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Old 09-06-2008, 04:34 PM
 
Location: CO
1,599 posts, read 3,008,641 times
Reputation: 488

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Then the Mexicans have to fight for their rights SOB.

Again; we owe them nothing.
Sure, I agree they have to fight for their rights. But do you disagree that it will continue to impact us until change is brought about over there - thus, making it our problem?
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Old 09-06-2008, 04:45 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,042,756 times
Reputation: 2873
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludachris View Post
Sure, I agree they have to fight for their rights. But do you disagree that it will continue to impact us until change is brought about over there - thus, making it our problem?
Change will never come to mexico as long as the mexican government has the escape valve of the us border.
We owe mexico nothing. If mexican-americans feel for their motherland, then they can do as the irish before them have down....send money home to political (and terrorist) organizations to fight the good fight. But do not expect the amercian government to get involved in something that the mexican government and elites do not see as a problem. It would be a waste of time, resources and money.

I am sorry, but I do not buy into the view that mexicans are stupid, lazy and/or complacent. If they were really sick of their situation, they would change it. They aren't sick enough at this point, and never will be as long as illegal immigration is a viable option.
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:09 PM
 
Location: London UK & Florida USA
7,922 posts, read 7,624,869 times
Reputation: 2035
Tell me One reason why Mexicans cannot sort themselves out in their own country and why America has to solve a problem that Mexico has created?
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Old 09-06-2008, 05:19 PM
 
Location: CO
1,599 posts, read 3,008,641 times
Reputation: 488
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro View Post
Tell me One reason why Mexicans cannot sort themselves out in their own country and why America has to solve a problem that Mexico has created?
Why can't they? People with money and power don't usually want to allow change that would take that away from them.

And there's no real reason America 'should' help except that we could benefit from it later, and the fact that it has a negative impact on us now. But you're right, we don't have to do anything.
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:31 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,826,194 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludachris View Post
Wow... having babies for "personal gain". You sure do have a harsh view of these people, that's for sure. Here I thought they were having babies to have a family, and yes, they probably also wanted their child to have the same rights as you and I so that they can be better off when they grow up. Similar to why I work so hard, so that my daughter can have so many things I didn't. But to think they're only having kids for personal gain....

I guess the fact that I grew up with very little might give me a slightly different perspective than some here. I benefited from the American Dream and I am grateful for the opportunities. I guess I just don't feel the overwhelming sense of entitlement just because my family has been here for over a hundred years that some obviously feel. I tend to have more compassion for those who are struggling and are doing whatever they can for their family, no matter what their citizenship. Not that I think it's okay to break immigration laws, but I guess it's easier for me to understand why they do it without thinking immediately casting them off as criminals.

And I don't think they come here solely to have babies for personal gain or to suck us dry. That's such a horrible way to view it. Seriously. How are you able to draw such a distinct line between a US citizen and another human being? The term "anchor babies" is thrown around here so easily, with no regard. It's amazing to me. But I guess I shouldn't be all that surprised. Not that I think priority should be given to a non-citizen, but to not care at all just seems extremely harsh. I guess this is no different than what man has always done in the past.

I am proud to be an American, and part of what makes me proud is our history of compassion and strength. I do care about getting our citizens to work and getting them health care, and getting them educated. But I don't think that just completely discarding other human beings lives is the only way to achieve that.

In any event, some of you will think I'm crazy or a bleeding heart, I'm sure. Just as I think some might be blinded with anger and maybe a hint of arrogance and a sense of entitlement. But I truly believe there is a solution that can favor most involved. And I don't think everyone has to be deported to improve things. We will have to agree to disagree on a few points, no doubt. This is a divisive issue and some people have extremely harsh views. I came in to this forum to try and learn and understand some of those views. It was good debating with some of you and I've learned a good amount from everyone.

Thanks for keeping it civil for the most part, even when you disagreed with my comments. At least we didn't get too much into personal attacks, which I've seen happen so often with this subject.

Cheers.
Reality is often harsh and vile. It is not simply my “opinion” that many come here for the sole purpose of giving birth to a U.S. citizen, it is indeed a fact. Contrary to your ‘compassionate’ belief, not all illegal aliens are paragons of virtue.

I have also attained the “American Dream.” However, I did not feel entitled to anything, and worked hard for everything I have. Although I was not raised in poverty, I too feel compassion for others less fortunate; and don’t believe having a comfortable lifestyle precludes the ability to empathize. Nor do I believe an impoverished background is a prerequisite for having a kind heart.

My race suffered in this country. However, we did not flee to another country in search of a better life. Nor did our government enter into an agreement with a foreign country to rid itself of the black underclass and criminal element. I do not believe anyone should enter this country illegally and expect and demand to be treated as though they have a right to be here………..because they don’t.

