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Old 06-01-2008, 10:26 PM
 
3,368 posts, read 10,275,065 times
Reputation: 1675

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
The US LEGALLY admits close to 2 million people a year to our nation, more than ALL OTHER nations of the world COMBINED!!! Crisp444 seems to think that isn't enough, so he has no problem with looking the other way as 5 million or more come EVERY YEAR illegally.

My question is simple...

How many is enough????
I don't know. I'm not an economist; all I know is that the economy seems to be absorbing immigration (both legal and illegal) at its current rate.

I have read that legal immigration is at about 1,000,000 per year and that illegal immigration is somewhere between 700,000 and 1,500,000 per year. With those numbers, it seems that the 1,000,000 would have to be doubled to 2,000,000 to satisfy demand for immigrants. Five million illegal immigrants per year is a gross exaggeration based on everything I've ever read; I have heard that 1,500,000 is a very liberal estimate!
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Old 06-01-2008, 10:38 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,203,701 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
That's ironic to hear that I don't have experience with "illegals." I am from South Florida, one of the regions to which many of you love to refer when giving examples of "illegal immigration gone mad." Second, I volunteered my time for three years while teaching ENGLISH LITERACY to immigrant adults (most of them illegal!) in Boston, MA. Third, I now live in New York, to which many of you so kindly refer as a "sanctuary city (for illegal immigrants)". I may not be from El Paso, TX or Los Angeles, CA, but to suggest that I don't have experience interacting with "illegals" is pretty absurd. I doubt that most of you on this forum have interacted with these immigrants as much as I have. I'm not just some clueless dingbat with a keyboard; I do think before I speak.
Opposite affect.
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Old 06-02-2008, 01:49 PM
 
Location: US
3,074 posts, read 3,336,186 times
Reputation: 1621
I work with the blind, elderly and disabled, so we're both good-hearted people. I lived in Miami too. Now, you've posted a lot of facts about immigrants, how they are being absorbed, etc. You've said you don't have time to post a thesis--I'm not looking for that. I just want to read what you say you've read--maybe it will change my mind. I've done a lot of research and can't find anything like that. I've even searched many liberal articles, and all I can see is how hard the people worked to get here and/or how this is their country, too, how their influx will create more seats for California Senators, etc. Are you able to post some of the articles you talk about?

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
That's ironic to hear that I don't have experience with "illegals." I am from South Florida, one of the regions to which many of you love to refer when giving examples of "illegal immigration gone mad." Second, I volunteered my time for three years while teaching ENGLISH LITERACY to immigrant adults (most of them illegal!) in Boston, MA. Third, I now live in New York, to which many of you so kindly refer as a "sanctuary city (for illegal immigrants)". I may not be from El Paso, TX or Los Angeles, CA, but to suggest that I don't have experience interacting with "illegals" is pretty absurd. I doubt that most of you on this forum have interacted with these immigrants as much as I have. I'm not just some clueless dingbat with a keyboard; I do think before I speak.
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Old 06-02-2008, 03:07 PM
 
Location: Earth
539 posts, read 1,850,335 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
I don't know. I'm not an economist; all I know is that the economy seems to be absorbing immigration (both legal and illegal) at its current rate.
You're funny..... Oh, were you being serious?
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Old 06-02-2008, 06:24 PM
 
3,368 posts, read 10,275,065 times
Reputation: 1675
Quote:
Originally Posted by carolac View Post
I work with the blind, elderly and disabled, so we're both good-hearted people. I lived in Miami too. Now, you've posted a lot of facts about immigrants, how they are being absorbed, etc. You've said you don't have time to post a thesis--I'm not looking for that. I just want to read what you say you've read--maybe it will change my mind. I've done a lot of research and can't find anything like that. I've even searched many liberal articles, and all I can see is how hard the people worked to get here and/or how this is their country, too, how their influx will create more seats for California Senators, etc. Are you able to post some of the articles you talk about?
I'll have to try to search for some of the stuff that I mentioned... the problem is that I read lots of these studies/articles either in conjunction with my university studies 2-3 years ago or I read them online and don't have them archived. I'll look through my long list of internet favorites and see if I've saved any links to this topic.
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Old 06-02-2008, 06:33 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,203,701 times
Reputation: 4611
This will be interesting.
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Old 06-02-2008, 08:04 PM
 
