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Old 07-08-2008, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,178,106 times
Reputation: 391

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Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
But if Spanish is bothering you, isn't that more of a problem with immigration than illegal immigration? because many legal immigrants speak spanish primarily.
And isn't being opposed to illegal immigration only being opposed to illegal immigrants? And not latinos?

So is the illegal aspect of Spanish being spoken, or is the part where most of the people speaking Spanish are Mexican that is peeving you?
Show me where I've said I'm bothered by the Spanish language. You can't, because I've never said it. If you re-read what I wrote, it's the importation of millions of Spanish-speakers without written permission that I'm bothered by.

What makes you think I'm opposed to Latinos? Did I post that somewhere, or are you making wild accusations again? It'd be kind of hard for me to be opposed to half of my family, don't you think?

 
Old 07-08-2008, 04:01 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,003,997 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
Show me where I've said I'm bothered by the Spanish language. You can't, because I've never said it. If you re-read what I wrote, it's the importation of millions of Spanish-speakers without written permission that I'm bothered by.

What makes you think I'm opposed to Latinos? Did I post that somewhere, or are you making wild accusations again? It'd be kind of hard for me to be opposed to half of my family, don't you think?
How are those "wild accusations"? At least not more than you calling me "pro illegal".
And I'm calling it how I see it. The frustration with Americans with so much Spanish beign spoken doesn't have as much to do with illegal immigration as it does with a different culture "taking over".

And trust me, it wouldn't be that hard.
 
Old 07-08-2008, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,178,106 times
Reputation: 391
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
How are those "wild accusations"? At least not more than you calling me "pro illegal".
And I'm calling it how I see it. The frustration with Americans with so much Spanish beign spoken doesn't have as much to do with illegal immigration as it does with a different culture "taking over".

And trust me, it wouldn't be that hard.
But you ARE pro-illegal. You want to let them stay and give them citizenship. How can that be construed as anything other than PRO?

'How you see it' is in direct contradiction to what I've posted. Are you saying that you know better than I how 'I' feel? Neat trick.

If half the Latino population in this country wasn't here illegally there would be nothing to worry about, would there?

So you think I'm in opposition to half of my own family?

To sum it up, I think you're highly delusional.
 
Old 07-08-2008, 04:29 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,003,997 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
But you ARE pro-illegal. You want to let them stay and give them citizenship. How can that be construed as anything other than PRO?

'How you see it' is in direct contradiction to what I've posted. Are you saying that you know better than I how 'I' feel? Neat trick.

If half the Latino population in this country wasn't here illegally there would be nothing to worry about, would there?

So you think I'm in opposition to half of my own family?

To sum it up, I think you're highly delusional.
I'm learning it from you guys! haha.

And I've known some half Mexicans who identified more with the other half. So its not impossible.
 
Old 07-08-2008, 04:56 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,834,008 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
How are those "wild accusations"? At least not more than you calling me "pro illegal".
And I'm calling it how I see it. The frustration with Americans with so much Spanish beign spoken doesn't have as much to do with illegal immigration as it does with a different culture "taking over".

And trust me, it wouldn't be that hard.
I certainly wouldn't want to "put words in your mouth" as you have accused me of doing. So, what the heck are you implying by the bolded comments? I sincerely hope itís not what Iím inferring.
 
Old 07-08-2008, 05:08 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,003,997 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I certainly wouldn't want to "put words in your mouth" as you have accused me of doing. So, what the heck are you implying by the bolded comments? I sincerely hope itís not what Iím inferring.
Spanish has little to do with illegal immigration. Its a cultural thing, not a matter of citizenship. So why are people so offended by so much Spanish being around?
 
Old 07-08-2008, 05:10 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,673,551 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I certainly wouldn't want to "put words in your mouth" as you have accused me of doing. So, what the heck are you implying by the bolded comments? I sincerely hope itís not what Iím inferring.
To be honest:

More and more I think about it; 'Hispanic' culture taking over is fading as a distinct possibility.......the economy if nothing else is forcing more and more illegals from Mexico/Central America to return home. Too; the birthrate within the Latino community is barely above replacement level.