The fact that I vehemently oppose illegal immigration and the abuse and manipulation of the 14th Amendment, does not equate to being a mean-spirited or racist person. You, and no one else, will convince me otherwise.

The citizens of this country are not guilty of “discarding” illegal aliens. They have been discarded by their own governments. It is they who deserve to be vilified, not us.

We are both compassionate people. However, you have more compassion for illegal aliens, and I have more compassion for the citizens of this country who are unemployed, underemployed, victims of identity theft, victims and families of violent crimes........all due to massive illegal immigration. I feel no guilt for my position.

It’s bad enough that our government permitted Castro to dump his deranged and miscreants onto our shores and into the pockets of hard-working citizens. Now, we have essentially allowed Mexico to do the same. Which country will be next in line to abuse U.S. taxpayers? How much “compassion” should we be expected to have? When will the citizens of this country be on the receiving end of compassion?

Cheers, right back at ya!
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:36 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 853,847 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
My race suffered in this country. However, we did not flee to another country in search of a better life. Nor did our government enter into an agreement with a foreign country to rid itself of the black underclass and criminal element. I do not believe anyone should enter this country illegally and expect and demand to be treated as though they have a right to be here………..because they don’t.
Actually some did. Ever heard of the Back to Africa movement?
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:39 PM
 
7,020 posts, read 9,904,513 times
Reputation: 1094
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Reality is often harsh and vile. It is not simply my “opinion” that many come here for the sole purpose of giving birth to a U.S. citizen, it is indeed a fact. Contrary to your ‘compassionate’ belief, not all illegal aliens are paragons of virtue.

I have also attained the “American Dream.” However, I did not feel entitled to anything, and worked hard for everything I have. Although I was not raised in poverty, I too feel compassion for others less fortunate; and don’t believe having a comfortable lifestyle precludes the ability to empathize. Nor do I believe an impoverished background is a prerequisite for having a kind heart.

My race suffered in this country. However, we did not flee to another country in search of a better life. Nor did our government enter into an agreement with a foreign country to rid itself of the black underclass and criminal element. I do not believe anyone should enter this country illegally and expect and demand to be treated as though they have a right to be here………..because they don’t.

The fact that I vehemently oppose illegal immigration and the abuse and manipulation of the 14th Amendment, does not equate to being a mean-spirited or racist person. You, and no one else, will convince me otherwise.

The citizens of this country are not guilty of “discarding” illegal aliens. They have been discarded by their own governments. It is they who deserve to be vilified, not us.

We are both compassionate people. However, you have more compassion for illegal aliens, and I have more compassion for the citizens of this country who are unemployed, underemployed, victims of identity theft, victims and families of violent crimes........all due to massive illegal immigration. I feel no guilt for my position.

It’s bad enough that our government permitted Castro to dump his deranged and miscreants onto our shores and into the pockets of hard-working citizens. Now, we have essentially allowed Mexico to do the same. Which country will be next in line to abuse U.S. taxpayers? How much “compassion” should we be expected to have? When will the citizens of this country be on the receiving end of compassion?

Cheers, right back at ya!
Thank you for sharing your story and opinions all of which are very similiar to mine.

Those who have compassion for the undeserving, seem to negate the fact that the majority of those here illegally are arrogant, racist, self absorbed criminals who have no problem flaunting the fact that they revel in taking America's kindness for weakness.
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:40 PM
 
1,417 posts, read 853,847 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Those who have compassion for the undeserving, seem to negate the fact that those here illegally are arrogant, self absorbed criminals who have no problem flaunting the fact that they revel in taking America's kindness for weakness
I guess the Government isn't doing its job then is it?
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:46 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,826,194 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Californio View Post
Actually some did. Ever heard of the Back to Africa movement?
Please don’t tell me you are comparing a handful of people searching for an identity, to millions of illegal aliens invading our country. Once again, you are comparing apples to oranges.

Are you telling me that black people did not fight and die for civil rights in this country? Are you telling me that 20-30 percent of the black population left this country and ‘returned’ to Africa? Are you telling me that the U.S. government encouraged and facilitated this voyage back to the Motherland? Are you telling me that they illegally entered Africa and demanded to be treated as citizens? What exactly is your point?
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Old 09-06-2008, 06:49 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,826,194 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDubsMom View Post
Thank you for sharing your story and opinions all of which are very similiar to mine.

Those who have compassion for the undeserving, seem to negate the fact that the majority of those here illegally are arrogant, racist, self absorbed criminals who have no problem flaunting the fact that they revel in taking America's kindness for weakness.
You're quite welcome, and I totally agree with your comments. It seems as though only illegals are deserving of compassion. To hell with legal citizens.
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