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Old 07-01-2008, 06:21 PM
 
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France is a big country of immigration since a very long time, the white french of today are descendent of German, Polish, Italian, Spanish, Portugese... immigrants.
The real France is a diverse country.

France is only homogenious in stereotypes.
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Old 07-04-2008, 03:46 PM
 
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Arabs have quite a diverse phenotype. Most Levantines are certainly white. The arabised North Africans and Berbers (the indigenous people of North Africa) are also predominantly white. I know Arabs are white in U.S census. The definition of white is more social in France. From what I understand West Asians are considered non-white (visible minority) in Canadian census.


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Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Arabs are White.
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Old 07-04-2008, 04:39 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
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Quote:
Originally Posted by internat View Post
Arabs have quite a diverse phenotype. Most Levantines are certainly white. The arabised North Africans and Berbers (the indigenous people of North Africa) are also predominantly white. I know Arabs are white in U.S census. The definition of white is more social in France. From what I understand West Asians are considered non-white (visible minority) in Canadian census.
That I do believe.......

For that matter; I doubt that there is a specific 'Hispanic' class in Canada though.
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Old 07-04-2008, 05:17 PM
 
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In every case the white notion is quite social.

ThisIsMyUsername, The large majority of "non white" in France are french and are born in France.
Their country is nto anymore in Africa, it is France, and many know this fact. They aslo know that they are french, even if some don't want to admit it.

Only 8% of metropotan France inhabitants are foreign born in these 8%, only 50% come from non European backroom majority country and 5% but the non white (north african include) are estimited to be between 12 and 20%. I think that the reality is about 15-16% for metropolitan France and about 20% including the overseas.
Also thinking of the musilms. There is only about 5 million muslims in France (8%). You miss a load of non white.
East asian tend to be really underrated in France when they are quite numberous (about 2%).

It is exactly like the myth of an ethnic civil war in France, interracial couple or group of friends are more frequent in France big cities than in north america big cities.
The tension are only along the older people.
The youth that live in the worst ghettos (Don't see Clichy sous Bois as an average for ethnic minority) are more against the state, the police and the upper class than the white.
There is many poor white in these district and many white were active in the riots.

I don't understand the idea of western culture with white people, why a black couldn't be european with a western culture ?
Most french black (my mother include) that I know have a french culture. The french culture is European and western. So they are western
Like Afo American, African american have american western culture, in reality they are not at all african.

That's why I believe that France would rest "french" in the future even with a non white majority.
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Old 07-04-2008, 06:54 PM
 
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Yes, read 2001 Census Visible Minority and Population Group User Guide

It has to do with the different history of USA and Canada. USA had the one-drop rule with blacks on the one side and everything else on the other. The Canadian system looks like a modified version of the British. The Canadian census is even more social than the U.S.

The visible minority designation should of course not be taken seriously. In reality a lot of Afghans are perfect examples of the Europid/Caucasoid race. Nuristani man: http://www.geocities.com/om_kranti/misc/guesswho1.jpg

They have something called Latin American in Canada.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
That I do believe.......

For that matter; I doubt that there is a specific 'Hispanic' class in Canada though.
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Old 07-04-2008, 07:02 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
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Quote:
Originally Posted by internat View Post
Yes, read 2001 Census Visible Minority and Population Group User Guide

It has to do with the different history of USA and Canada. USA had the one-drop rule with blacks on the one side and everything else on the other. The Canadian system looks like a modified version of the British.

The visible minority designation should of course not be taken seriously. In reality a lot of Afghans are perfect examples of the Europid/Caucasoid race. Nuristani man: http://www.geocities.com/om_kranti/misc/guesswho1.jpg
'One Drop Rule' anymore can be proven or disproven by DNA testing.

Case in point: a 'Black' man had his tested and; come to find out, had no Sub Saharan specific genes------he was ca. 66% White, 30% American Indian and 6% Asian.

