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Old 07-22-2008, 04:15 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,807,269 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzie02 View Post
What I am saying is that she doesn't consider herself black as it is defined by African-Americans. I am sure she is aware of her skin color. I myself never understood why does everyone have to have a label.
Apparently she doesn’t, and I’m sure she has her reasons. I agree, it would be nice if we had no labels at all. After all, we are all members of the “Human” race.
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Old 07-22-2008, 05:57 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
The one drop rule is so ridiculous. There are people who are 75% white, but the 25% black determines their race.

I have a female cousin who has absolutely no black features, and is married to a brown-skinned black man. She has been the recipient of some nasty looks when out with her husband because people assume they are an interracial couple. She told me sometimes she feels like wearing a sign stating she’s black.
And I have met White people with natural Afros and Nigerian/Ghanian facial features as well--------but with blond/red hair and blue eyes.

If going by DNA: which genes would be 'Black'-------or 'White' for that matter, rhetorically speaking.
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Old 07-22-2008, 09:30 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,993,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
For what purpose?

My 'anecdote' hits hard and is to the point-------as well as true.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c9/Villagralbel.jpg (broken link)
Family of Argentines (Hispanic under US law) who are clearly 'White'.

(Picture is in the public domain)
Judging by the culture they are embracing with the traditional dress, I would say these people have recent ties to immigrants from Germany(probably the patriarch in the middle).
And looking at the source of the picture, the picture is taken in a German settlement.
Kind of like a family of Mexicans who have immigrated to the United States hanging out in East LA.

Argentina is like the U.S. and Canada. A country largely of immigrants from Europe.
Mexico, El Salvador, Guatemala, etc etc, not as much.
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:07 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
The one drop rule is so ridiculous. There are people who are 75% white, but the 25% black determines their race.

I have a female cousin who has absolutely no black features, and is married to a brown-skinned black man. She has been the recipient of some nasty looks when out with her husband because people assume they are an interracial couple. She told me sometimes she feels like wearing a sign stating she’s black.
The one-drop rule is just how it is, but in a way it benefits the so-called black population which has great genetic diversity. I know of blacks who have Native-American, Asian, European and African ancestry -- the truest melting pot people there are.

In reality, no one is black, no one is white, we're all just shades of beiges and browns.

I think it's going to start to become less important because the government has become so ultra-politically correct that in the census, it's added many more classifications to attempt to specify all the various mixes which of course isn't possible.

It was easy when everyone was Caucasian, Oriental, or Negro. Now every separate ethnicity and ethnic mix are being turned into separate races and that's going to make categorization ridiculous and overly cumbersome.
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:15 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cousinsal View Post
The "hispanics" call themselves that, or "latinos" so they can be a special group to get special benefits. Look at "La Raza" and their promotion of illegal immigration for "hispanics - the race". It doesn't seem to matter where they came from.

"Special benefits" are for blacks only, because of America's history with slavery. Just because someone walks over the border and they're "hispanic" should not mean they get special benefits EVER. Even if they're legal. It's only for blacks. It's somehow become twisted and includes this group of "hispanics" who make sure they're known that way, and can therefore get special treatment. It is not MEANT that way. It was NEVER meant that way.

It has nothing to do with being a "special group" - it has to do with blacks and our history in America.

Yes -- how special it is to be a very wealthy blue-eyed blond Latino aristocrat and still be able to receive free college and all the affirmative action handouts.

La Raza of course promotes this, because how great it is to come from a privileged background, get into the USA and benefit by quotas because a region of the USA that once consisted of only black and white Americans somehow doesn't have enough "hispanic" bank presidents or school administrators. No matter that there was never any historic discrimination against hispanics, they believe they are entitled to show up and be given quotas to get them even immediately.

At least black Americans have a logical reason for affirmative action and quotas. There really was a history of slavery and institutionalized racism that their ancestors endured.
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Old 07-23-2008, 02:06 AM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,993,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Yes -- how special it is to be a very wealthy blue-eyed blond Latino aristocrat and still be able to receive free college and all the affirmative action handouts.

