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Old 08-29-2008, 10:26 PM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,173,806 times
Reputation: 391

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Quote:
Originally Posted by sergeyn View Post
I think that mass illegal immigration is a serious problem for America and I want it to stop as much as most other rational-thinking Americans. I am keenly aware of the problems that a large presence of unassimilated and virtually illiterate people inevitable poses for my country.

Nevertheless, I am astonished at the blanket hatred that most posters here seem to exhibit towards all illegals. Case in point-- mixed families, where one member (or more) is an American citizen.

I am very opinionated about the issue of "mixed" families because I am married to a foreigner myself. We did it the right way, went through all the paperwork to bring her here and are now going through more of it to get her permanent residence. And I'll tell you what-- even doing it right is a nerve-wrecking process that requires a lot of (often ridiculous) paperwork and a lot of opportunities to make a mistake and face a long delay. When you realize that your love and your family, the most important things in your life, depend on a byzantine set of rules and procedures, you can't help but feel powerless. Why is it that the Government makes me jump through hoops to be with the one I love, why can't it just accept and respect the choice of a citizen whom it supposedly serves?

It is crystal clear-- forcing a husband to be away from a wife or a child away from a parent is a terrible punishment that cannot be justified easily. Taking the ones you love away from you is about the worst that the Government can do to you. And if you are an American citizen your rights are being violated about as badly as they possibly can be by your own government-- isn't there something wrong here? How is the government serving its own citizens when it takes their spouses, children or parents and sends them far away?

I find it simply sick how people react to a news story about, for instance, an American citizen's "illegal" wife being deported or a Mom being sent away from her "anchor" child who hasn't seen anything but the US in their entire life. I sense a kind of sadistic jubilation here upon hearing that a family like that gets torn apart. The fine assembly of posters in this subforum seems to derive pleasure from suffering of others. When someone (their fellow American, I might add!) sobs in desperation and hopelessness, they're having a good day.
Back on topic, let me say first of all that I'm glad you found your heart's desire and married the woman of your dreams. I did that myself, several years ago, and it wasn't until the 3 years later that that I found out she was a convicted felon with an outstanding warrant for her arrest.

When they grabbed her they separated our son from his mother, a very traumatic experience for him, and carted her off to a Federal penitentiary several states extant from our place of residence.

Should I blame a 'broken' criminal justice system for our troubles, or does the fault lie solely with my ex-(thankfully)wife?

What say you, amnesty lovers?
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Old 08-29-2008, 11:51 PM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,699,632 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
Of course! Like Malamute said, "If they speak no English and dress like a Mexican, they're probably illegal". I guess that day worker looking guy who had a big accent at the DMV office this morning trying to renew his license was illegal too!
Most likey he was. Illegals get drivers licenses. Not in every state but in many, and they will commit document fraud to get them in other states.

I sure don't assume that the hispanic who speaks unaccented English and dresses like an American is an illegal.

Still -- since it's estimated that over half the hispanics residing in the USA are here illegally -- a toss of the coin will get it right at least half the time.
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Old 08-29-2008, 11:54 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 851,725 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Most likey he was. Illegals get drivers licenses. Not in every state but in many, and they will commit document fraud to get them in other states.

I sure don't assume that the hispanic who speaks unaccented English and dresses like an American is an illegal.

Still -- since it's estimated that over half the hispanics residing in the USA are here illegally -- a toss of the coin will get it right at least half the time.

Not in California, I know it is possible to obtain licenses in Washington. But not in California. Estimated? Estimated by who? ImmigrationWatch Dog? Give be a break! Pew Hispanic center has said its roughly 12 million. Its a number that no one can agree on, but I think PHC's research is much more thorough than the immigrationwatch dog.
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Old 08-30-2008, 07:01 AM
 
Location: Arizona
2,065 posts, read 3,173,806 times
Reputation: 391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
Not in California, I know it is possible to obtain licenses in Washington. But not in California. Estimated? Estimated by who? ImmigrationWatch Dog? Give be a break! Pew Hispanic center has said its roughly 12 million. Its a number that no one can agree on, but I think PHC's research is much more thorough than the immigrationwatch dog.
They've been saying 12 million for the last 5 years. Are you trying to say that NO illegals have crossed the border in that time?
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Old 08-30-2008, 07:26 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Most likey he was. Illegals get drivers licenses. Not in every state but in many, and they will commit document fraud to get them in other states.

I sure don't assume that the hispanic who speaks unaccented English and dresses like an American is an illegal.

