking. When you get down to the facts of the matter - no other country would tolerate what America has.

I am not a bigot, racist or anything else a person could be labeled. My arguement, however, is this - if you want to come to this country - do it legally. Work for it the way my great-grandparents did, and the way others have who were not born here. Study, take the test, become a citizen. Why is that so much to ask?

If you come to the hills of Eastern Kentucky, you will find poverty beyond belief. Actually, the farther into the country you go in any KY region will lead to poverty unlimited - as will a trip into any major city on the 'bad' side of town.

I ask - Why are Americans not jumping up and down about the 'poor Americans' born here, without food, shelter and health care? Why do we not seem to feel compassion for our own and take up a fight for them?

In a country where all are created equal - why are the scales continuing to be tipped in the direction of the big companies (and small ones, too) who continue to hire them and allow them to be here? I keep hearing the excuse "they do the jobs Americans won't do". - I think it has come to - "they do the jobs that Americans will not accept $2.00 per hour to do. That is more like it.

The politicians will not do anything about it because of the lobbyists and the corporations which keep them in office. If they began to enforce the laws already in place - they would lose the support of their 'pocket-books' and would not be back in office again. Even though we vote - it's the backers and money makers that put people in office. (something that still ticks me off about the electoral college - anyway - another story)....But...
We cannot take care of our own - how are we supposed to take care of illegals?
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Old 01-03-2007, 12:19 PM
 
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The illegal migrants, immigrants, etc, do not work for 2.00 an hour, they could not live here on that even living many people in a house. They send a lot of money home, its the third largest income in Mexico. The illegals here in Tampa are working on the roads making decent money, doing construction and of course picking strawberries and I think they average about a 100.00 a day. The problem is not finding citizens to do these jobs its because we have a 4 percent unemployment rate so there is no one left to do these jobs. Picking strawberries, citrus has always been done by migrant workers because its seasonal and finding citizens who are willing to travel all over the country picking fruit and vegetables is about impossible.
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Old 01-03-2007, 12:55 PM
 
Location: Colorado
10,017 posts, read 16,692,551 times
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The illegals in construction I know make about 5-7 an hour. How they live on that is 2-4 families per home and no taxes taken out.. They pool thier money together.
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Old 01-03-2007, 01:16 PM
 
Location: on an island
13,374 posts, read 40,153,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark S. View Post
The thing is: This would be so easy to fix.

Why are illegal aliens coming to this country? Yes, I know that some are criminals coming to commit crime, but that is an extreme minority. Probably way less than 1%. Most are coming to find work. Why? Because businesses will hire them.

Go after the businesses. Start fining them. Start throwing some CEOs in jail.
.
Exactly.
Enforcement operations have been scaled wa-ay back: The number of employers prosecuted for unlawfully employing immigrants dropped from 182 in 1999 to four in 2003, and fines collected declined from $3.6 million to $212,000, according to federal statistics.

In 1999, the United States initiated fines against 417 companies. In 2004, it issued fine notices to three.

The ICE did get 147 criminal convictions last year, including $15 million in settlements from WalMart (guess that's a drop in the bucket for them.)
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Old 01-03-2007, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Burlington, VT
483 posts, read 1,746,559 times
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Default Legal immigration isn't as easy as it used to be

if you want to come to this country - do it legally. Work for it the way my great-grandparents did, and the way others have who were not born here. Study, take the test, become a citizen. Why is that so much to ask?

Before the 1960s, it was extremely easy for anyone who wasn't Chinese (they were specifically banned in the 1890s, then limited to a quota of 106 per year until the 1930s) to immigrate to the US. As long as you were White, not a Communist, and didn't have smallpox, you were okay. Now, it's much harder to come here, and depends largely on your country of origin.

Here in Boston, the citizenship process is so unwieldly and slow that people have resorted to lawsuits to find out what the problem is. I work with a lot of immigrants, mostly Turks and Brazilians. Every other week, someone has to go meet with a lawyer to do something involving their immigration status. Did your great-grandparents need a lawyer to stay here?

Let us imagine a comparable situation. Twelve million Americans, to escape poverty and find work during the Great Depression, migrate from the Dust Bowl down to Mexico. . . .Suppose the Americans then began to commit crimes of assault, rape, and murder at 3 to 4 times the rate of the Mexican people and that the American young started joining criminal gangs at 19 times the rate of Mexican children.

Ever heard of the Irish Famine? Ever seen the movie "Gangs of New York?" Massive Irish immgration in the 1840s led to a lot of gangs and crime. Same thing with the Italians. Many people had the same attitude toward them that people have toward Mexicans now.

Suppose then, that 10,000 Americans joined in the burning and looting of the second largest city in Mexico

Do you mean the LA riots? The rioters were Black, not Mexican.

Before you ask, my ancestors weren't immigrants, they were imports. I have 2 sisters who are lawyers and a brother-in-law who works for ICE.
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Old 01-03-2007, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Colorado
10,017 posts, read 16,692,551 times
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My family was part of the Irish famine, according to the diaries, they were forced into the gang situation to survive, they were complete outcasts, rats in society, not worth a dime, given nothing and all they asked was to be treated right, most assimulated but still they had to fight for everything. Unlike the illegals of today, that sometimes recieve more than citizens do.
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