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Old 09-09-2008, 06:29 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,994,570 times
Reputation: 332

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I may engage in heated debates on occasion, but you have never seen me attack with a racial slur. Californio admitted to being a racist, albeit not a “practicing” racist. He was simply being himself. His comments were indeed intended to insult. However, you are certainly entitled to your opinion.
He was trying to talk about preconceived notions EVERYBODY holds in them. He just phrased it VERY badly, and gave you guys ammo. Instead of actually engaging in discussion, and looking at the things that are being said on here that are generalizations and stereotypes, you just took it in the literal sense and attacked him on it.

You don't have to go around calling people we_tbacks and sp_ics to come off as being anti-Latino.

Its very clear many on here are using immigration poltics to shake off "political correctness" and target a people and culture you guys despise.
And you guys have insinuated a lot more than Mexicans liking tacos.
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Old 09-09-2008, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,809,199 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
He was trying to talk about preconceived notions EVERYBODY holds in them. He just phrased it VERY badly, and gave you guys ammo. Instead of actually engaging in discussion, and looking at the things that are being said on here that are generalizations and stereotypes, you just took it in the literal sense and attacked him on it.

You don't have to go around calling people we_tbacks and sp_ics to come off as being anti-Latino.

Its very clear many on here are using immigration poltics to shake off "political correctness" and target a people and culture you guys despise.
And you guys have insinuated a lot more than Mexicans liking tacos.
I have never 'sugar-coated' my contempt for illegals. However, you have NEVER heard me state that I hate anyone other than pedophiles. I have denied having anti-Hispanic feelings ad nauseam, and frankly I'm tired of responding to baseless accusations. Believe what you choose.
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Old 09-09-2008, 07:45 PM
 
307 posts, read 458,164 times
Reputation: 111
Default Why Fried Chicken

Please note I am not trying to offend anyone here, but to educate some who do not understand why what Californio said is considered VERY offensive by many.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
He misunderstood your statement, and said "how would YOU like it if.." etc etc.
First off Californio did NOT say "how would YOU like it if..".

He said...

Quote:
Why because I'm Mexican?! I'm sure you're a fried chicken connoisseur. Do you have any secret recipes?
To many that is just one step short of saying "I'm sure you're a "N-Word". Do you know how to shine shoes?". He said this quite obviously knowing what it meant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
Whats so offensive over the fried chicken thing?
Fried Chicken has a long history of being associate with Racist Portrayals of American Blacks. It was quite common up through the 1950's to portray Blacks as VERY monkey like, sub-human, with huge lips and loving their fried chicken. Because of this many blacks take references to fried chicken to be a veiled or not so veiled racist comments.

Click here to see a Racist example from a chain of restaurants.


Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
Thats like saying Mexicans like tacos. Its true. So what?
#1 If I refer to a particular group as liking a particular food, "Mexicans sure like Tacos", few are likely to see this as offensive. First off, "Tacos" doesn't carry 1/100th the baggage that "Fried Chicken" does for Blacks. Second it is a general culinary statement and is not necesarily meant to offend.

#2 If I say "Them damn Taco Eaters are invading our country and killing our citizens" That is likely to be found offensive by far more people, but it may or may not get me banned.

#3 If however I said to one of our members, GuyPinestra for example, "Now listen here you little Taco Eater". That would be totally unacceptable, And I would expect to be kicked off. I have taken it from a #1 a Culinary discussion to #2 A tasteless, but general discussion to #3 a direct name calling of a member.

That I am guessing is where Californio crossed the line.

Random

Last edited by RandomU; 09-09-2008 at 08:07 PM..
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Old 09-09-2008, 08:07 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Side note re: 'fried chicken'--------------I loove that dish and I am not even Black. In fact: I would probably eat fried chicken every day if I had my druthers.

Too I enjoy a good carne asada burrito.

Now: if we are going to discuss the food that my recent ancestors ate----------------YUCK!
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Old 09-09-2008, 08:10 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,994,570 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomU View Post
Please note I am not trying to offend anyone here, but to educate some who do not understand why what Californio said is considered VERY offensive by many.


Quote:
First off, "Tacos" doesn't carry 1/100th the baggage that "Fried Chicken" does for Blacks.

Classic, LOL. Double standard. How do you know what offends Latinos, if youre not Latino?

Youre basically saying things you can, and cant say by some unspoken law of whats agreed to be offensive.
I get very offended when I see videos of Minutemen calling an anti-protester a we_tback, but it doesnt matter. I get told, "Oh thats really not offensive."
Oh..I thought I was offended..but I guess I mightve been wrong. Oh well!

Californio didn't exactly say "How would you like it if..", but I was paraphrasing.
Youre taking it out context. He replied a little too quick, and probably took it the wrong way, but he didnt yell slurs at Benicar. He was bascially telling her he took it in a bad way, and gave her an example of how he took it.

