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Old 05-23-2008, 08:19 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785

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Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
I'd like to thank everyone who responded.........but I am a little dismayed that the proponants of illegal immigration didn't deign to respond. Well, with the exception of a little race baiting, that is.

I have read post after post that illegals hurt noone, and if they did it is because they are forced into it by the racist US, and besides we owe it to them as they were here first but we daren't assume illegals equel Mexicans because that would be racist and inflammatory. The arguments for illegal immigration is as fluid as water, never addressing a specific issue, harder then hell to pin down.

In this case, I think that pro illegal crowd was unable to answer the question because their position is grounded in emotion, most specifically either white liberal guilt or an affinity with the illegals based on shared nationality (but I don't dare say Mexican).
The word 'desperation' comes to mind on the pro illegal immigrant side------they intuitively know they are losing the war of public opinion.

As for that 'race' crap-------again, another pitiful excuse for the pro amnesty scam.

There is no Hispanic race------most North American Latinos are actually American Indian (going by the hypo-descent rule) but will rarely admit to their indigenous side courtesy of the White supremacy of Hispanic culture. If anything: the word 'Indio' (Spanish for Indian) is a racial slur to a typical Latino.

The standard of beauty in both Mexico and Spain is white skin and blue eyes
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Old 05-23-2008, 08:22 AM
Status: "Make America the Great Joke Again" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Denver
9,059 posts, read 15,467,286 times
Reputation: 5288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkfarnam View Post
AMEN.........

Mach50...who's side are you on anywhy?
I am middle of the road, like I said I wish this would never would have happened, but it did and illegals aren't the only ones at fault here.
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Old 05-23-2008, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,200,288 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
I am middle of the road, like I said I wish this would never would have happened, but it did and
Quote:
illegals aren't the only ones at fault here.
I agree with you there. If all of the proper steps were taken and laws enforced, this was a preventable problem, but I don't think everyone here is blaming only the illegals. The blame is being spread to many other avenue's of this country, Governement, employers, OBL's and more.
But I don't think that all of the people (maybe some) should take blame because we're the one's that's are trying to get thing back on track.

Now it doesn't matter who's at blame, this problem has to be taken care of.
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Old 05-23-2008, 08:45 AM
Status: "Make America the Great Joke Again" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Denver
9,059 posts, read 15,467,286 times
Reputation: 5288
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkfarnam View Post
I agree with you there. If all of the proper steps were taken and laws enforced, this was a preventable problem, but I don't think everyone here is blaming only the illegals. The blame is being spread to many other avenue's of this country, Governement, employers, OBL's and more.
But I don't think that all of the people (maybe some) should take blame because we're the one's that's are trying to get thing back on track.

Now it doesn't matter who's at blame, this problem has to be taken care of.
Well I haven't heard of any employers or government official getting put in jail for allowing illegals in, but I have heard about detention centers and deportations. The blame and repercussions definitely seem to be aimed only at illegals to me.

The hate component of this illegal war is something I am fully against.
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Old 05-23-2008, 08:45 AM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
I am middle of the road, like I said I wish this would never would have happened, but it did and illegals aren't the only ones at fault here.
An interesting point to make. If you are "middle of the road", I guess that makes me "Three quarters on the road"....Your statement that "illegals aren't the only ones at fault here" is certainly true. The OTHER people who are at fault are just more 'sneaky' about it. They can be found in gated, waterfront or country club homes all over America. They can be found gathered like groupies at political fund-raisers. They hang out in Congress, and they fill the highest positions in Government AND in business. One of them even lives in the White House (and address he inherited from the PREVIOUS tenant, who was ALSO "one of them")

However, none of this is a defense of illegal immigrants....all this REALLY does is "spread the blame". Saying "I did the crime, but he TOLD me I could" really doesn't 'fly' in any court. As I've posted endlessly and repeatedly, illegal immigration is a phenomenon which started out as a mostly victimless crime, has now grown into huge proportions, and has become harmful to the American economy, and threatens to corrupt our system of law clear to the top. Like so many OTHER things, it once was "OK", but now it's not. Period. And those who participate in it are NOT 'blameless" just because they have company.

We often speak of 'racists' on this forum...OK, let's talk about them. They're awful, they're despicable, and this is a situation that's of great interest to them. But racists are everywhere, including on BOTH sides of this issue. Trying to hijack this into a 'racist' argument is dishonest, and I think we ALL really know that. You could send every racist in America out of the country for ten years...and ilegal immigration would STILL be a HUGE problem.

If anyone wants to start a forum on the OTHER enablers of illegal immigration, I'm sure we'd all have plenty to say. The dishonest employers, the lying and corrupt politicians, those who give conflicting orders to law enforcement, sleazy and weasely Mayors and Chiefs of Police....any or ALL of them. I'm sure we'd have opinions. However, THIS particular sub-forum is mainly about illegal immigrants....and while they may have 'company' in their wrongdoing, they are certainly not innocent.
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Old 05-23-2008, 08:48 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,200,288 times
Reputation: 4611
Just be careful that you guys don't get hit.
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Old 05-23-2008, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post
Well I haven't heard of any employers or government official getting put in jail for allowing illegals in, but I have heard about detention centers and deportations. The blame and repercussions definitely seem to be aimed only at illegals to me.

