U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies > Illegal Immigration
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-04-2007, 10:57 PM
 
Location: SW Kansas
1,787 posts, read 3,349,478 times
Reputation: 1401

Advertisements

I agree, it is the governments fault for so many illegal aliens being here. They have failed to protect our borders and have failed to enforce our laws.

As for desperate, oh ya, I have been there. I have worked 3 or 4 jobs at a time, just to survive. There has never been a job "beneath" me. I don't live in an area for picking crops so that was never an option. I have done everything from cleaning kennels to telephone solicitor, so trust me, I do understand desperate.
As for migrant camps, well, I actually know a couple that quit their jobs to do just that! They follow the crops and are loving every minute of it. The ironic twist to that story is that they met online, she immigrated (legally of course) from Canada and is now a migrant worker by choice! They still own a house here.

It's not that I don't see your point. I can only imagine how desperate your Uncles would have to be to leave their wives and children to come to the United States to live as fugitives and earn pennies to the dollar. If you read some of my other posts you would see that I do not condone the exploitation of illegal aliens. If you were to have a part-time job, and other members of your family had part-time jobs, and sent that money to your family in Honduras, you would each earn more than your Uncles are capable of earning which would allow them to stay with their families. From what I hear money goes a lot further there than it does here. I have an elderly Aunt incapable of working. She is not good at monaging the money she does have. We all help support her.

Wecan not continue to allow the massive numbers of illegal aliens to come into this country, or we will end up in as poor of shape asHonduras, and then where will we all go? Canada?

I think there are better answers out there than unlimited immigration. And absolutely do not believe there should be a blanket amnesty such as the legislation being proposed.

The fact is there is a problem. We have too many illegal aliens here.
The fact is, there are a number of poor countries with starving people unable to find employment.
The fact is, illegal aliens do cost the American taxpayer a significant sum
The fact is, it is very hard to turn our backs on anyone that needs our (the United States) help.
So is the answer that we (the United States) need to intercede and encourage government of poor countries to help themselves and their citizens?

Does anyone remember "Operation Bootstrap" (I think that is what it was called) where the United States helped Puerto Rico to help themselves?
And I think something similiar was done in the Phillipines? I'm not looking to be flamed here if I don't have my facts exactly right, I'm only throwing this out as an idea maybe everybody would be happier living with.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-04-2007, 11:02 PM
 
911 posts, read 3,200,617 times
Reputation: 176
Quote:
Originally Posted by UB50 View Post
I see Mexicans standing on freeway offramps selling flowers and oranges. Why don't I see others doing this? I see Mexicans pushing ice cream carts down the street in the middle of summer when it's 100 degrees out. Why don't I see others doing this? When I used to work in an office, we had an old Mexican man who used to buy fresh fruit and veggies, package it bags and sell it for $1 or $2 a bag to the people who worked in the offices who wanted healthy snacks. He used to push a little cart around with all these bags hanging off it. Why don't I see others doing this job?

These are not exclusive jobs. I'd bet your kids could even do them if they had the desire to make some money. I see a lot of immigrants doing these "make your own job" jobs... Why don't the others?
Those people should be arrested for "loitering" and/or "Visual Pollution"...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-04-2007, 11:12 PM
 
47 posts, read 114,368 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by chele123 View Post
I agree, it is the governments fault for so many illegal aliens being here. They have failed to protect our borders and have failed to enforce our laws.

As for desperate, oh ya, I have been there. I have worked 3 or 4 jobs at a time, just to survive. There has never been a job "beneath" me. I don't live in an area for picking crops so that was never an option. I have done everything from cleaning kennels to telephone solicitor, so trust me, I do understand desperate.
As for migrant camps, well, I actually know a couple that quit their jobs to do just that! They follow the crops and are loving every minute of it. The ironic twist to that story is that they met online, she immigrated (legally of course) from Canada and is now a migrant worker by choice! They still own a house here.

It's not that I don't see your point. I can only imagine how desperate your Uncles would have to be to leave their wives and children to come to the United States to live as fugitives and earn pennies to the dollar. If you read some of my other posts you would see that I do not condone the exploitation of illegal aliens. If you were to have a part-time job, and other members of your family had part-time jobs, and sent that money to your family in Honduras, you would each earn more than your Uncles are capable of earning which would allow them to stay with their families. From what I hear money goes a lot further there than it does here. I have an elderly Aunt incapable of working. She is not good at monaging the money she does have. We all help support her.

