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Old 07-22-2009, 03:08 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,409,314 times
Reputation: 475

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Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
Strange that you should detect xenophobia (by smell, or otherwise), in a country that has taken in 'far and away' more foreigners than any other society in the history of the world. That's an odd kind of place to label 'xenophobic', it seems to me.

Perhaps a thread about Hispanics "taking over" is a bit of an overstatement...I agree. But is it altogether surprising? Are you honestly 'shocked' by such sentiments, given today's situation?

If France suddenly found itself housing 10 million Italians....or India was the new home of 10% of the population of Pakistan; if Japan were suddenly 'chosen' as their new home by millions of Indonesians, or Mexico suddenly found itself providing space for a huge influx of Nigerians....do you expect this would all go 'smoothly'? Can you see ANY of the residents of these 'host' nations expressing alarm? Can you see a few of them grumbling, decrying the 'changes' in their society, and feeling apprehensive about their own future? And if they did this, would you then accuse them of being 'xenophobic'?

Recently, on this forum, our good friend Travelling Fella forwarded an article congratulating Brazil on legalizing (amnestizing) "Several tens of thousands of illegal residents". Wonderful...so Brazil did 'the right thing'.

But here in the US, we're not talking about 'several tens of thousands' of illegals...we're talking about MULTIPLE MILLIONS of illegals...from all over the place, among them about TEN PERCENT of the ENTIRE POPULATION of Mexico..(which is, in itself, certainly not a 'small' country, nor is it a particularly POOR country).

So there you have it....it's easy, and convenient, to assign ANY American misgivings re: illegals to simple 'xenophobia'...(to your credit, at LEAST you didn't try to blame the problem on 'racism')....but 'xenophobia', in what context? When the nation that's taken in more LEGAL immigrants than any other in history..(and probably more ILLEGALS, as well), finds itself approaching the limits of its ability to 'take people in', you accuse it of 'xenophobia'.....But if the US is 'xenophobic', what do you call MOST of the world...'Ultra-xenophobic'? If we're 'tough on poor Mexicans' here, what do you call Mexico.."NICE to poor Mexicans"? If the US is 'unwelcoming to foreigners' (i.e., xenophobic), how would you describe Egypt...or China...or Turkey...or Nigeria...."really, REALLY UNWELCOMING ?"..

I agree that the thread title is a bit 'over-the-top'...just wanted to put things in context. The US may be turning a TINY bit xenophobic...and perhaps there's a reason for that.
Read the post again my friend...its PHOBIA!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdonaldson View Post
Once they become a racial majority, will racial tension increase between Hispanics and whites, blacks, Asians etc? I honestly fear that once they become the overwhelming racial majority in California they'll feel more loyal to Mexico and try to succede from the US. Afterwards, racial tension will be on the rise and California will become a racial war zone followed by Arizona, New Mexico, Texas and possibly the rest of the US.

Does anyone think this will occur? (I'm honestly scared that this could be possible)
Furthermore, I am not representing most Americans in my post, THANK GOD! I am criticizing this one poster who seems to think Hispanics will take over the nation and claim aligance to Mexico. That is absurd.

Also I dont understand the need for people's sense of entitlement to want to control another ethnicity's population or to feel threatened by them.

I dont know that I agree with your analogies of ethnicities going into other countries. It certainly does not apply to Mexico since Mexico is a combination of many ethnicities of immigrants. Its the Spanish, Philipinos, Lebanese, etc.

Have a good day my friend

 
Old 07-22-2009, 03:16 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,409,314 times
Reputation: 475
Quote:
Originally Posted by SickAndBroke View Post
Atzlan, as can found out from many reference sources of latino mexican groups want to take ca,az,nv,ect.

