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Old 07-12-2008, 01:01 AM
 
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America is built on the backs of the very those who it has discriminated and exploited. Sad but true.
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Old 07-12-2008, 06:16 AM
 
Location: US
3,070 posts, read 3,334,721 times
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Yes, America has been built on the backs of people like me--an American citizen who has worked extremely hard all my life, never taken a handout from the Government, supported and educated my children to be responsible, reasonable citizens, timely and appropriately paid my taxes. How in the world could you completely dismiss what I and millions of other Americans have LEGALLY done to contribute to and build America.

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Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
America is built on the backs of the very those who it has discriminated and exploited. Sad but true.
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Old 07-12-2008, 08:01 AM
 
Location: Florida
18,290 posts, read 18,527,133 times
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With the potential for very tough economic conditions coming in this country,there may be an adequate number of Americans to replace illegals.
Many might start to see those types of jobs as welcome.
Maybe Americans will realize that basic necessities doesn't include TV's, cell phones,microwavable dinners and a Christmas Club.
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Old 07-12-2008, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
With the potential for very tough economic conditions coming in this country,there may be an adequate number of Americans to replace illegals.
Many might start to see those types of jobs as welcome.
Maybe Americans will realize that basic necessities doesn't include TV's, cell phones,microwavable dinners and a Christmas Club.
I have to disagree about the cell phone part: not only are they very inexpensive these days-------try even finding a pay phone anymore.

Hell: even in dirt poor African countries that make Chiapas, Mexico look wealthy, cells are becoming quite popular and are effectively reshaping cultures there (mostly for the better IMHO).
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Old 07-12-2008, 10:59 AM
 
2,256 posts, read 2,962,422 times
Reputation: 1215
Quote:
Originally Posted by carolac View Post
Yes, America has been built on the backs of people like me--an American citizen who has worked extremely hard all my life, never taken a handout from the Government, supported and educated my children to be responsible, reasonable citizens, timely and appropriately paid my taxes. How in the world could you completely dismiss what I and millions of other Americans have LEGALLY done to contribute to and build America.
It has nothing to do with dismissing your contribution. But just remember that the present is always strongly tied to history. And that history is in many places stained with discrimination and bigotry.
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Old 07-12-2008, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,173,411 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
It has nothing to do with dismissing your contribution. But just remember that the present is always strongly tied to history. And that history is in many places stained with discrimination and bigotry.
That's history, kid. You can't un-ring a bell, and you can't push the 'white guilt' button with impunity anymore, either. I think MOST Americans realize that they didn't have anything to do with 'history', and that what we do GOING FORWARD will define what kind of people we really are.

Wallow in your guilt if you want to, I choose to see the world as it REALLY is...
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Old 07-12-2008, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
It has nothing to do with dismissing your contribution. But just remember that the present is always strongly tied to history. And that history is in many places stained with discrimination and bigotry.
Like my sharecropper ancestors in Orange, Va?

From what I can glean; despite being 'White', they lived on the wrong side of the tracks.

Does that mean I expect reparations from the Taliaferro's*, etc.? Of course not.

*Taliaferro was the name of an old Virginia WASP family whose ancestor, John, hailed from English. Apparently, his father or grandfather came from Italy originally hence the Latin sounding name.
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Old 07-12-2008, 12:18 PM
 
Location: Lake Norman, North Carolina
1,213 posts, read 1,397,397 times
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Originally Posted by Chef Giorgio View Post
I guess you do not know the highest cost to ANY company, especially here in the US, is labor! Why do you think when there is a company shake up, the first thing new management does is to lay people off!

This is what Phil Graham -and I am not a Republican- was referring to when he said we have become a nation of whiners. We just can not have it all. We must compromise sometimes in order to get what we ultimately want.

I.e., in SC recently a bill was presented to increase tougher sanctions against employers hiring illegal aliens. When interviewed, a produce farmer (a white man) complained that out of the 400 positions he needs to fill to do the work only 8 were US citizens, and the rest were aliens b/c it is extremely difficult to find citizens willing to perform such labor and with the kind of pay. If the bill is to pass, this farmer will likely go out of business, the produce he collects will then have to be most likely imported (from China or India), affecting the local economy needless to say, resulting in loss of jobs and tax revenue, and ultimately (esp with today's oil prices) it will cost more to the consumer, helping drive up inflation, etc, etc.
Well the bill did pass and mandatory e-verification was recently signed into law. If this particular farmer goes out of business, what, one farmer and 8 American citizens, and 392 illegal aliens are affected? That won't be too big of a hit on the economy. Did the farmer realize that he wouldn't be able to get much legal labor for the price he wanted to pay for that labor, before he planted his crops?