The hate component of this illegal war is something I am fully against.
Mach50:

Innocent (US citizens/green card holders) people who appear to be 'Mestizo' (of any race/ethnicity) getting caught in the cross fire does concern me----------greatly.

That stated: the true illegal mmigrants need to leave the USA post haste.
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Old 12-03-2008, 01:20 PM
 
1 posts, read 1,036 times
Reputation: 10
Default You're Looking at this All Wrong

Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
I'd like to thank everyone who responded.........but I am a little dismayed that the proponants of illegal immigration didn't deign to respond. Well, with the exception of a little race baiting, that is.

I have read post after post that illegals hurt noone, and if they did it is because they are forced into it by the racist US, and besides we owe it to them as they were here first but we daren't assume illegals equel Mexicans because that would be racist and inflammatory. The arguments for illegal immigration is as fluid as water, never addressing a specific issue, harder then hell to pin down.

In this case, I think that pro illegal crowd was unable to answer the question because their position is grounded in emotion, most specifically either white liberal guilt or an affinity with the illegals based on shared nationality (but I don't dare say Mexican).
I beg to differ! First of all, NOBODY is a proponent of illegal immigration - including immigrants themselves!

Think about it, why would an immigrant support Illegal immigration? The phrase itself is redundant...don't you think they would rather enter the country Legally and live and work here legally?

Obviously Illegal immigration is harmful to our country because with 12 million people living in this country illegally, using our services, committing crimes and not paying taxes, it harms the rest of us.

but you're looking at this all wrong: Immigrants themselves are not to blame for our illegal immigration problem - we don't have an Immigration problem: we have an ILLEGAL Immigration problem! the fact is that by our government making it so difficult for these people to gain a legal status - even just residency - in this country, our government is only hurting itself! We give these people no other choice than to enter illegally.

now I'm not saying we should have an open-border policy, that would just result in chaos and over-population! But we should allow people that are already doing so the opportunity to work legally and pay taxes in the United states, and for people who wish to enter to be able to apply for Residency and if they qualify and are in good standing and remain in Good Standing in the US for a number of years, could eventually gain Citizenship!

Think about it, if those 12 million people living here now were given the chance to apply for just Residency, they could start paying taxes and we could get everyone accounted for, the ones in Good Standing in this country who have not committed crimes could be granted Residency and start paying taxes, the rest could be denied, and deported!

If the country made it easier to apply for Residency and give people a chance to live and work here legally, I can guarantee there would not be so many illegals entering this country!
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Old 12-03-2008, 01:44 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by nycpink View Post
I beg to differ! First of all, NOBODY is a proponent of illegal immigration - including immigrants themselves!

Think about it, why would an immigrant support Illegal immigration? The phrase itself is redundant...don't you think they would rather enter the country Legally and live and work here legally?

Obviously Illegal immigration is harmful to our country because with 12 million people living in this country illegally, using our services, committing crimes and not paying taxes, it harms the rest of us.

but you're looking at this all wrong: Immigrants themselves are not to blame for our illegal immigration problem - we don't have an Immigration problem: we have an ILLEGAL Immigration problem! the fact is that by our government making it so difficult for these people to gain a legal status - even just residency - in this country, our government is only hurting itself! We give these people no other choice than to enter illegally.

now I'm not saying we should have an open-border policy, that would just result in chaos and over-population! But we should allow people that are already doing so the opportunity to work legally and pay taxes in the United states, and for people who wish to enter to be able to apply for Residency and if they qualify and are in good standing and remain in Good Standing in the US for a number of years, could eventually gain Citizenship!

Think about it, if those 12 million people living here now were given the chance to apply for just Residency, they could start paying taxes and we could get everyone accounted for, the ones in Good Standing in this country who have not committed crimes could be granted Residency and start paying taxes, the rest could be denied, and deported!

If the country made it easier to apply for Residency and give people a chance to live and work here legally, I can guarantee there would not be so many illegals entering this country!
We take in more legal immigrants per capita than any other nation in the world---------let some other countries up their quotas first.

Too with the imploding economy; it is high time for the illegal 'hired help' to return home and take their minor age Anchor Babies as well unless legal friend/relatives are willing to step up.
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Old 12-03-2008, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,594 posts, read 9,424,935 times
Reputation: 9198
Quote:
Originally Posted by nycpink View Post
now I'm not saying we should have an open-border policy, that would just result in chaos and over-population! But we should allow people that are already doing so the opportunity to work legally and pay taxes in the United states, and for people who wish to enter to be able to apply for Residency and if they qualify and are in good standing and remain in Good Standing in the US for a number of years, could eventually gain Citizenship!
When, and if, the U.S. economy strengthens to the point where it can absorb millions of foreign nationals and give equal access to opportunities to both resident and incoming citizens. In the present climate where even resident Americans face economic doom, to grant easy Citizenship to immigrants from any part of the world and to provide an easier path for them towards low and medium wage work in the U.S. at the expense of resident Americans is not a policy I could support.

H
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