This is no joke take a look at this well written article on the suject of take over The Road to Aztlan

As one of MEChA’s many charming slogans has it, "for those of our race, everything; for those outside of it, nothing."
I apologize if I dont read the article. I am very much aware of Aztlan and it is equally nausiating than reading these xenophobic posts on this forum. I have written about my disagreements with these Mexican-American organizations in the past. Yes, they are American and not Mexican as you wrote above. As a matter of fact, most of the members have never lived in Mexico. They claim to be Native American.
 
Old 07-22-2009, 03:25 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,409,314 times
Reputation: 475
Quote:
Originally Posted by SickAndBroke View Post
amazing how hypocritical and condescending these pro illegals supporter are?
I have my issues with illegal immigration myself. I dont think that all in support of deportation are ethnocentrics, just as much as pro-legalization supporters are as well. However, you describe me to be hypocritical and condescending when all I did was point out the phobia of one post.

Look at this post and tell me if it is not condescending, arrogant and hypocritical?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John McClane View Post
If they have the look from Spain than they don't really have the look of the classic all American girl, because most White Americans are of Northern European descent.

When I think of the classic all American girl look, this is what pops up in my head.


If most Mexicans looked as White as her, than I bet that 99.99% of White Americans would be in favor of giving amnesty to the millions of illegal immigrants from Mexico living in the U.S.
My, my...
 
Old 07-22-2009, 07:42 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
One thing to keep in mind:

The 'Hispanic' label will probably wind up going away once the parties involved realize it is to their detriment to keep it.

Especially factoring in that many if not most White Hispanics tend to bristle being referred to as such.
 
Old 07-22-2009, 12:38 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
.

I dont know that I agree with your analogies of ethnicities going into other countries. It certainly does not apply to Mexico since Mexico is a combination of many ethnicities of immigrants. Its the Spanish, Philipinos, Lebanese, etc.

Have a good day my friend
I thought the US, too, was a combination of various races and ethnicities...it certainly is in MY neighborhood, and in MY family. I never thought of Mexico as somehow more 'accomodating' to immigrants than the US is....

I know, of course, that there are PLENTY of Mexicans of all sorts of ethnic roots...but I honestly never saw Mexico, (the nation) as more 'understanding' of foreigners than we are here. Maybe because Mexico has never been 'put to the test' by hosting millions of immigrants in a short time....or maybe because Mexico insists that those who DO come there, do so legally, and, until they're Mexican citizens, keep a 'low profile'.

I'd be interested in your 'take' on the following...when, (as far as you know), was the last big "mass migration" into Mexico? When was the last era when several million non-Mexicans arrived from elsewhere, to set up housekeeping in Mexico, all in a short period of time? My guess was that this must have been 150 years or 200 years ago, at LEAST. How the Mexicans at that time "felt" about this is probably long forgotten. The difference is that, here in the US, it's happening TODAY...and you're hearing comments from Americans right NOW, as it's happening. Neither you, nor I, were alive long ago when Mexico last experienced sudden 'mass immigration', and thus it's really hard to draw parallels, or to know how 'smoothly' this went....

This is only my personal observation, of course....and, as I've already stated, yes, Hispanics "taking over" is a bit of an over-statement. Remember, too, that "phobia" doesn't refer to hatred...it refers to 'fear'. It may be an unreasonable fear, I agree.

Thanks for your comments, and for your opinions...

Last edited by macmeal; 07-22-2009 at 12:51 PM..
 
Old 07-22-2009, 01:32 PM
 
31 posts, read 40,581 times
Reputation: 18
Quote:
I dont know that I agree with your analogies of ethnicities going into other countries. It certainly does not apply to Mexico since Mexico is a combination of many ethnicities of immigrants. Its the Spanish, Philipinos, Lebanese, etc.
If Mexico is so ethnically/racially diverse than why are Mexicans always complaining about racial profiling ?

You can't racially profile a group if they are as racially diverse as you claim they are, because than "racist White cops" can not tell who is Mexican and who is not just based on physical appearance alone.

You can't racially profile a group if they are like chameleons that can racially look like anything.