Wecan not continue to allow the massive numbers of illegal aliens to come into this country, or we will end up in as poor of shape asHonduras, and then where will we all go? Canada?

I think there are better answers out there than unlimited immigration. And absolutely do not believe there should be a blanket amnesty such as the legislation being proposed.

The fact is there is a problem. We have too many illegal aliens here.
The fact is, there are a number of poor countries with starving people unable to find employment.
The fact is, illegal aliens do cost the American taxpayer a significant sum
The fact is, it is very hard to turn our backs on anyone that needs our (the United States) help.
So is the answer that we (the United States) need to intercede and encourage government of poor countries to help themselves and their citizens?

Does anyone remember "Operation Bootstrap" (I think that is what it was called) where the United States helped Puerto Rico to help themselves?
And I think something similiar was done in the Phillipines? I'm not looking to be flamed here if I don't have my facts exactly right, I'm only throwing this out as an idea maybe everybody would be happier living with.
I guess its super cheap to live in Kansas because it isn't as cheap I don't think in North Carolina. I highly doubt that if all my immediate family, including me, got part time jobs we would be able to support BOTH US and MY ENTIRE FAMILY in Honduras (my family in Honduras is huge! Latin American families tend to be ). My mother and father both have full time jobs right now, I'm in college, and my brother in high school. With insurances and everything, my college tuition, and bills in the United States there is absolutely no way we would be able to support both families in both countries. You are right, money does go a lot further there than it does here, but still, us four, could not provide for them, and with so many Americans and Brits now calling Honduras owning homes in Honduras its only raising prices.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-04-2007, 11:24 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,715,030 times
Reputation: 1285
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaranda View Post
. I do know its against the law for them to be here, but MORALLY, they have EVERY right to be here, and I back them 100% hands down! They don't live with us so we are not sheltering nor harbouring them.
No. They do not. On what basis is this statement made?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-04-2007, 11:31 PM
 
47 posts, read 114,368 times
Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
No. They do not. On what basis is this statement made?
Yeah they do. They are human, and they morally have a right to be here because they are doing only what is right for them by providing for their families, who live in poverty in Honduras. If you would say they morally do not have a right to be here, then I would start to wonder if you had any morals.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-04-2007, 11:33 PM
 
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
7,731 posts, read 11,955,493 times
Reputation: 5939
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaranda View Post
Yeah they do. They are human, and they morally have a right to be here because they are doing only what is right for them by providing for their families, who live in poverty in Honduras. If you would say they morally do not have a right to be here, then I would start to wonder if you had any morals.
Then why don't we put U.S. money into other countries, so then they will have no reason to be here and they can back to be with their families.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-04-2007, 11:36 PM
 
Location: SW Kansas
1,787 posts, read 3,349,478 times
Reputation: 1401
Actually, it is pretty cheap to live here! I live in a very rural small ag-based town. It's got a quality of life that more than makes up for it's lack of amenities. Homes are priced from 15k on up, I think the most expensive one on the market right now is 89k. This is the lifestyle I am desperate to preserve against the onslaught of illegal aliens. I work at the hospital, so I get to see how the healthcare industry is hit by the expense of treating the uninsured. (no, they are not all illegal aliens). I get to see how it only takes one man entering the country, finding a job and then *poof* his whole family has materialized from nowhere. There is a feedlot outside of town that had this happen. The man was here legally, his family was not. Several of the women were pregnant. Two of them got in a fight and the ambulance was called. When we got there (I am a volunteer EMT and firefighter) the only one that spoke any english was a 14y/o girl. Nobody got paid that night; not the ambulance that picked the gal up, the hospital that stabilized the gal, nor the hospital that did the sono on her the next day. This happened again when an illegal alien rolled his pickup. He was DOA, but he passenger was trapped. We extricated him, transported him, he was stablized and he required extensive surgery. He has recovered, but has not paid any of his bills. Another roll-over involving two illegal aliens required both be transported by plane which is unbelievably expensive and nobody has paid any of the bills. So where I can see your pain seeing your family suffer, I can also see the threat/expense of having so many illegal aliens. These are personal experiences in a very small town in the middle of nowhere. It it is this bad here, I can only cringe to think of how bad it is elsewhere. If my hospital goes out of business, there goes my job and the job of about 95 other people. Is it fair to ask us to risk losing all we have for people that are not supposed to be here?
Or do you see it more as fair play, since Americans owning homes in Honduras is raising prices there? Can your family get jobs taking care of those homes? Why do Americans want to live there? Should tourism and the jobs it creates be encouraged? There just has to be a solution that will benefit all. If everyone keeps migrating north, sooner or later we will all end up back where we started.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-05-2007, 08:46 AM
 
