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View Poll Results: What should happen?
He/they should be deported after his graduation 41 58.57%
He/they should be given amnesty due to his academic achievements and skills 17 24.29%
He/they should be granted asylum due to the hardship they may face back in Armenia 3 4.29%
A "private bill" should be passed, allowing them to stay 2 2.86%
Other 7 10.00%
Voters: 70. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-08-2008, 09:00 PM
 
Location: East Texas across street from the lake.
99 posts, read 274,849 times
Reputation: 56

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The law is the law! Our prisons are filled with people who have broken our laws.

Who would invite a burglar to stay in their house after the burglar was caught breaking into your house? Not me!


Burglars who break into a house, break our laws, they are prosecuted and go to jail. Over stay a Visa, or come here without immigration authorization, you are no different than a burglar who breaks into a house. We have immigration laws that must be followed and enforced. People who want to come to America and stay, need to do so legally!
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Old 06-08-2008, 10:54 PM
 
8,240 posts, read 14,896,860 times
Reputation: 3651
Quote:
Originally Posted by Politico View Post
I was thinking the same thing. When there are MILLIONS of uneducated, unproductive (unproductive, not unreproductive) illegal immigrants in this country (and it's not too difficult to locate many of them without even doing much searching), why is ICE intent on deporting one of the them who's actually accomplishing something, who may yield a return investment on the education he has received here, and ignoring a lot of the illegal aliens who are a drain on the system in more ways than just receiving a free education? I mean, it's one thing if ICE were deporting every single illegal immigrant next month. But they're not...so why this guy, who actually may do some good? Just askin...
Um...because it's the LAW? Because the family is here illegally? Change the laws if you don't like it.
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Old 06-08-2008, 11:22 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,699,632 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabluey View Post
What is it? A misdemeanor? A felony? I dont believe it's any of those unless they have a prior removal. If it WERE a crime, then they would be entitled to representation (they aren't in many parts of the process) and due process (also missing). I get this information from some CLE's I've attended. Very superficial CLE's that don't provide too much detail except that it appears that immigration is a civil judicial process, not criminal.

If they were removed/deported and returned before they were permitted I understand it's a felony...

It depends, if they are just simply here illegally, then it may be a misdemeanor crime. If they are working here illegally then there are more crimes involved, if they are using stolen social security numbers, that in itself is a felony crime.

Breaking the law should not entitle them to any reward. There is a legal process in place, others are following it and for lawbreakers to believe they should be moved to the front of the line is simply absurd.

The USA takes in far more legal immigrants than any other country in the world and it's shameful that some believe they are too special to have to abide by the lawful process.
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Old 06-09-2008, 02:58 PM
 
394 posts, read 896,330 times
Reputation: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabluey View Post
He should stay. He needs to apply his education to contribute to this society. For the same reasons that we allow the intellectual elite of other countries allowances to stay in this country. His parents should not receive legal papers UNLESS they prove a case justifying asylum. Otherwise, their case should be the same as any relative of a legal resident.

Perhaps new laws can be implemented taxing those undocumented who receive education at a higher rate than legals. But if he shows an intellectual acumen, he has a debt he can and should repay to America.
although i would lean towards deporting them all, i must admit this is a pretty reasonable plan Kabluey
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Old 06-09-2008, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Bountiful, Utah
219 posts, read 378,461 times
Reputation: 71
Why wait until after graduation? He has broken the law, do you wait until the crack smoker is done with his rock to take him to jail? We need to get a back bone and start taking down the law breakers NO MATTER WHAT THE LAW IS!
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Old 06-09-2008, 06:55 PM
 
1,031 posts, read 2,023,762 times
Reputation: 384
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
It depends, if they are just simply here illegally, then it may be a misdemeanor crime. If they are working here illegally then there are more crimes involved, if they are using stolen social security numbers, that in itself is a felony crime.

Breaking the law should not entitle them to any reward. There is a legal process in place, others are following it and for lawbreakers to believe they should be moved to the front of the line is simply absurd.

The USA takes in far more legal immigrants than any other country in the world and it's shameful that some believe they are too special to have to abide by the lawful process.
I have never hid my opinion on illegal immigration. And certainly the illegals should not get to retain the place in line they cut into. But technically, it's not a crime, and there are benefits to that distinction for American citizens, taxpayers, and the government in terms of options. I.e., deportation is not an available punishment for a criminal conviction, while it is available for immigration. I just see little nuances that I don't think are widely understood for what they are and why they are important nuances. The civil process gives the government a lot more options to punish, and compel agreement from the detainees; the detainees have fewer rights than the average criminal defendant. I don't think we want to give them those extra rights, or limit our punishment options to essentially probation, imprisonment, or letting them go free, in exchange for calling them criminals.

