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View Poll Results: Should we create a sub-forum for immigration issues?
Yes 40 66.67%
No 18 30.00%
Other (explain in the thread) 2 3.33%
Voters: 60. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-01-2007, 05:53 AM
 
1,868 posts, read 5,146,446 times
Reputation: 525

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Administrator View Post
Should we create a sub-forum for immigration issues? This poll will be open for 48 hours.
Might as well......maybe so many posts and threads won't have to be closed!!!
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Old 02-01-2007, 06:34 AM
 
Location: Bay Area, CA
28,265 posts, read 43,591,695 times
Reputation: 18805
Quote:
Originally Posted by fastfilm View Post
Please don't be fooled by an obvious ploy to marginalize and isolate an issue of specific importance to specific areas of the U.S.

NO for the following reasons. First the "compassionate" one: I am somewhat excerpting a quote by the Assembly Majority leader here in Calif., Ms. Bass. Although it was describing another regional population, it's a nicer way of putting things overall : "I'm certain that many of my colleagues are not aware of the status...If you live in a community where you do not live side by side with this...population, why would you be aware?"

Which leads us to the second one. If the moderators were to excise wholly and censor all references to illegal immigration in the Los Angeles forum for instance, you would be promoting a massive disservice to all relocators eyeing this site. My city is ground zero for illegal immigration (300 illegals moving to L.A. per day), with a worst case scenario groundswell of domino effects, from overtaxing citizens to pay for services for all those illegals, to the closing of emergency centers flooded with illegals (E.R.'s cannot shun patients here, so illegals use E.R.s for all medical complaints no matter trivial or not.) You don't live "side by side" with them, and I do. I know exactly what the consequences of unrestrained illegal immigration can be in terms of lowering the quality of life issues for all populations around them in a city.
I do live side by side with them - literally - but still don't get that riled up about it. And I don't think the mods are trying to eliminate the subject, they're just responding to other poster's annoyance with it's domination of the political boards. I try to avoid them, but even the most unrelated topic steers in that direction... it gets irritating after a while, when I'm just looking for a healthy political (non-immigration) debate.
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Old 02-01-2007, 06:40 AM
 
10 posts, read 40,551 times
Reputation: 18
Yes, It's a very good idea.
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Old 02-01-2007, 07:02 AM
 
504 posts, read 1,621,338 times
Reputation: 330
I too live side by side with legal and illegal or as they tell me they do not have papers. I like them, their sense of humor, their efforts at speaking English to me and mine at trying to speak Spanish is funny and their hard work. I have not seen the hospitals run over with them, or lots of food stamp users in the grocery store or lying around collecting welfare. I see them a lot on construction sites, road workers, home modeling, in different restaurant's early Saturday mornings at yard sales buying clothes and furnishings. I do know churches offer their help out in the county, but migrant workers have always been a necessity in Florida. I think in ways a separate forum would be good, but then I think more and new people would post with different ideas and opinions in different areas. I think we would wind up with one forum full of hate and ignorance.
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Old 02-01-2007, 07:25 AM
 
Location: on an island
13,374 posts, read 40,227,893 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexander59 View Post
I think we would wind up with one forum full of hate and ignorance.
I know what you mean...but right now that is sort of what's happening already.

Perhaps in a new subforum it would become easier to sift the wheat from the chaff?
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Old 02-01-2007, 08:40 AM
j33
 
4,625 posts, read 12,655,738 times
Reputation: 1650
I've lived by loads of illegal and legal aliens (I was never quite sure of the status of the Polish construction worker who lived upstairs in one apartment complex, but he was a nice guy and always held the door for me and said hello, but didn't speak a lick of English), I guess my experiences in a part of the country that attracts laborer from Eastern Europe as well as South America, I don't automatically associate "illegal alien" with spanish speaking (oh, and I knew some illegal Australian aliens awhile back, four metalheads with a wicked sense of humor, living in an apartment across the hall, doing odd jobs for money under the table).

One of the things that depresses me about the discussions of this issue is the pure unbridled hatred that seems to seep through the screen of my computer. Debating political issues is good, reading that crap is not.
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Old 02-01-2007, 08:55 AM
 
504 posts, read 1,621,338 times
Reputation: 330
I didn't mean that all non documented workers are Latino, but that seems to be who people complain about the most or all. I know lots of Arabs that are in Tampa illegally and boy did they disappear after 9/11 and of course from other countries, JCC how are you going to vote?
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Old 02-01-2007, 09:27 AM
 
11,599 posts, read 17,571,997 times
Reputation: 17335
This and the typical "Bush lied, why are we in Iraq" threads are clogging up the forum. At the same time not alot of original, complex, thought provoking political subjects are not being debated.

The immigration debate brings on the same posts from the same people, the Iraq debate brings on about 4 pages of barely coherent "bush hate" posts before it gets into some legitimate debatable content.

I say no forum. Instead the moderators need to exercise some tough love - delete threads outright, everything, even if it is 2 pages long when you get to it. Refer to an ongoing thread about the same subject. Trust me - people will live and learn.
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Old 02-01-2007, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Northeast
1,298 posts, read 2,368,818 times
Reputation: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
This and the typical "Bush lied, why are we in Iraq" threads are clogging up the forum. At the same time not alot of original, complex, thought provoking political subjects are not being debated.

The immigration debate brings on the same posts from the same people, the Iraq debate brings on about 4 pages of barely coherent "bush hate" posts before it gets into some legitimate debatable content.

I say no forum. Instead the moderators need to exercise some tough love - delete threads outright, everything, even if it is 2 pages long when you get to it. Refer to an ongoing thread about the same subject. Trust me - people will live and learn.
Yeah but keep in mind "Bush hate" encompasses a lot, lol. Every day we're given new and improved reasons to hate Bush. So as long as we're discussing those new reasons I don't see a problem. Even though most times concerns are met with "at least he's not cheating on his wife with a chubby intern", lol. THAT part is repititious.

-TT
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Old 02-01-2007, 09:45 AM
 
11,599 posts, read 17,571,997 times
Reputation: 17335
Quote:
Originally Posted by YapCity View Post
Yeah but keep in mind "Bush hate" encompasses a lot, lol. Every day we're given new and improved reasons to hate Bush. So as long as we're discussing those new reasons I don't see a problem. Even though most times concerns are met with "at least he's not cheating on his wife with a chubby intern", lol. THAT part is repititious.

-TT
And that's OK, but they encompass different subjects - social security, national debt, FEMA...sure he's fair game.

But I can't tell you how many threads start of with "why are we in Iraq, Bush started this war", very simplistic and generic posts. Now if there was a new spin like - "is Iran contributing to chaos in Iraq or is this Bush propoganda" then that would be a fresh face on it.
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