OTOH: Watson of 'Watson and Crick DNA helix research' fame apparently had about 12% 'Black' genes yet was counted as White here in the USA.
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Old 07-04-2008, 08:59 PM
 
Location: Bethesda
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Originally Posted by averagejoe76 View Post
Judging from current trends will France become a muslim majority country due to immigration,birthrates.
Any other European countries to follow?
Just about all West European countries are due to follow if current trends continue. However, given that immigrant birthrates always decline after a generation or so, not to mention the fact that a Euro-wide anti-multiculturalism is gaining momentum means that this will probably not be the case.

The important thing here is that the immigrants (primarily from muslim countries) just don't assimilate. Meaning many European countries could lose their identities-this bothers me as it bothers more and more people. Europe cannot be diverse like the U.S. is. These are cultures that have existed for centuries. I think the issue is worrysome but I don't think Europe will be dominated by immigrants ever. Although if any do, France, Belgium, and the Netherlands will be first.

This is not a racial issue. Most of the Arabs coming in are white. Not Norway white, but white nonetheless. After all, there are only 3 races on Earth: Caucasoid, Mongoloid, Negroid. Religious issue? Absolutely. A society can't have a tolerant liberal group clashing with a conservative religious one. Europeans are starting to realize that you can't be tolerant of intolerant people. You are not racist, or xenophobic if you want to reduce or cut off immigration-sometimes its for the good of the nation.
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Old 07-05-2008, 03:16 AM
 
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France was always a multicultural country, there is huge difference between someone that living in southern France and someone that live central France.

The largest minority in France are the black, mostly christian, overseas departement are also the France, these should be include like Hawai is include in USA.

The large majority muslims in France are well integrated, have french values... so I don't see any problem.
Don't jugde a thing by the minority.

I think that in Paris the asian french will become more numberous than the northern African french, as the black french are more numberous than the northern African french.

To be honest looking by how are the couples actually and their little kids, I think that the mixed race people will in few decade become the majority of the visible monority population. It is already the case in some pre school.
The racial mix in France is high, of course you don't have any stat to prove it but a little trip in a french big city is enouth.

Of course this a racial issus, race concept is social and cultural. In Europe arab are not view as white, and they don't see them as white.
In the reality there is only one rare : Homos sapiens sapiens.
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Old 07-05-2008, 08:36 AM
 
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Minato, nice homilies of peace do not address muslims burning automobiles and rioting in Paris, nor muslims in the Netherlands publicly declaring that they will never abide by Dutch rule of law and will always abide by conflicting sharia religious mores that are in absolute defiance of their host countries.

The genuine issues are immigrants declaring they will always remain aggressively non-assimilationist (which always leads me to question why they chose to move to an "infidel" nation or one where all life and business is conducted in, say, the English language.) The whole of France is proud of their nation and "French-ness," which I would differ with your assertion that the French consider themselves striated from region to region.

There are multiple issues that embrace absolutes. We in countries with a longstanding democratic system like France or the U.S. at least try for fairness and equality, no matter what you think of the varying results. The extremist factions of muslims (guestimate from a learned source- 5 to 20% of the religion) do not believe in gender equality, amongst other differences in absolutes. For instance, French muslims have declared they do not think females should be treated by any emergency doctor available, but instead should wait in screaming agony for a female doctor in an area segregated for females. This is not the democratic tradition, and furthermore is a life and death issue.

I live in a country where my life's focuses are legal. I'm a woman, who does representational art for a living, and love my pets. These are three no-no's in the extremist factions of muslims that are fighting to dominate all cultures. Rather than your homilies, the attitude, as spelled out in our national motto "E Pluribus Unum" should be: anyone is welcome to come to America legally, as long as you want to be American and will abide by American laws. Save your private beliefs for your private life. Realization of same might be the right answer for all nations and peoples.

Last edited by fastfilm; 07-05-2008 at 08:57 AM..
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