La Raza of course promotes this, because how great it is to come from a privileged background, get into the USA and benefit by quotas because a region of the USA that once consisted of only black and white Americans somehow doesn't have enough "hispanic" bank presidents or school administrators. No matter that there was never any historic discrimination against hispanics, they believe they are entitled to show up and be given quotas to get them even immediately.

At least black Americans have a logical reason for affirmative action and quotas. There really was a history of slavery and institutionalized racism that their ancestors endured.
So ignore traditionally discriminated Mexican-Americans because of the TINY rich white minority in Mexico. Yeah, thats really fair. I guess the rest don't count.

After all, everybody got treated great in the past in America except for the African-Americans.
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Old 07-23-2008, 05:55 AM
 
3,368 posts, read 10,272,188 times
Reputation: 1675
AMC, this is one point on which we strongly disagree. My proposed ideas for affirmative action (in order of my preference) are to:

a) offer it to people of low-income backgrounds, regardless of race or ethnicity

b) abolish it completely

c) offer it to ONLY African-Americans, but since that would be hard to enforce, in practice it would have to be offered to all black people.

It would not be offered to the Jews, the Irish, the Italians, the "brown" Mexicans, or the Japanese - all of which have been the recipients of discrimination in this country over the last 100 years. This is not to say that I don't recognize that there has been discrimination - I do recognize that - it's just that at some point you have to draw the line at who receives affirmative action and I believe that it is intended primarily: 1) for the economically disadvantaged (which corresponds with race) and 2) for African-Americans.

Note: a full 46% of Hispanics in the United States self identify as "white." That certainly isn't a tiny minority; in fact, it is a plurality because the next highest response was "other" (mainly chosen by mestizo Mexicans and Mexican-Americans) and the third highest response was "black."
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:24 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,993,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
AMC, this is one point on which we strongly disagree. My proposed ideas for affirmative action (in order of my preference) are to:

a) offer it to people of low-income backgrounds, regardless of race or ethnicity

b) abolish it completely

c) offer it to ONLY African-Americans, but since that would be hard to enforce, in practice it would have to be offered to all black people.

It would not be offered to the Jews, the Irish, the Italians, the "brown" Mexicans, or the Japanese - all of which have been the recipients of discrimination in this country over the last 100 years. This is not to say that I don't recognize that there has been discrimination - I do recognize that - it's just that at some point you have to draw the line at who receives affirmative action and I believe that it is intended primarily: 1) for the economically disadvantaged (which corresponds with race) and 2) for African-Americans.

Note: a full 46% of Hispanics in the United States self identify as "white." That certainly isn't a tiny minority; in fact, it is a plurality because the next highest response was "other" (mainly chosen by mestizo Mexicans and Mexican-Americans) and the third highest response was "black."
Regardless of how they see themselves, something I learned from you was the different experiences among Latino groups. You told me some things that I wasn't aware of in Miami and places where there are lots of Cubans.

But I know about Mexican-Americans in California. I remember you expressing some disbelief at the Latino community having a drug or poverty problem, and I'm guessing that is a big difference between here and there.

I think it's safe to say that the majority of people living in poverty in places like California will be Latino. And its been like that a long time. Affirmative Action only being applied to Black people isn't going to do much in cities like Los Angeles where there are hardly any Black people.
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:40 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
If we are going to have 'Affirmative Action' based of so-called ethnicity: what will be the test-----------the color of said individual's skin?

If using darker skin as the requirement---------many Anglo Whites would qualify as well for AA.

In other words: AA needs to be illegal if race/ethnicity is the only criterion-------otherwise it would be racial discrimination which is against the law.
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Old 07-23-2008, 06:09 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 851,493 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronK View Post
Quite a few Argentinians come into my club to workout here in Illinois. They all look like white people, so I was surprised when this one couple was speaking Spanish. One woman had brown hair, other blonde.
Argentina is the whitest country in the world. It would be politically incorrect to have Hispanic as a race because most Hispanics have European and Amerindian ancestors, and in some cases African ancestors. Yet La Raza groups have a strong favor to characterize Mexicans as their own race.
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