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View Poll Results: Should these groups be banned?
yes 23 54.76%
no 14 33.33%
don't care/not sure 5 11.90%
Voters: 42. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-23-2008, 02:36 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,997,852 times
Reputation: 332

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron von Costume View Post
AMC -

not that I am a fan of the KKK, but I think it started as a social club, and later transmogrified into what it now is.

And the idea that the Black Panthers, for example, were non-violent is of course news to me and many others who lived in California, where I had professors who defended Angela Davis on being an accomplice to the murder of a judge.

The Panthers indeed were a terrorist organisation and not the Boy Scouts.

It started as a social club determined to keep down Black's rights to vote, get an education, own guns, and other rights.
It wasnt too long before they went on night rides to burn houses and hang blacks.

Black Panthers did engage in some violence, but Blacks pretty much had their backs against the wall at that time. With the problems they were facing back then, it was legitimate revolutionary group in my opinion. The social climate at the time breeded groups like theirs.
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Old 06-23-2008, 03:23 PM
 
Location: Central NJ, USA
218 posts, read 392,522 times
Reputation: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
It started as a social club determined to keep down Black's rights to vote, get an education, own guns, and other rights.
It wasnt too long before they went on night rides to burn houses and hang blacks.

Black Panthers did engage in some violence, but Blacks pretty much had their backs against the wall at that time. With the problems they were facing back then, it was legitimate revolutionary group in my opinion. The social climate at the time breeded groups like theirs.

I guess we will have to disagree. Whilst times breed revolutionary groups, murdering judges and policemen is beyond the Pale as far as I am concerned.
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Old 06-23-2008, 03:25 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,997,852 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron von Costume View Post
I guess we will have to disagree. Whilst times breed revolutionary groups, murdering judges and policemen is beyond the Pale as far as I am concerned.
I see your point. But those were rough times that we hopefully wont be revisiting anytime soon.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:43 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,731,841 times
Reputation: 22159
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
It started as a social club determined to keep down Black's rights to vote, get an education, own guns, and other rights.
It wasnt too long before they went on night rides to burn houses and hang blacks.

Black Panthers did engage in some violence, but Blacks pretty much had their backs against the wall at that time. With the problems they were facing back then, it was legitimate revolutionary group in my opinion. The social climate at the time breeded groups like theirs.
The Black Panthers did not achieve anything for blacks, it was groups like those led by Martin Luther King, Ralph Abernathy that emphasized nonviolent protests that accomplished something.

Mexican illegals really need to take their protests back to their own country, what their country lacks is a social justice movement and that's why so many are dying trying to leave that rich nation. The Black Civil Rights movement didn't sneak into other countries and work for justice, they worked to improve their own nation.
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Old 06-24-2008, 07:17 AM
 
Location: City of North Las Vegas, NV
11,215 posts, read 7,610,222 times
Reputation: 2973
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Mexican illegals really need to take their protests back to their own country, what their country lacks is a social justice movement and that's why so many are dying trying to leave that rich nation .
Problem is that if you asked many illegals and MECHa people, they blame the US and its policies for their poor conditions. In a way they are seeking revenge. Don't they ever blame the pathetic mexican government?

Last edited by WildWestDude; 06-24-2008 at 07:37 AM..
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Old 06-24-2008, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Central NJ, USA
218 posts, read 392,522 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WildWestDude View Post
Problem is that if you asked many illegals and MECHa people, they blame the US and its policies for their poor conditions. In a way they are seeking revenge. Don't they ever blame their own government?
How many illegals have you actually asked? The few people I ever interacted with (and I was never certain that they were illegals, mind you) were pretty much oblivious to political arguments about reconquista or revenge. Most simply thought that they could have a better chance for them and their families if they came here, so they largely kept quiet and went about their jobs.

MeCHA is a toxic group in my own estimation. But I would suggest that most of the people you see advocating Aztlan or reconquistas or waving Mexican flags in noisome protests are mostly Americans of Mexican descent, and not illegal immigrants.
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Old 06-24-2008, 05:33 PM
 
Location: West Hollywood
2,204 posts, read 4,003,155 times
Reputation: 1709
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildWestDude View Post
Problem is that if you asked many illegals and MECHa people, they blame the US and its policies for their poor conditions. In a way they are seeking revenge. Don't they ever blame the pathetic mexican government?
Nope. Everything is always our fault to many of them.

What's funny is, the Mexican government treats many of it's legal immigrants much poorer than we do, with limited rights for them that many have here.

So, it's okay for Mexicans to have a secure immigration policy but not the US to the Mexican government. Oh wait, I'm sorry, I'm racist for simply criticizing Mexico, sorry.
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Old 06-24-2008, 05:58 PM
 
Location: City of North Las Vegas, NV
11,215 posts, read 7,610,222 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nafster View Post
Nope. Everything is always our fault to many of them.

What's funny is, the Mexican government treats many of it's legal immigrants much poorer than we do, with limited rights for them that many have here.

So, it's okay for Mexicans to have a secure immigration policy but not the US to the Mexican government. Oh wait, I'm sorry, I'm racist for simply criticizing Mexico, sorry.
right on, agree
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Old 06-25-2008, 02:42 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,997,852 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron von Costume View Post
How many illegals have you actually asked? The few people I ever interacted with (and I was never certain that they were illegals, mind you) were pretty much oblivious to political arguments about reconquista or revenge. Most simply thought that they could have a better chance for them and their families if they came here, so they largely kept quiet and went about their jobs.

MeCHA is a toxic group in my own estimation. But I would suggest that most of the people you see advocating Aztlan or reconquistas or waving Mexican flags in noisome protests are mostly Americans of Mexican descent, and not illegal immigrants.
I agree with everything you said here.

Most of them are young Chicanos looking for a chance to be rebels.
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Old 06-25-2008, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Surprise, Az
3,496 posts, read 8,345,361 times
Reputation: 1832
No, these groups should not be banned. And neither should Nazi or KKK groups. You do not have to support, agree, or even listen to them but you do have to acknowledge their right to exist.
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