Location: Colorado
10,017 posts, read 16,705,804 times
Reputation: 2091
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaranda View Post
Yeah they do. They are human, and they morally have a right to be here because they are doing only what is right for them by providing for their families, who live in poverty in Honduras. If you would say they morally do not have a right to be here, then I would start to wonder if you had any morals.
Where are their morals about taking advantage of millions of US citizens? Draining our resources, closing hospitals, breaking our laws? Only thinking of themselves? Thats moral??
Have you worked with the hispanics side by side. Many i have worked with dont realize I can understand them. The things they say about us "americans" make me sick. Taking their land back, we are scum, use as much as they can. Thats morals? Seems you are basing your judgements on your family situation, not on what others have expereinced, do you even listen to our experiences, or just right them off ?. Seems a little jaded to me. I am 37 , four kids, I have been around them alot longer than you, so have my kids, at the mercy of illegal and (some legal ) kids that hate white people because of their parents, and where I lived it was 70% hispanic in the schools. Sorry dont buy it at all that they are all here to just take care of their families, I have heard and seen too much to the contrary.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-05-2007, 10:35 AM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,715,030 times
Reputation: 1285
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaranda View Post
Yeah they do. They are human, and they morally have a right to be here because they are doing only what is right for them by providing for their families, who live in poverty in Honduras. If you would say they morally do not have a right to be here, then I would start to wonder if you had any morals.
What about the hundreds of millions of other impoverished, poorly educated people of Latin America? Do they too 'morally have a right to be here because they are doing only what is right for them by providing for their families, who live in poverty' or does this only apply to your family? If these millions of Latin Americans have this moral right to come here illegally, how are we going to pay for this? And who is going to pay for it? And how is adding millions of unskilled workers lacking a HS education to our population going to benefit the United States of America?
Many people on this forum come here because they are considering a move and want information concerning places to live. I don't think I have ever seen anyone looking for a neighborhood with a majority of illegal aliens. Nor have I ever seen anyone seeking out a school district where most of the students are illegal aliens or children of illegal aliens. If the illegal aliens are so very beneficial to society, why is it no one seems to be seeking them out as neighbors?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-05-2007, 11:50 AM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,695,138 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcaranda View Post
Yeah they do. They are human, and they morally have a right to be here because they are doing only what is right for them by providing for their families, who live in poverty in Honduras. If you would say they morally do not have a right to be here, then I would start to wonder if you had any morals.
What about the 2,500 children in Africa who die every single day of every single week of every single year from starvation and disease? Do they not have the moral right to be here?

The Honduras do not even make the top 50 list of the most impoverished countries in the world. As a matter of fact, compared to those countries, the folks in the Honduras are living the high life. Do your morals only extend to those folks whose poverty regions are south of the U.S. border?

You profess the moral high ground on this issue, but in reality, your post is typical of apologist hypocrisy.

The United States of America cannot save the world, nor should we be expected to. We have a substantial number of people in our own country who have been marginalized and hung out to dry, whose poverty level matches or exceeds many Latin American countries. Where are their champions? Why must we import impoverished people from south of our border to save when there are several million of our fellow Americans living below the poverty level in our own backyards?

If your desire is to help those in need, then I suggest that you take to heart that old adage, "Charity begins at home." If you feel that you must alleviate poverty in other countries, join the Peace Corp. or send donations to an organization which works to reduce poverty in third world countries.

Personally, I'll stick with organizations such as "Feed the Children" who work to assuage hunger, poverty, and need right here in the United States. There are plenty of Americans who need and deserve our attention and assistance. When hunger and poverty is wiped out in this country, only then will I consider turning my attention elsewhere.

Last edited by Kele; 06-05-2007 at 12:36 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies > Illegal Immigration
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top