Even then, I still don't understand the big deal over Blacks and fried chicken, or Mexicans eating tacos for that matter. Theyre both true!
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Old 09-09-2008, 08:52 PM
 
307 posts, read 458,164 times
Reputation: 111
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
Classic, LOL. Double standard. How do you know what offends Latinos, if youre not Latino?
I didn't say it didn't offend Latinos. I said it doesn't carry the same baggage, and from everything I have seen here in America, it doesn't.

Feel free to show me institutionalized Racism against Mexicans using a Taco caricature like the one I showed for Blacks. This went on for over 100 years after blacks were freed as slaves.

Click here to see a Racist example from a chain of restaurants.

Show me the cartoons from the 30s to the 50's, shown to and laughed at by main stream America, with Mexicans looking like subhuman monkeys eating and steling tacos and portrayed as having NO redeeming value.

Jungle Jitters (1938) - IMDb user comments

Show me the MAIN STREAM children’s shows like "Little Rascals" with a Mexican character loving his "Tacos and Flaun". Sorry it didn't happen. There was, surprise surprise, a black child who loved his "Watermelon and Fried Chicken".

Quote:
This is true, however, the Black characters were often buffoons in racially stereotypical ways. They spoke in dialect -- dis, dat, I is, you is, and we is. Farina, arguably the most famous picaninny of the 1920s, was on more than one occasion shown savagely eating watermelon or chicken.
The Picaninny Caricature

Please educate me as to the 100+ years of "The Racist Connection between Mexicans and Taco " within the MAIN STREAM AMERICA that approaches that perpetrated upon Blacks.

Random

Last edited by RandomU; 09-09-2008 at 09:03 PM..
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:05 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Frito Bandito

That was a stereotype against Mexicans.
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:14 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,994,570 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandomU View Post
I didn't say it didn't offend Latinos. I said it doesn't carry the same baggage, and from everything I have seen here in America, it doesn't.

Feel free to show me institutionalized Racism against Mexicans using a Taco caricature like the one I showed for Blacks. This went on for over 100 years after blacks were freed as slaves.

Click here to see a Racist example from a chain of restaurants.

Show me the cartoons from the 30s to the 50's, shown to and laughed at by main stream America, with Mexicans looking like subhuman monkeys eating and steling tacos and portrayed as having NO redeeming value.

Jungle Jitters (1938) - IMDb user comments

Show me the MAIN STREAM children’s shows like "Little Rascals" with a Mexican character loving his "Tacos and Flaun". Sorry it didn't happen. There was, surprise surprise, a black child who loved his "Watermelon and Fried Chicken".


The Picaninny Caricature

Please educate me as to the 100+ years of "The Racist Connection between Mexicans and Taco " within the MAIN STREAM AMERICA that approaches that perpetrated upon Blacks.

Random
I know youre probably being the apologetic white dude right now, and thats cool.
But I dont think suggesting a black person eats fried chicken is automatically a picaninny caricature

And I never said Mexicans and tacos have this huge stigma to them (we don't care!), but I am saying its the same as Blacks and fried chicken.
Fried chicken is a big part of African-American cuisine(Soul Food).


All in all, I don't think Californio meant it as a racist attack. He thought she was saying something else, and he probably saw it as hypocrisy, and pointed out why he thought that was hyporcritical by using an example she might understand.
Even though he was probably wrong.
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Old 09-09-2008, 09:18 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,994,570 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Frito Bandito

That was a stereotype against Mexicans.
I dont even see that as offensive.
Of course, back then(and today!) a lot of Americans didnt think very highly of Mexicans, and even back then there was that stereotype of "bandito" criminal Mexicans who spent all day drinking and having siestas and robbing folks, but as far as I know, a lot of Chicanos and Mexicans don't make a fuss over stuff like that.

But then again, the stuff wasn't as common or mean spirited as you saw for the Blacks. I think the mainstream America really had it out for the Blacks more than anybody back then.
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Old 09-09-2008, 10:36 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
I dont even see that as offensive.
Of course, back then(and today!) a lot of Americans didnt think very highly of Mexicans, and even back then there was that stereotype of "bandito" criminal Mexicans who spent all day drinking and having siestas and robbing folks, but as far as I know, a lot of Chicanos and Mexicans don't make a fuss over stuff like that.

But then again, the stuff wasn't as common or mean spirited as you saw for the Blacks. I think the mainstream America really had it out for the Blacks more than anybody back then.
I catch your drift.

Remember too I am old enough to remember the Frito Bandito and we in the Wash DC area perceived him as just another 'White boy' who got razzed-----------much like (Americans of) Irish, Italian, Polish, or any other 'Caucasian' heritage..
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