1,448 posts, read 2,658,723 times
Reputation: 690
Quote:
Illegal immigrants are well aware of the free education perks and admit they are a big incentive to enter the country illegally.
A family of illegal immigrants living in Irving says it has greatly benefited from the U.S. taxpayer-financed free education, which makes living in the country illegally worth the risk. The 35-year-old mother took free English classes offered by Irving schools so that parents can help their children with homework and her children speak English fluently thanks to their free topnotch U.S. education.
If the family gets deported, the illegal immigrant mother said, they could use their new language in the tourist industry in Mexico. Otherwise, they have no plans to return to Mexico
Illegal Immigrants Cause Public School Crisis | Judicial Watch
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Old 06-02-2008, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,174,407 times
Reputation: 391
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
I don't know. I'm not an economist; all I know is that the economy seems to be absorbing immigration (both legal and illegal) at its current rate.
It's obvious to me that you're buying all the government doublespeak about unemployment rates, economic output, etc. You might want to doublecheck the junk they're feeding you against the PREVIOUS methods used to calculate those things. You'll find that unemployment is closer to 10% than 5, and you'll find that while our currency is circling the bowl our trade balance runs negative by hundreds of BILLIONS. Congratulations on living a life where reality doesn't effect you.

Quote:
I have read that legal immigration is at about 1,000,000 per year and that illegal immigration is somewhere between 700,000 and 1,500,000 per year. With those numbers, it seems that the 1,000,000 would have to be doubled to 2,000,000 to satisfy demand for immigrants. Five million illegal immigrants per year is a gross exaggeration based on everything I've ever read; I have heard that 1,500,000 is a very liberal estimate!
Your 1 million figure for legal immigration doesn't take notice of all the H1b's, L1's, H2's or any of the panoply of work visas that are handed out like candy each and every year.

As for illegal immigration, the US Border Patrol estimates for the last 6 years run right around 4-5 million per year. They catch a million or so and figure for every one they catch, 4 or 5 get through them.

You really should get out more often...
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Old 06-02-2008, 10:43 PM
 
3,368 posts, read 10,275,065 times
Reputation: 1675
Get out to where?!? I live in Brooklyn, work in Manhattan, am from Miami (and visit a few times per year). I'm a pretty well-traveled person as well, and have lived/studied in Spain (where there's not only a problem with Eastern European and Arab "illegals" but with - (gasp!) Subsaharan African "illegals" as well). It's not like I just sit in my little Iowa/Montana/Georgia town and base all my comments on how I perceive the Mexicans that work in the factory down the street. I am a fluent Spanish speaker and not only to I try to keep informed about current events/laws passed regarding immigration, I also have talked to "illegals" about their situation in the United States, Spain, and Italy.

Though your comments about the employment rate may be true, I am not an economist and read/watch CNN and other mainstream news outlets (NYTimes, occasionally read the Economist) to find out information like that. If they're lying or hiding the true numbers from me, I really can't be expected to "know" the numbers to which you're referring. And even if you're "englightened," I highly doubt that many other forumers here are as well.
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Old 06-03-2008, 07:16 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,622,458 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
Get out to where?!? I live in Brooklyn, work in Manhattan, am from Miami (and visit a few times per year). I'm a pretty well-traveled person as well, and have lived/studied in Spain (where there's not only a problem with Eastern European and Arab "illegals" but with - (gasp!) Subsaharan African "illegals" as well). It's not like I just sit in my little Iowa/Montana/Georgia town and base all my comments on how I perceive the Mexicans that work in the factory down the street. I am a fluent Spanish speaker and not only to I try to keep informed about current events/laws passed regarding immigration, I also have talked to "illegals" about their situation in the United States, Spain, and Italy.

Though your comments about the employment rate may be true, I am not an economist and read/watch CNN and other mainstream news outlets (NYTimes, occasionally read the Economist) to find out information like that. If they're lying or hiding the true numbers from me, I really can't be expected to "know" the numbers to which you're referring. And even if you're "englightened," I highly doubt that many other forumers here are as well.
And the irony is that Spain is not hospitable to most New World Hispanics either------several Mexicans who hailed from Mexico flat told me that.
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