And; in all fairness, if it were Spanish 'Hispanic' culture.......us Americans would hardly even notice a hypothetical takeover. Why I say that is modern Spain is more like Sweden in human rights, social capitalism, etc. than Mexico.
 
Old 07-08-2008, 05:14 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,003,997 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
To be honest:

More and more I think about it; 'Hispanic' culture taking over is fading as a distinct possibility.......the economy if nothing else is forcing more and more illegals from Mexico/Central America to return home. Too; the birthrate within the Latino community is barely above replacement level.

And; in all fairness, if it were Spanish 'Hispanic' culture.......us Americans would hardly even notice a hypothetical takeover. Why I say that is modern Spain is more like Sweden in human rights, social capitalism, etc. than Mexico.
noooooooooooooooooo!!!!
 
Old 07-08-2008, 05:22 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,633,512 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
Spanish has little to do with illegal immigration. Its a cultural thing, not a matter of citizenship. So why are people so offended by so much Spanish being around?
MAYBE because there are so many other cultures which have been adopted into America....yet so little of their languages seem to be 'pushed'. Take for example, the Vietnamese culture. It's been here a LOT shorter time than the Hispanic one....yet, despite having one of the largest Vietnamese communities in the world right in our neighborhood, there's little need for the use of Vietnamese language, outside of the immediate "Little Saigon" neighborhood. Though Vietnamese is a language FAR more alien to English than Spanish is, somehow its speakers have learned to 'get by' in English, and many have gone on to EXCEL in areas in which English is a requirement. Instead of "pushing" American society to adapt to THEM, the Vietnamese, for the most part, have pushed THEMSELVES, to adapt to America. The difference is not lost on those who watch this as it happens.

To the general public, it appears that "the Vietnamese" (however they're defined) seem 'interested' in learning English, and the proof is that most of them USE it....while, in some people's eyes, certain members of the Hispanic community seem decidely UN-interested in learning English...and the proof of THAT is in the fact that much effort and expense is given in 'catering' to them in Spanish...which would not be done, if it wasn't seen as necessary.

MANY immigrant groups have times when their native language is used in certain instances in the 'public sphere'...but it seems to be the case that most of the time, this is seen as a special accomodation for VERY recent arrivals, or for "old folks". In the case of Spanish, it's more like it's just expected, as a matter of their "due"....not just for 'old people', but for a whole huge segment of society, in a wide variety of situations.

Last edited by macmeal; 07-08-2008 at 05:37 PM..
 
Old 07-08-2008, 05:45 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 6,003,997 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
MAYBE because there are so many other cultures which have been adopted into America....yet so little of their languages seem to be 'pushed'. Take for example, the Vietnamese culture. It's been here a LOT shorter time than the Hispanic one....yet, despite having one of the largest Vietnamese communities in the world right in our neighborhood, there's little need for the use of Vietnamese language, outside of the immediate "Little Saigon" neighborhood. Though Vietnamese is a language FAR more alien to English than Spanish is, somehow its speakers have learned to 'get by' in English, and many have gone on to EXCEL in areas in which English is a requirement. Instead of "pushing" American society to adapt to THEM, the Vietnamese, for the most part, have pushed THEMSELVES, to adapt to America. The difference is not lost on those who watch this as it happens.

To the general public, it appears that "the Vietnamese" (however they're defined) seem 'interested' in learning English, and the proof is that most of them USE it....while, in some people's eyes, certain members of the Hispanic community seem decidely UN-interested in learning English...and the proof of THAT is in the fact that much effort and expense is given in 'catering' to them in Spanish...which would not be done, if it wasn't seen as necessary.

MANY immigrant groups have times when their native language is used in certain instances in the 'public sphere'...but it seems to be the case that most of the time, this is seen as a special accomodation for VERY recent arrivals, or for "old folks". In the case of Spanish, it's more like it's just expected, as a matter of their "due"....not just for 'old people', but for a whole huge segment of society, in a wide variety of situations.
The DMV has translations for English, Spanish, Korean, Tagalog, Cantonese, and Vietnamese. Or Something like that.

Just like Mexicans, the younger generations of Vietnamese are growing up speaking English.
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