Again, my understanding is illegal immigration that does not involve violating criminal statutes, and does not involve a prior deportation with a time-based bar against re-entry, is handled in an administrative arm of the Justice Department, separate from the judicial branch. Therefore, it cannot be a crime.
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Old 06-09-2008, 07:52 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,809,199 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kabluey View Post
Again, my understanding is illegal immigration that does not involve violating criminal statutes, and does not involve a prior deportation with a time-based bar against re-entry, is handled in an administrative arm of the Justice Department, separate from the judicial branch. Therefore, it cannot be a crime.
Very few illegal aliens currently in this country would not qualify as criminal, with the exception of ‘most’ minor illegals. Illegal aliens cannot be “legally” employed in this country. Therefore, all employed illegal aliens....including the "hard-working" and those simply "seeking a better life" -- are either using a fake (document fraud) or stolen (identity theft) SSN. Those being paid “under the table” are guilty of tax evasion, along with their unscrupulous employers.

Then we have an assortment of ‘career’ criminals…..drug dealers, human traffickers, thieves, rapists, murderers, pedophiles, etc. Let’s not forget the thousands previously deported (often several times) -- they would in fact be guilty of felony offenses. Last, but certainly not least, we have the multitude of illegals guilty of hit and run, and vehicular manslaughter. Unfortunately, they are often never apprehended due to fleeing the country. Of course, most return after the ‘heat’ dies down.
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Old 06-09-2008, 09:18 PM
 
1,031 posts, read 2,023,762 times
Reputation: 384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Very few illegal aliens currently in this country would not qualify as criminal, with the exception of ‘most’ minor illegals. Illegal aliens cannot be “legally” employed in this country. Therefore, all employed illegal aliens....including the "hard-working" and those simply "seeking a better life" -- are either using a fake (document fraud) or stolen (identity theft) SSN. Those being paid “under the table” are guilty of tax evasion, along with their unscrupulous employers.

Then we have an assortment of ‘career’ criminals…..drug dealers, human traffickers, thieves, rapists, murderers, pedophiles, etc. Let’s not forget the thousands previously deported (often several times) -- they would in fact be guilty of felony offenses. Last, but certainly not least, we have the multitude of illegals guilty of hit and run, and vehicular manslaughter. Unfortunately, they are often never apprehended due to fleeing the country. Of course, most return after the ‘heat’ dies down.
Well, I don't know the statistics, but I agree that there are many, many who fall under both categories -- both illegal and criminals. I just wanted to clarify and distinguish between the immigration side and the criminal side. Certainly, many fall under both. But that shouldn't blur the two terms, nor the two procedures. Currently, the way it seems to work, is that the criminal jurisdiction comes first -- they are sentenced for their crime, then transferred to immigration to settle that. At least I hope that would be the way it worked. I don't know if that's the right thing or wrong thing. I sense it's the right thing right now to punish them here to guarantee they don't return as essentially free, unsupervised dangers to American society as long as our borders are so porous. Would we rather ensure that a rapist is taken out of our society through prison or deportation?
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Old 06-09-2008, 09:30 PM
 
4,828 posts, read 6,790,161 times
Reputation: 620
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Very few illegal aliens currently in this country would not qualify as criminal, with the exception of ‘most’ minor illegals. Illegal aliens cannot be “legally” employed in this country. Therefore, all employed illegal aliens....including the "hard-working" and those simply "seeking a better life" -- are either using a fake (document fraud) or stolen (identity theft) SSN. Those being paid “under the table” are guilty of tax evasion, along with their unscrupulous employers.

Then we have an assortment of ‘career’ criminals…..drug dealers, human traffickers, thieves, rapists, murderers, pedophiles, etc. Let’s not forget the thousands previously deported (often several times) -- they would in fact be guilty of felony offenses. Last, but certainly not least, we have the multitude of illegals guilty of hit and run, and vehicular manslaughter. Unfortunately, they are often never apprehended due to fleeing the country. Of course, most return after the ‘heat’ dies down.
You know this how?
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Old 06-09-2008, 10:05 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,173,806 times
Reputation: 391
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacknight04 View Post
You know this how?
Read the rest of the post, BK. She explained EXACTLY how she 'knows'. All you gotta do is pay attention...
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