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We ALLOWED most of these people in, because of business reasons, and now we are being led to the impression these people are a virus to our society (much like the gay marriage thing in 2004). Why do you think then we enjoyed the prosperity of recent years, who do you think helped drive costs down for construction, tourism, food, etc. I'm not saying illegal immigration was the sole reason for it but it did play a part.
You or I didn't do ****. The scumbag Republican employers of illegals bought off the corrupt WH into not enforcing immigration laws. The scumbag Republican employers of illegals offered the illegal Mexican scabs jobs if they would come. The scumbag employers of illegals were the only ones profiting from the so called cheap illegal Mexican scab labor, which was SUBSIZIDED by the American taxpayers. You're not saying now that these illegal Mexicans scabs build American (bull****) and now deserve to stay? Did the scumbag Republican employers of illegals ever promise the illegal Mexican scabs that they could stay after the scumbag Republican employers of illegal were done with them?

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It is us that allowed the entrance of these people with total lack of control, b/c it was convenient (we payed a blind eye unwillingly), we stopped enforcing our borders, which is why a lot of bad elements did come our way, smugglers, drug dealers and so forth, all for the sake of business during both the Clinton and Bush administrations.
That does not mean all immigrants are rotten apples, all the opposite, these people are good savers, they typically -when they were allowed b/c most of these people can not even buy homes now- had a down payment for a house, as a matter of fact they have the lowest foreclosure ratio of ANY group, despite these people, b/c of their status had to pay rates worse than subprime loans at 9,10+%
Actually, it was the scumbag Republican employers of illegals that bought off the corrupt WH to allow the illegal Mexican scabs to flood into the US. These 20 plus million illegals have no status in the US and don'e deserve to be here. The most efficient method of removing them is the state's new trend in passing employers of illegals sanctions laws which requires employers to e-verify the legal status of employees. These laws produced mass exoduses of illegals from Arizona and Oklahoma. At little cost to the American taxpayers.

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Yes, we complain too much, we are even mad at these people for sending money to their families they left behind to work here as janitors here, when it is ourselves who have told them they can not buy a home here, neither a car or obtain a drivers license or insurance, yet it is ok for them to clean out toilets and pick our produce, and live in a ****hole with 20 more of them b/c in some places they can not even rent a decent place!
Sob story. If they don't want to clean toilets, pick produce, live in hellholes, why did they break in? Why are they still here? 80% of Americans don't want them here.

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I'm all in favor for tougher regulation and border control but in order to do so we must compromise, we need to address the problem of those already here, those who have behaved as good citizens and are even willing to pay hefty fines. Yes send all those bad apples back, all those with criminal records, gang members, etc, and start devicing ways to really enforce the borders, with innovation not an stupid wall, that has never worked! We can do better than that!
Rewarding those who broke into this country with your form of amnesty is absurd. Rewarding lawbreakers with your form of amnesty will only encourage new waves of illegal Mexican scabs breaking in, hoping to get your form of amnesty.

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Out of the 12+ million of illegal aliens living here, if we resolve the status of those who are proven to be assets to our towns, I'm pretty sure we can get a decent injection to our econmy if we allow them to come out of the shadows, buy cars, buy homes (gosh knows our housing markets desperately needs any kind of help). All done with prudence, and under a well collected and organized plan. No more of these awful improvisation we have been getting from Washington, from both parties.
Gosh. Another Calderon approved agenda. Mexico doesn't want these poverty reject Mexican nationals back, just their remittances. Arizona, Oklahoma, Mississippi, Georgia, Missouri, South Carolina are resolving the legal status of employees through employers of illegals sanction laws which require the employer to verify the legal status of employees. Just common sense. These laws result in mass exoduses of illegals from those states. Most just move to Mexifornia or Texico but some actually self deport back to their Mexican hellholes. Mexico is raising bloody hell about these Mexican rejects moving back to Mexico. Mexico dumped these poverty rejects on the US and doesn't want them back.
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