Still -- since it's estimated that over half the hispanics residing in the USA are here illegally -- a toss of the coin will get it right at least half the time.
And for irony; about 25 year ago I knew of a Mexican woman who admitted that she never got stopped/profiled by the police (Los Angeles)..........perfect American English, German surname and was obviously racially White--------as for her legal status, I was not sure.
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Old 08-30-2008, 09:40 AM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,687,743 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by sergeyn View Post
Irrelevant.

I'm talking about the case of *Americans* being *forecefully* separated from their loved ones by the *American government*. For no morally justifiable reason.
Ever hear of a little karmic law called consequences? You know, the ramifications which are the direct result of an action, whether voluntary or involutary....

If I am not paying attention to where I am going and I walk into a table, chances are, I will be left with a nasty bruise on my leg. Now, were those the consequences I was looking for when I crossed the room? Not likely, but the bruise was the involuntary result of crossing the room without paying attention.

Let's say that I am not happy with my lot in life. I want more. My family wants more. But in order to increase my fortunes, I have decided to break into your house, steal your possessions and help myself to your bank account, credit cards, and anything else I believe will improve the life of my family. This is a voluntary decision on my part. I could most definitely find a legal method of improving my standing in life, but I choose to break the law. If I am caught, I WILL go to prison. Am I then going to cry to the media about how unfair it is that I am going to prison as a result of my illegal actions? After all, I will be separated from my children. My family will be broken up.

Surely if you can justify the unlawful actions of illegal immigrants--adults who knew full well that coming into this country, whether to work, take advantage of the misinterpreted Fourteenth Amendment, live off of American taxpayers, whatever the reason--then you can justify my actions in breaking into your home and stealing your property.

But let's be realistic here. You cannot justify breaking the law, especially by grown men and women who are fully aware that should they be caught, there will be consequences and those consequences will likely be deportation and incarceration. Yet, not only are they willing to subject themselves to the likelihood of these consequences, they then bring children into the equation, making them by proxy, ancillary to their crime and thus subject to whatever consequences the actions of their parents have wrought.

This reminds me of Anne Bonny and Mary Reed, who were both tried for piracy in 1725. They both "pled their bellies" in order to avoid or postpone the consequences of their unlawful behavior, yet another example of using children to avoid the repercussions which naturally follow any actions.

My heart goes out to the children who are caught up in this situation. They are, above all, innocent in this situation. But their parents are guilty. They are guilty of flaunting and disobeying the sovereign law of the United States of America. Should they then be rewarded simply because they have brought children into the situation? If that is indeed the case, then each and every lawbreaker in this country who has children at home should be immediately pardoned, released from prison, and given all possible assistance by our government and those beneficent organizations which scream for rights for illegal aliens, to assimilate back into American society.

Last edited by Kele; 08-30-2008 at 09:51 AM..
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Old 08-30-2008, 09:44 AM
 
Location: State of Being
35,885 posts, read 65,253,264 times
Reputation: 22270
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
Back on topic, let me say first of all that I'm glad you found your heart's desire and married the woman of your dreams. I did that myself, several years ago, and it wasn't until the 3 years later that that I found out she was a convicted felon with an outstanding warrant for her arrest.

When they grabbed her they separated our son from his mother, a very traumatic experience for him, and carted her off to a Federal penitentiary several states extant from our place of residence.

Should I blame a 'broken' criminal justice system for our troubles, or does the fault lie solely with my ex-(thankfully)wife?

What say you, amnesty lovers?
Dern, Guy. That is a helluva story and the sad thing is . . . it could have been any of us. It is easier these days to do a background check on people we get involved with but still . . . most people DON'T.

You make a helluva good point. And I totally agree w/ what you are saying. There is no difference. Break the law, reap the consequences. Yes, it sucks that others may feel the repercussions . . . but still . . . do the crime, do the time. Sad, but this is how the world (the whole world, not just the USA!) works.

And again - sorry you (and your child) had to endure such a horrific situation.
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Old 08-30-2008, 01:39 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17687
And I want to add that we should be sticking it to the businesses that are repeat offenders. Working for someone that is breaking the law too is double jeopardy.

That is why when I read these pro-illegals stance that we are putting up help wanted signs sending the wrong msg to Illegals. BS, they know it's illegal to work for a Company using stolen SS# and false documents.
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Old 08-30-2008, 01:49 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 851,725 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyPinestra View Post
They've been saying 12 million for the last 5 years. Are you trying to say that NO illegals have crossed the border in that time?
Actually that figure stands from 2005. And nothing has been reported until then, but obviously there must be a little more. But I highly doubt its the 35 million you say there are.
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Old 08-30-2008, 02:16 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17687
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
Actually that figure stands from 2005. And nothing has been reported until then, but obviously there must be a little more. But I highly doubt its the 35 million you say there are.
What do you think is an ok number?
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