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Old 08-28-2009, 05:59 AM
 
Location: Sandpoint, Idaho
2,880 posts, read 5,070,237 times
Reputation: 3020

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
FYI: this is 2009, not 2007............many of the old beliefs about jobs that 'Americans won't do' have just been blown to smithereens by this de facto depression we are in.

The cold reality is we certainly do not need illegal aliens and their Anchor Babies------------especially now.

Besides: legal immigrants; Mexican or not, are much more likely to assimilate as it is.
Not really. Were this the case, the unemployment rate would be much lower. Americans have high "reservation wages." they are perhaps a bit lower but remain much higher than that of an immigration, especially one that is illegal.

Do we "need" illegals? Good question. Depends on the what we seek, no? If we would rather "insource" crappy jobs than do the jobs themselves, we need to find someone willing to do the job. That search remains the same.

If we do nto, then the question is empirical and not subject to debate. Company XYZ.com does not hire illegals. All else equal, the cost structure now increases...by what percent? Depends on the dependency on illegal labour ex ante. If high, then you better believe that company will be hit very hard and may go out of business. If not, then the effect may be minimal.

But logic suggests the following: if 4 million illegals leave...folks making a pittance...how jobs will we fill? 1 million? This leaves a short fall of three million. This shortfall leads to loss in a while bunch more jobs. as companies go under.

We got addicted to economic heroin: dependency on foreign labour, both with illegals and with legal immigrants in high tech. Both addictions were the result of bipartisan policy failures and the complicity of an American people who choice personal consumption growth over organically-grown communities.

THe only way to neutralize the loss of illegals to to change our behavior and laws to allow economic absorption of three million to fill jobs. However, I cannot foresee such a change in attitude. The thing about addiction is that quitting cold turkey take a terrible toll.

S.
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Old 08-28-2009, 06:37 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandpointian View Post
Not really. Were this the case, the unemployment rate would be much lower. Americans have high "reservation wages." they are perhaps a bit lower but remain much higher than that of an immigration, especially one that is illegal.

Do we "need" illegals? Good question. Depends on the what we seek, no? If we would rather "insource" crappy jobs than do the jobs themselves, we need to find someone willing to do the job. That search remains the same.

If we do nto, then the question is empirical and not subject to debate. Company XYZ.com does not hire illegals. All else equal, the cost structure now increases...by what percent? Depends on the dependency on illegal labour ex ante. If high, then you better believe that company will be hit very hard and may go out of business. If not, then the effect may be minimal.

But logic suggests the following: if 4 million illegals leave...folks making a pittance...how jobs will we fill? 1 million? This leaves a short fall of three million. This shortfall leads to loss in a while bunch more jobs. as companies go under.

We got addicted to economic heroin: dependency on foreign labour, both with illegals and with legal immigrants in high tech. Both addictions were the result of bipartisan policy failures and the complicity of an American people who choice personal consumption growth over organically-grown communities.

THe only way to neutralize the loss of illegals to to change our behavior and laws to allow economic absorption of three million to fill jobs. However, I cannot foresee such a change in attitude. The thing about addiction is that quitting cold turkey take a terrible toll.

S.
Bottom line: if this nation needs illegal aliens to survive-----------we deserve to die as a nation.

Your numbers are flawed as it is: with our official unemployment rate hovering around 10%--------that is around 20 million Americans out of work so your 4 million illegal aliens being gone means nothing.
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Old 08-28-2009, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,197,803 times
Reputation: 4611
Why don't we just start talking "broken english" and call it even.

Last edited by mkfarnam; 08-28-2009 at 08:48 AM..
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Old 08-29-2009, 10:26 PM
 
20,417 posts, read 26,539,344 times
Reputation: 13111
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewToCA View Post
I was watching CNN's "Situation Room" this afternoon and saw a clip of Obama addressing a public group and making this quote:

"Instead of worrying about whether immigrants can learn english - they'll learn english - you need to make sure YOUR child can speak Spanish, you should be thinking about how can your child become bilingual."

I replayed his clip three times to ensure I had the wording correct, but this is exactly what he said. I don't know who his audience was, but I found this comment rather startling.

At one time, when education in this country meant something, schoolchildren learned Latin. Latin and espanol are quite close; a good understanding of Latin can enable a person to have a good understanding of scientific nomenclature.
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Old 08-30-2009, 12:33 AM
 
549 posts, read 1,499,584 times
Reputation: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewToCA View Post
I was watching CNN's "Situation Room" this afternoon and saw a clip of Obama addressing a public group and making this quote:

"Instead of worrying about whether immigrants can learn english - they'll learn english - you need to make sure YOUR child can speak Spanish, you should be thinking about how can your child become bilingual."

