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Old 05-27-2008, 10:32 AM
 
3,748 posts, read 7,216,574 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tinman01 View Post
Man you keep believing the lies. Many americans were forced out of their trades because illegals lo-balled the wages. I am one of the victims.
Many honest americans have had their lives ruined by ID theft so that your hard working honest illegals could serve up some donuts. The price tag is way to high. Bottom line is we owe illegals nothing but deportation papers.
Very true. My brother was a successful gardener in CA until illegal competition forced him to quit.
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Old 05-27-2008, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Cumberland Co., TN
20,015 posts, read 20,519,392 times
Reputation: 20379
Quote:
Here are two examples which I have seen in multiple places:
Key West and Plainville, NJ arent exactly small town, USA. Well not by my standard. I live in rural TN, pop. 2500, until the invasion. The only thing illegal immigration has down for this small sleepy town is increase property taxes, decreased property values, burdened the education, legal and healthcare system. Sure they are employed at Tyson, but those jobs were previously held by locals making a decent wage.
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Old 05-27-2008, 12:47 PM
Status: "Make America the Great Joke Again" (set 25 days ago)
 
Location: Denver
9,060 posts, read 15,472,876 times
Reputation: 5288
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2mares View Post
Key West and Plainville, NJ arent exactly small town, USA. Well not by my standard. I live in rural TN, pop. 2500, until the invasion. The only thing illegal immigration has down for this small sleepy town is increase property taxes, decreased property values, burdened the education, legal and healthcare system. Sure they are employed at Tyson, but those jobs were previously held by locals making a decent wage.
In a small town like the one you describe is there not public outcry against Tyson Foods for hiring illegals or did everyone just leave town? I mean Tyson must not have replaced all of the American workforce overnight, so workers must have seen this coming and could blow the whistle on them.

I am just interested because some people in Iowa really made an effort to show that illegals were not hurting them, as I posted originally.

I would also imagine Tyson will never be served a citation for hiring illegals, this is a major problem.
Cut off the $ and illegals will go home. No need for hate speech, no need for boycotts of Mexican trucks and products, just cut off the Employment and they go, it is that easy IMO.
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Old 05-27-2008, 01:40 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,617,384 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
Mr. Mecha?!? I am not Mexican-American and grew up with so few Mexicans and Mexican-Americans that I can literally count them on my two hands. The sympathy I express is for Mexican immigrants and not for Mexican-Americans who believe in racist ideologies like "la raza" and "la reconquista." I see a huge difference between your average Mexican immigrant and an extremist from Mecha, and I give my compassion only to the former. I am 0% Native American; in fact, all of my ancestors are from Europe. I am European-American / Euro-Latin and am from Miami, which is nowhere near Mexico and that, surprisingly, has very few mestizo Hispanics. I don't have an inkling of "brown pride" in my body because I cannot relate to it, so it's not like I come to this forum with a hidden agenda when I speak about these issues.
My hypothetical response wasn't to you..it was to the hypothetical MEChA member in my scenario. Much of your post, intended or not, did seem, IMHO, to fit that bizarre mindset.

Unlike your situation, in my case, I do have deep ties with the "raza", if you want to call it that. My wife is a native California Indian, whose grandparents spoke Spanish in the home. In many ways, our extended family could be said to be the same "ethnicity" as the majority of today's illegals. This relatively small segment of today's society is the TRUE group, which MEChA has tried to "hijack", who can honestly say "we didn't cross the border..the border crosses US". The shame is that now, this 'fact of life' is being trumpeted as 'truth' by anyone who 'feels like it'....even recent illrgal arrivals. This is, of course, in nothing more than a 'cheap trick'. It's an insult to those Americans whose ancestors really WERE 'here first'...AND it's an insult to that considerable number of Mexicans, and OTHER groups, who 'played by the rules' and came here LEGALLY. Illegals 'cheapen' the true meaning of immigration and citizenship.

Yet I can assure you that the current "nuttiness" doesn't go back very far. I've known illegals for decades, but this situation is new. And it taints and reflects on everyone...legal Hispanic-Americans, etc. The current illegal-immigration "mess" causes much consternation, way beyond the actual illegals themselves...

The expression you used, "your average Mexican immigrant", isn't clear. If you're restricting this to legal Mexican immigrants, I agree. If you're trying to include all Mexican illegals in the description "your average Mexican immgrant", then I can't agree. The idea that Mexicans have some sort of right to come here illegally, while all other immigrants are expected to 'wait in line' isn't fair or unbiased at ALL...in fact, it's the very essence of MEChA's philosophy. MEChA has no interest in ANY immigrant, legal or illegal, except Mexicans. If that describes YOUR position, then I'm afraid we disagree. If NOT, then why continue to defend illegals? It's one thing to advocate they be treated HUMANELY..but that's a long way from trying to 'justify' their position.

