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Old 09-05-2008, 01:26 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,044,409 times
Reputation: 17688

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
If you look at the statistics, rape is a clear dominance over someone. Not by the way they dress.

The scenerio is exactly the same. You should be allowed to live without locking your doors and windows. You should also be able to wear a skirt if a woman would like.

To say that it is the sole responsibility of the person who was taken advantage of is completely unjust. How would either scenerio leave the criminal off the hook for any crime?
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Old 09-05-2008, 01:28 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 852,101 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
The scenerio is exactly the same. You should be allowed to live without locking your doors and windows. You should also be able to wear a skirt if a woman would like.

To say that it is the sole responsibility of the person is completely unjust.
Are you telling me the four elderly women who were raped in a care home were done so because they were "Sexy"?
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Old 09-05-2008, 01:31 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,050 posts, read 21,163,651 times
Reputation: 22525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
Are you telling me the four elderly women who were raped in a care home were done so because they were "Sexy"?
Yes, that's exactly what he said, didn't you taxpayer? I saw you use those exact words!!! Four elderly raped women - sexy - care home - it was all right there...I hope everyone else can see that.

/sarcasm off/
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:06 PM
 
Location: CO
1,599 posts, read 3,006,263 times
Reputation: 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontH8Me View Post
I just read that he has family in Mexico - gee, who would have thought? Maybe he should have taken part in my recent poll.
It's actually my wife's family. They live right outside of Mexico City and aren't poor, but they are struggling due to the rough economy. They have no desire to come to America really. The are happy where they're at and will stick it out, like much of Mexico's middle class. It's typically the desperate poor class that cross the border illegally.

Having visited her family a number of times it's easy to get a sense of what the economy is like and what the conditions are like for the poverty-stricken. And it's not difficult to see why some will risk so much to cross the border for a better life.
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:10 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,050 posts, read 21,163,651 times
Reputation: 22525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludachris View Post
It's actually my wife's family. They live right outside of Mexico City and aren't poor, but they are struggling due to the rough economy. They have no desire to come to America really. The are happy where they're at and will stick it out, like much of Mexico's middle class. It's typically the desperate poor class that cross the border illegally.

Having visited her family a number of times it's easy to get a sense of what the economy is like and what the conditions are like for the poverty-stricken. And it's not difficult to see why some will risk so much to cross the border for a better life.
Because it's easier to move into the neighbor's house than fixing my own?
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:12 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 852,101 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontH8Me View Post
Because it's easier to move into the neighbor's house than fixing my own?
"Hey my rights aren't being heard here.. I'm going to practice my religion elsewhere. I'll get on the mayflower and go to the United States! It's much easier than demanding rights in this country!!"
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:15 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,050 posts, read 21,163,651 times
Reputation: 22525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
"Hey my rights aren't being heard here.. I'm going to practice my religion elsewhere. I'll get on the mayflower and go to the United States! It's much easier than demanding rights in this country!!"
Oh, I'm sorry, I forgot you live in the world where two wrongs = right. Right on Calfirnio!!!
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:23 PM
 
Location: CO
1,599 posts, read 3,006,263 times
Reputation: 488
You see, that's where I have to question things... yes, crossing the border illegally is just that - illegal. But you can't just look at it in black and white, there is some gray area. You have to consider the level of the crime and the circumstances surrounding the situation, do you not? What is the severity of the crime and how much is it really hurting others? I've heard people say that it's costing billions and I've heard others say it's not costing us as much as we think. Who should we listen to?

I mean seriously, just because I brought up an unpopular viewpoint look how people are referring to me in their replies. I'm being talked down to. Since I said I had family in Mexico, some assumed I'm Mexican and am part of "them". Yet I'm white. My wife is a US citizen born in Mexico and came here legally. Look at the hostility here.

Everyone is responsible for their own actions. I'm not saying the illegal immigrants shouldn't bear some responsibility here, but the thing is, many of them have two choices - endure unbelievable hardships in the rural parts of Mexico or risk coming here to work and support their family. So yes, they're breaking a law, but in their minds, they're doing what they have to do to survive without doing something morally wrong (like committing theft).
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:30 PM
 
Location: CO
1,599 posts, read 3,006,263 times
Reputation: 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by DontH8Me View Post
Because it's easier to move into the neighbor's house than fixing my own?
It's not that it's easier, it's just not a viable option. If they had the means or the time to fix the economy themselves (the socially poor) they probably would. If you couldn't grow food in the desert, wouldn't you move to where the water is and ask for forgiveness later if it meant survival?

And that's what it comes down to for most who cross illegally - survival. What would you do to feed your family? I know I'd take some huge risks to feed my daughter and keep her healthy. It's still a human issue.
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Old 09-05-2008, 04:37 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,050 posts, read 21,163,651 times
Reputation: 22525
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludachris View Post
You see, that's where I have to question things... yes, crossing the border illegally is just that - illegal. But you can't just look at it in black and white, there is some gray area. You have to consider the level of the crime and the circumstances surrounding the situation, do you not? What is the severity of the crime and how much is it really hurting others? I've heard people say that it's costing billions and I've heard others say it's not costing us as much as we think. Who should we listen to?

The severity of the crime? How much is it hurting others? Consider surrounding circumstances? All subjective hooey.

I mean seriously, just because I brought up an unpopular viewpoint look how people are referring to me in their replies. I'm being talked down to. Since I said I had family in Mexico, some assumed I'm Mexican and am part of "them". Yet I'm white. My wife is a US citizen born in Mexico and came here legally. Look at the hostility here.

Who talked down to you? Who called you a Mexican? Who is hostile about you or your wife? Seems like you're perceiving a lot of slights that never happened.

Everyone is responsible for their own actions. I'm not saying the illegal immigrants shouldn't bear some responsibility here, but the thing is, many of them have two choices - endure unbelievable hardships in the rural parts of Mexico or risk coming here to work and support their family. So yes, they're breaking a law, but in their minds, they're doing what they have to do to survive without doing something morally wrong (like committing theft).
What makes them special and gives them special privileges in taking advantage of our nation vs. the billions of truly impoverished throughout the world? Did you know Mexico ranks in the top among all other countries in the world for obesity? Do you know of anyone starving to death in Mexico? Who really cares what is going on in the mind of people who are coming here illegally? Again - the fact that you are inserting morals and subjectivity into this makes for a truly weak stance in this debate. They are committing theft the moment they cross the border, whether or not their "morals" tell them they are doing nothing wrong.
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