So the conclusion is that Mexico is obviously is not as diverse as you claim, judging by the fact that the overwhelming majority of Mexicans do not have a physical appearance than can easily blend into Non Hispanic communites like the White community, Black community, or Asian community.

The overwhelming majority of Mexicans look like what a Mexican typically is supposed to look like, hence why they get racially profiled alot because most of them are not chameleons.

It is hard to raically profile a group if they are not known for having a common racial look.
 
Old 07-22-2009, 01:34 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baby Face Nelson View Post
If Mexico is so ethnically/racially diverse than why are Mexicans always complaining about racial profiling ?

You can't racially profile a group if they are as racially diverse as you claim they are, because than you can not tell who is Mexican and who is not just based on physical appearance alone.

You can't racially profile a group if they are like chameleons that can racially look like anything.

So the conclusion is that Mexico is obviously is not as diverse as you claim, judging by the fact that the overwhelming majority of Mexicans do not have a physical appearance than can easily blend into Non Hispanic communites like the White community, Black community, or Asian community.

The overwhelming majority of Mexicans look like what a Mexican typically is supposed to look like, hence why they get racially profiled alot because most of them are not chameleons.
Too; most White Mexicans tend to be in the USA legally since they are usually part of the elite SoB hence them having proper documentation.
 
Old 07-22-2009, 01:46 PM
 
31 posts, read 40,581 times
Reputation: 18
Quote:
Too; most White Mexicans tend to be in the USA legally since they are usually part of the elite SoB hence them having proper documentation.
In the past it was common for many Italians and Jews in the U.S to change their last names to more Anglo Saxon sounding last names in order to avoid discrimination and blend in more.

With most Mexicans, they can change their Spanish sounding last names to more Anglo Saxon sounding last names and it still would not make a difference. Because unlike Italians and Jews, most Mexicans can not pass for White in physical appearance.

Changing your last name from Ramirez to Robinson is not going to make your Aztec features less obvious.
 
Old 07-22-2009, 01:48 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,612,395 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
I apologize if I dont read the article. I am very much aware of Aztlan and it is equally nausiating than reading these xenophobic posts on this forum. I have written about my disagreements with these Mexican-American organizations in the past. Yes, they are American and not Mexican as you wrote above. As a matter of fact, most of the members have never lived in Mexico. They claim to be Native American.
I agree with this. I've known a few 'friends of friends', etc. who have subscribed to the 'Aztlan' mindset. MOST of them, in my experience, are American-born....many of them do NOT speak passable Spanish...and MOST of them average around 18-20 years of age. A lot of them are college students. MOST of them eventually 'grow out of it', and to my knowledge, there are very few of these people in their 30's or older.

I re-read the OP, as you asked...and I DO agree that it's 'phobic', in that I do NOT see these folks 'taking over' and becoming "loyal to Mexico"...that part is silly. I'm not sure that all of them will become "loyal to the US", as that has traditionally been defined, either...but "loyal to Mexico"? No.

Perhaps these "Hispanics" (if that can be defined), in the future, will simply become more loyal to their own 'group', and this will also occur among ALL Americans. The future of America, at this point, looks to me like it will be much more 'group-oriented', and we'll see ourselves to have a lot LESS in common. Whether this will be a "problem" or not, remains to be seen.

That's only my personal prediction, of course. Don't put any money on it..
 
Old 07-22-2009, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Earth
17,449 posts, read 22,953,730 times
Reputation: 7246
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Sad and you are correct.
"Dirty and ugly" have often been used to describe Los Angeles and Phoenix even back in the days when both cities were overwhelmingly non-Latino white and not without reason (even though both to this day still have neighborhoods that aren't dirty and ugly, but obviously this problem long predates current illegal immigration. If anything it goes back to the mass suburbanization post WW2)

CA does have some nice medium sized cities but except for San Francisco its big cities have long been ugly places even though they often contain nicer pockets amidst the ugliness. This existed LONG before current CA/AZ problems with illegal immigration.
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