Last edited by macmeal; 05-27-2008 at 01:59 PM..
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Old 05-27-2008, 02:39 PM
 
3,368 posts, read 10,276,533 times
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Macmeal, I believe that Mexicans have no more of a right than anyone else to be in the United States illegally. As for as I'm concerned, a Mexican is "entitled" to be here illegally just as little as a Kenyan or a Korean. I think the historical "We didn't cross the border; the border crossed us!" argument is very poorly supported and thus I believe that Mexican immigrants, regardless of indigenous American descent, have no better claim to the Southwest US than "Anglos," Africans, or Asians. I dislike the ideas of Mecha and would never say that Mexicans or Mexican-Americans have a superior claim to the Southwest. If I appear to come across as sympathetic to Hispanics or Mexicans in my posts it is because these groups share this country's western (Christian) values and thus should at least be treated the same as other immigrant groups. My sympathy has nothing to do with some BS claim to American soil.
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Old 05-27-2008, 05:22 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,617,384 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
Macmeal, I believe that Mexicans have no more of a right than anyone else to be in the United States illegally. As for as I'm concerned, a Mexican is "entitled" to be here illegally just as little as a Kenyan or a Korean. I think the historical "We didn't cross the border; the border crossed us!" argument is very poorly supported and thus I believe that Mexican immigrants, regardless of indigenous American descent, have no better claim to the Southwest US than "Anglos," Africans, or Asians. I dislike the ideas of Mecha and would never say that Mexicans or Mexican-Americans have a superior claim to the Southwest. If I appear to come across as sympathetic to Hispanics or Mexicans in my posts it is because these groups share this country's western (Christian) values and thus should at least be treated the same as other immigrant groups. My sympathy has nothing to do with some BS claim to American soil.
If this is indeed your position, then I can't argue with it. Apparently I misread your intent....as long as it's remembered that illegals aren't REALLY 'immigrants', anymore than shoplifters are REALLY just 'shoppers'. Because it's OK to come here legally, does NOT mean it's 'practically the same thing' when one arrives illegally...which is the idea many people are 'pushing' today.

Sorry if I misread your position...
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Old 05-27-2008, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Des Moines, IA
1,744 posts, read 6,487,179 times
Reputation: 1206
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach50 View Post

I am just interested because some people in Iowa really made an effort to show that illegals were not hurting them, as I posted originally.

I would also imagine Tyson will never be served a citation for hiring illegals, this is a major problem.
Cut off the $ and illegals will go home. No need for hate speech, no need for boycotts of Mexican trucks and products, just cut off the Employment and they go, it is that easy IMO.

It's true that you can find some people in Iowa who do not believe illegal immigration is hurting them...and honestly, white people in Mexican restaurants (like the video shows) opinions on camera probably aren't going to be the best representation of what everyone else is saying. "I like Mexicans because I can get tacos now".

I agree with you on Tyson and the other criminals in the meat industry or any industry that hires them. That would be a simple solution, but unfortunately we do have a lot of greedy people in our upper-classes who do not care about our nation's health, just their pocketbooks.
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Old 05-27-2008, 06:26 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,887,954 times
Reputation: 6517
Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
If this is indeed your position, then I can't argue with it. Apparently I misread your intent....as long as it's remembered that illegals aren't REALLY 'immigrants', anymore than shoplifters are REALLY just 'shoppers'. Because it's OK to come here legally, does NOT mean it's 'practically the same thing' when one arrives illegally...which is the idea many people are 'pushing' today.

Sorry if I misread your position...
Mac one of the best analogies to date.
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Old 06-01-2008, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Des Moines, IA
1,744 posts, read 6,487,179 times
Reputation: 1206
Update: Looks like Agriprocessors is getting fined only $42,000. Unbelievable. Their actions were/are completely despicable, whether you look at it as aiding illegals, the unsafe working conditions, near slavery wages or any other angle you look at those crooks. They're getting off extremely easy.


What a country we live in where these sort of actions get a simple slap on the wrist. Even the original $200,000 fine or whatever it is seems a little low. I'd like to see what other kinds of actions are in the $42,000 fine range to see how they compare.
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Old 06-01-2008, 01:25 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,628,664 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by El Rhino View Post
Update: Looks like Agriprocessors is getting fined only $42,000. Unbelievable. Their actions were/are completely despicable, whether you look at it as aiding illegals, the unsafe working conditions, near slavery wages or any other angle you look at those crooks. They're getting off extremely easy.


What a country we live in where these sort of actions get a simple slap on the wrist. Even the original $200,000 fine or whatever it is seems a little low. I'd like to see what other kinds of actions are in the $42,000 fine range to see how they compare.
As you stated (and, I am being very polite here).
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