I replayed his clip three times to ensure I had the wording correct, but this is exactly what he said. I don't know who his audience was, but I found this comment rather startling.
Spanish was the first European language learned/spoken in the U.S. by native Americans 21 years before the English settlement.

If you donŽt know that you need to study U.S history...(America >> Spanish word >>> Florida, California, Arizona, etc etc)

There is nothing wrong with being bilingual, youŽll make more money.

Canadians are bilingual and Europeans know many languages, not just 2.


People in other countries learn English as a second language and they donŽt complain that much.

Last edited by Eduardo983; 08-30-2009 at 12:43 AM..
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Old 08-30-2009, 12:56 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,408,714 times
Reputation: 475
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkfarnam View Post
Why don't we just start talking "broken english" and call it even.
That would not be meeting them half ways, they already speak broken english...and some speak very good English.
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Old 08-30-2009, 01:00 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,408,714 times
Reputation: 475
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eduardo983 View Post
Spanish was the first European language learned/spoken in the U.S. by native Americans 21 years before the English settlement.

If you donŽt know that you need to study U.S history...(America >> Spanish word >>> Florida, California, Arizona, etc etc)

There is nothing wrong with being bilingual, youŽll make more money.

Canadians are bilingual and Europeans know many languages, not just 2.


People in other countries learn English as a second language and they donŽt complain that much.
And they ask why Spanish...well Spanish is the 2nd most common language in the world!
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Old 08-30-2009, 01:19 AM
 
223 posts, read 747,279 times
Reputation: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schousse View Post
Because Spanish is the second most spoken language in the world.

No spanish is not the second most spoken language in the world. Maybe in the Northern or Western Hemisphere were their is so many spainsh speaking countries, but the rest of the world like Europe, Asia , Africa , Australia spainsh isn't spoke in all of those areas as well.

I heard the Chinese and Hindi languages are the second most spoken languages in the world.

It makes sense they have over a billion people in each of the 2 countries of India and China.

In my family another language is spoken besides English, but my family has enough respect for the U.S. and basic understanding that English is our national language. No one should need to learn to speak another language to cater to immgrants that are coming to the U.S. they adapt to us not we adapt to them. No country in the world would do this.

The spanish speaking people are the only people in the History of America who didn't have to learn English. Every other immgrant group did if they already did not speak English. Your just adding to the problem when you aspect we as Americans to learn Spanish. They should learn English!!!! Thats the least they can do after being able to come to the U.S. to start a better life!!!!!!!!

I voted for and support Obama and agree with most of his views but not this its not right!!!!!!

English is either the 1st or 2nd most spoken language in the World so learn that!!!!!

I heard that the Chinese and Hindi languages were the second most spoken languages in the world.

Since half of the world's population lives in the 2 countries of India and China both well over a billion people in population each it makes sense.

I don't know how many people speak spanish in Asia and Africa or India and China not many propbably!!!!

The World is not just North American , Caribbean , and South America their is so much more then just that!!!!!!

Last edited by Yac; 08-31-2009 at 05:44 AM.. Reason: 3 posts in a row merged
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Old 08-30-2009, 01:44 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,408,714 times
Reputation: 475
I agree that we should not cater to immigrants and learn their language. I do however, believe that we should not stick to one language, we should learn a second language to be more competitive with the world business and employment market. I would not mind if children in schools would learn Chinese or any other language.
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Old 08-30-2009, 02:02 AM
 
223 posts, read 747,279 times
Reputation: 141
The most widley spoken languages in the world:

1. Mandarin - 1 billion + speaks this language ( I believe this is a Chinese language, not sure )
2. English - 508 million speaks this language
3. Hindustani - 497 million speaks this language
4. Spanish - 392 million speaks this language


In my research I found spanish to be the 4th most widely spoken lanuage in the world.

www.soyouwanna.com type: Most widley spoken languages in the world into the search icon.

Maybe we should learn Mandarin 1 billion + speaks this language if I am right in thinking this is a Chinese language we should learn this language China is a World Leader in business and economy this could lead to more $ for the U.S. economy we are in a recession. Although business with China has its problems.

Last edited by lugger; 08-30-2009 at 02:13 AM..
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