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Old 12-05-2007, 04:25 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,686,811 times
Reputation: 3010

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProLogic View Post
We shouldn't expect recent immigrants to assimilate quickly into mainstream American culture. Give it a generation or two.
My grandparents learned English before coming to America. My grandmother and grandfather became Americans the moment they landed on Ellis Island. My father and his four siblings were taught English by my grandparents. Norwegian, which my grandparents had spoken all of their lives, was never spoken in the home. My father and his siblings never learned more than a few Norwegian words.

My grandparents gave their total allegiance to this country and when called upon, sent their sons to fight in WW II and Korea. As my father fought in WW II, my grandmother worked eight hour shifts as a riveter on bombers after working ten hour days. Not because she wanted the money, but because she loved this country and wanted to contribute something back to the country that had given her so much.

Immigrants of my grandparent's generation assimilated within their own generation. It didn't take them one or two (or more) generations to become Americans. Why? Because they loved and respected this country long before they ever got here.

That is missing in people who enter this country illegally. They're just here to get what they can get, however they can get it--to h*ll with the country they're taking it from and to h*ll with the people whose tax dollars help them to survive.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:32 PM
 
Location: California
3,432 posts, read 2,156,404 times
Reputation: 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
My grandparents learned English before coming to America. My grandmother and grandfather became Americans the moment they landed on Ellis Island. My father and his four siblings were taught English by my grandparents. Norwegian, which my grandparents had spoken all of their lives, was never spoken in the home. My father and his siblings never learned more than a few Norwegian words.

My grandparents gave their total allegiance to this country and when called upon, sent their sons to fight in WW II and Korea. As my father fought in WW II, my grandmother worked eight hour shifts as a riveter on bombers after working ten hour days. Not because she wanted the money, but because she loved this country and wanted to contribute something back to the country that had given her so much.

Immigrants of my grandparent's generation assimilated within their own generation. It didn't take them one or two (or more) generations to become Americans. Why? Because they loved and respected this country long before they ever got here.

That is missing in people who enter this country illegally. They're just here to get what they can get, however they can get it--to h*ll with the country they're taking it from and to h*ll with the people whose tax dollars help them to survive.

You can't use your grandparents as model immigrants since those times have since changed. No immigrants I know have 100% assimilated into mainstream American culture.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:40 PM
 
Location: Miami (for now)
68 posts, read 53,910 times
Reputation: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
My grandparents learned English before coming to America. My grandmother and grandfather became Americans the moment they landed on Ellis Island. My father and his four siblings were taught English by my grandparents. Norwegian, which my grandparents had spoken all of their lives, was never spoken in the home. My father and his siblings never learned more than a few Norwegian words.

My grandparents gave their total allegiance to this country and when called upon, sent their sons to fight in WW II and Korea. As my father fought in WW II, my grandmother worked eight hour shifts as a riveter on bombers after working ten hour days. Not because she wanted the money, but because she loved this country and wanted to contribute something back to the country that had given her so much.

Immigrants of my grandparent's generation assimilated within their own generation. It didn't take them one or two (or more) generations to become Americans. Why? Because they loved and respected this country long before they ever got here.

That is missing in people who enter this country illegally. They're just here to get what they can get, however they can get it--to h*ll with the country they're taking it from and to h*ll with the people whose tax dollars help them to survive.
Many immigrants these days (legal or illegal) have no interest in actually assimilating at all. I live in Miami and this city doesn't even feel like part of the United States (probably hasn't for some time). Do you think that's right? I don't! I am tired of driving around seeing Spanish this, hearing Spanish music blaring out from everywhere and dealing with people who basically discriminate against me because I am a non-Spanish speaking American, or a "gringo".

My point is that they (mostly Cubans) expect us now to adapt to their culture. Most jobs here require you to be bilingual, which is wrong. As a gringo, you'll probably feel unwelcome here, just like I do, hence the fact that many Americans have long since left Miami as it has become "Havami".

I don't have a problem with skilled immigrants coming to this country to actually contribute and bring much needed skills to the table, but all the immigrants in Miami seem to have brought with them is corruption, cheap labor and the "third world" way of doing things. I do have a problem with immigrants hopping on a raft and coming here, just to use and abuse the system because they can claim asylum and get what is essentially a free ride and preference over other immigrants and even American citizens.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:44 PM
 
Location: California
3,432 posts, read 2,156,404 times
Reputation: 138
A lot of immigrants take jobs that pay very little. They have to work long hours to make enough money to provide for their family. Most of the jobs they take up are usually worked by immigrants as well. For example, Mexican immigrants work with other Mexicans and just find it easier to use Spanish. Therefore never really have a chance to learn English. Its not that they don't want to assimilate, they don't really have the time to learn English.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:48 PM
 
Location: Miami (for now)
68 posts, read 53,910 times
Reputation: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProLogic View Post
A lot of immigrants take jobs that pay very little. They have to work long hours to make enough money to provide for their family. Most of the jobs they take up are usually worked by immigrants as well. For example, Mexican immigrants work with other Mexicans and just find it easier to use Spanish. Therefore never really have a chance to learn English. Its not that they don't want to assimilate, they don't really have the time to learn English.
This is a big problem in itself. Illegals are working these jobs for far less pay than any self respecting American would work for, so the flipside is that it's lowering pay for working class Americans, or meaning that companies are breaking the law by paying illegals under the table.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:52 PM
 
Location: California
3,432 posts, read 2,156,404 times
Reputation: 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronaldo1 View Post
This is a big problem in itself. Illegals are working these jobs for far less pay than any self respecting American would work for, so the flipside is that it's lowering pay for working class Americans, or meaning that companies are breaking the law by paying illegals under the table.

So if you owned a McDonalds, you would pay a McDonalds cash register $20/hr? Thats the only reason these jobs pay so little. You don't need a lot of skill to do these jobs!
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Old 12-05-2007, 05:08 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,686,811 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProLogic View Post
You can't use your grandparents as model immigrants since those times have since changed. No immigrants I know have 100% assimilated into mainstream American culture.
The only thing that has changed is people's desire to become a part of this country. Assimilation has not become any more difficult since my grandparent's day and indeed--with the advent of the internet and language programs such as "The Rosetta Stone" it has become much easier.

Are you trying to tell me that today's immigrants are much more ignorant than the immigrants of my grandparent's time?
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Old 12-05-2007, 05:10 PM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,686,811 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProLogic View Post
So if you owned a McDonalds, you would pay a McDonalds cash register $20/hr? Thats the only reason these jobs pay so little. You don't need a lot of skill to do these jobs!
Less than 38% of Americans in this country have college degrees. What are those with a high school degree or less supposed to do for work if all of the lower skilled jobs are going to illegal aliens?
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Old 12-05-2007, 05:14 PM
 
Location: California
3,432 posts, read 2,156,404 times
Reputation: 138
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
Less than 38% of Americans in this country have college degrees. What are those with a high school degree or less supposed to do for work if all of the lower skilled jobs are going to illegal aliens?
Tell me why those jobs are going to illegals and tell me why they're un-employed. The unemployment rate has remained stagnant over the years.
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Old 12-05-2007, 05:34 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProLogic View Post
Tell me why those jobs are going to illegals and tell me why they're un-employed. The unemployment rate has remained stagnant over the years.
Agreed re: unemployment rate------just that wages have dropped for skilled tradesmen let alone common laborers.
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